Why Vermont's gay marriage law is good for gun owners

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NationalCCW

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This organization in no way supports, accepts, or condones homosexuality in any way. The ideas expressed here are merely an attempt to benefit gun owners through recently enacted laws.
There is a way such laws can be used to gun owner's benefit. A National CCW Reciprocity ruling could be achieved in the Supreme Court with help from Vermont's new law. Odd yes, but gun owners have been under attack for decades and it's time to take help from where ever we can get it.
The legal concept explained at the "scales of justice" icon at:
National CCW Reciprocity Foundation http://www.NationalCCW.com

Troble viewing? Disable java support on your web browser.

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National CCW Reciprocity: http://www.homestead.com/njccw/nationalccw.html
 
The homosexual agenda is necessarily anti-RKBA. That won't happen. Any citation of the full faith and credit clause will be worded to exclude any other application of it except for Leftist causes.



[This message has been edited by Munro Williams (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
Socialists require morose malcontents to support their claims of being the defenders of the oppressed, and militant homosexuals, instead of hiring lawyers to form domestic contracts, instead attempt to destroy marriage.
Heterosexual marriage made the whole conept of individual liberty as expressed in the Declaration and the Constitution, possible, and with it the entire concept of the Bill of Rights, etc. etc.
Homosexual marriage would destroy that.
Instead of two consenting adults contracting one with the other, with property rights, and so forth and so on, militant homosexuals want to destroy our civilization.
One of the basics of that civilization is RKBA.

They don't want responsibility, and RKBA requires responsible people.

BTW, Hitler's bodyguards were all homosexuals. Powermad folks don't care a damn. The homosexuals in the camps offended the homosexuals in the Party, and were sacrificed to pacify the conservatives who wanted National Socialism.

[This message has been edited by Munro Williams (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nralife:
Munro,

Why is the gay agenda necessarily anti-rkba? One would think they would have learned a lesson from the Jews in Germany and would want to be armed. Are they afraid of all the armed radical right wingers?

Joe

[/quote]

I concur with this.
Homosexuality is not the issue. Pro-rights is...
Rather one approves or disapproves of gays isn't really relevent. We need to bring all Americans to our side, don't we? As long as the liberals look at gun ownership as the heterosexual white man desease, we'll not expand our constituency.
One reason gays and women tend to vote liberal (i.e. Democrat) is that they think the liberals will do more for them. Even Bush has extended a hand to the "Log Cabin Republicans".
Folks, don't let personal prejudices or dislikes get in the way of our mission. We should extend our hands to all those who support us and convince those who don't that pro-rights is pro-RKBA.



[This message has been edited by Ezeckial (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Munro Williams:

Heterosexual marriage made the whole conept of individual liberty as expressed in the Declaration and the Constitution, possible, and with it the entire concept of the Bill of Rights, etc. etc.
Homosexual marriage would destroy that.
Instead of two consenting adults contracting one with the other, with property rights, and so forth and so on, militant homosexuals want to destroy our civilization.[/quote]

This is the single stupidest thing I have read all day. And, even though it's early, I have a feeling it will not be ousted from that lofty position.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>They don't want responsibility, and RKBA requires responsible people.
[/quote]
So, the gay lawyers that I know, the gay doctors, the gay mother of my two godchildren, the lesbian couple on Oleg's poster, and on and on and on -- by virtue of who they sleep with, don't want responsibility? And somehow, Mister Gangbanger on the street with his crack vials and 9mm is much more responsible because his hos are of the opposite sex?

Thanks for clearing that up for us, Munro.


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*quack*

[This message has been edited by duck hunt (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
Though i don't agree with what Munro used as his reasons, i agree with his assertion, that RKBA is opposite Gay/Lesbian agenda.

Their leaders are good-time rock-n-roll liberals who do not believe that anyone has the right to defend their lives with lethal force (you think i'm wrong? look at the Boston Globe Editorial page someday.) Furthermore, they tend to identify gun owners as the cammo-wearing tar spitting hillbillies (no offense intended) and use us as an example of the enemy.

Expecting the Gay/Lesbian agenda to be pro-gun, is like expecting NOW or the DNC to come out and openly support the NRA.

That's not to say that some (most) gays would like to have a gun when the maggots come around. But the point is that their leadership is fully against us.

