Why no Varget for target??

S

Smokey Joe

New member
Am researching a load for the .300 WSM. Want to use 168 grain target bullets, either Sierra or Nosler. Have researched several printed sources, plus the Hodgdon website. Was thinking of using Varget as the propellant. All agree that I could use Varget with a 165 grain bullet, but all also have ZERO data on Varget for 168's!!

Gee, whiz! I wouldn't have thought that 3 grains of bullet weight, a difference of 1.8%, would cause that much difference. The "standard wisdom" is that you can use the same load for 165 or 168 grain bullets, but Hodgdon's website gives different loads, for example, with H4350, for 165's and 168's.

So. What to do? Any suggestions?
 
I would expect many other variables to "potentially" impact the load more than 3 grains difference in bullet weight.

The water capacity of your cartridge vs the cartridge used in the load development (chamber size, brass internal volume, etc.)

Different powder lots used

Different bullet bearing surface

Different distance from the lands

Different test conditions, temperature being the potential largest

So I would consider using the data for the 165 gr bullet, but dropping the starting load slightly due to the heavier bullet.

If you look at the Nosler load data link is for the 165/168 grain bullet.
 
Nosler--No Varget...

Jepp 2--Thx for your reply. I have the Nosler Reloading Guide 6, and checked that against their online load data as given with your link. The data seem to be all the same. And no Varget in either place, for the 168 grain bullet.

I may very well just use the 165 grain data. I would begin with the starting load in any instance.
 
One of the things I have been learning as I gain more comfortable handloading experience is that you don't necessarily have to take online powder data as law. They are a suggested starting, and more importantly, stopping points. During the height of the powder scare a few years ago I had two choices, try some alternate powders or don't shoot. So using several cross reference powder equivalent and burn rate charts I started experimenting loading non suggested powders based upon similar burn rates for the specific caliber and bullet wt I intended to load. Long story short I have had excellent success loading different than suggested powders from the mfg's. The key is as stated above start conservative and work up. From my loading experiences rarely do I find an accurate load at max published velocities. A perfect example is when I was loading 7.62x39 not much load data beyond 4198 , yet I had 8# of Benchmark (no load data for this combo) which is a slightly slower burning powder , started loading very conservative , and eventually found a great load. I also recently worked up some mild "cowboy" loads using Win WST shotgun powder to shoot through my 460 S&W mag. So it can be done just gotta do your own cross referencing research and start mild. I also use a chronograph which is essential for obtaining velocities when venturing into loading powders with minimal or no data. A squib shot from too low a velocity is better than blowing apart your chamber...
 
S.J.,

The main reason you aren't finding Varget data for the 168 is that Varget is on the fast side for the .300 WSM as you get to higher bullet weights. So nobody has bothered to work with it much in this cartridge at those weights. It's also the reason the top velocities you can get from it for these bullets are lower than most other powders recommended for it will achieve. Nonetheless, it is likely the 165 grain starting loads will work with the 168. It just won't be a stellar performer.
 
When you start with a new powder, case, caliber, ect.

GET AT LEAST THREE SOURCES!

Don't take the word of the first site you run across...

MISPRINTS ABOUND!

More than one guy has screwed himself,
Get three and work from an 'Average