This does not, however, cause us not to be able to use this as a step towards National CCW. What does is the fact that most states have already enacted laws saying they will not respect gay civil unions. I do not see the current Supreme Court ruling that this is unconstitutional, as it is, because they will take a laize fare approach for the short term.

~USP
 
To say that gays, blacks, Jews like me are anti-RKBA based on the statements of organizations claiming to speak for the who ethnicity or orientation or race is, IMO, incorrect. Of the gays I know, all are either gun owners or are neutral or somewhere between those two states.

Munro,

I am sorry, but I must disagree very strongly. I am not certain as to who Hitler's bodyguards were (though Roehm's end typified the excuses used to get rid of gays) but I am quite certain that US gays that *I* know are for RKBA. There's nothing in their lifestyle that bears at all on RKBA.

As I mentioned in an old post, I do see some properly butch girls dating around cowboy shooting and some very properly effeminate boys discussing relative virtues of Sig 220 and USP45 where I go to shoot. I am sure that many go along with the agenda of their organizations because they haven't a way of changing that agenda...whose fault is it? Read up on various pro-RKBA web sites and the several onelist.com forums: every one states that they had to start their own groups because they kept getting very negative reception from many so-called pro-rights organizations. When we snub people for something irrelevant to RKBA and then complain that we don't see many of them at our meetings...

Sorry to vent. Tamara could have said it much better.

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Oleg "peacemonger" Volk

http://dd-b.net/RKBA
 
Great post, Oleg!!

I could add more but you said it so well.

We don't need to enhance the perceived linkage of gun ownership to bigotry in the public's eye.

At a gun show, I saw a patch that said:

Kill Fags Dead.

Nice touch - if I took an anti to the show - that would help my case, wouldn't it?

As far as leftist causes, I wish some folks would grow up a bit. Support for the RKBA doesn't mean that you have to accept all conservative positions. We better learn that or we lose.

[This message has been edited by Glenn E. Meyer (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
This is a freedom of choice issue. I choose to exercise my freedom to own and use firearms, but I don't care whether others exercise that freedom, as long as they don't try to prevent me from making my own choice. Similarly, I don't care whether others choose to participate in homosexual relationships. Their choice is their business, not mine.

Anything that promotes greater freedom of choice is OK by me.
 
Keep this thread on RKBA issues.

Ther are other Forums dedicated to support/condemnation of lifestyles, and any arguments, posts, discussions or flames should be posted on one of those Forums.

Our mandate is pro-gun and pro-RKBA. Any discussions over such a sensitive and charged issue as gay lifestyles tie up our bandwidth and serve only as flame-fodder.

As long as this thread remains tied in with RKBA, I'll let it stay. As soon as it devolves, it gets whacked.

LawDog

[This message has been edited by LawDog (edited May 09, 2000).]
 
For those of you with time on their hands, do a search in http://glocktalk.com general forum for this topic. They had it hashed out several times and I recall Tamara and a couple of others made very good observations on the issue.
 
Gorthaur, Agreed

The only ones who think there is are the racist, idiot Kristians like Pat Robertson and his socialist buddy Pat Bucannon.
 
You guys realize that you're all giving my flinch control one hell of a workout, dontcha?

Friendly(?) advice from yer Uncle Fitz: let this horse die.
 
Gays and lesbians are not anti RKBA. As with the rest of society, there are those would pursue shooting sports, and the RKBA, and those who do not. Those of you who cherish the Second Amendment but despise homosexuals should keep in mind that your actions turn allies against us all, when we need them the most.

"Militant homosexuals?" As accurate a description as "gun nut," in most cases.

The "homosexual agenda" is nothing more than the desire to leave bigotry behind. Whether they can legally marry or not will destroy nobody's marriage. If so, then i suggest it isn't much of one to begin with.

While many with alternative lifestyles are liberal in their politics, this is usually because the right excludes them. (There are conservative gays and lesbians, by the way.)
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by G50AE:

The only ones who think there is are the racist, idiot Kristians like Pat Robertson and his socialist buddy Pat Bucannon.[/quote]

Thank you for the dripping sarcasm. Play nice. No one insulted your favorites, no need to offend other TFl members aka your allies.

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Oleg "peacemonger" Volk

http://dd-b.net/RKBA
 
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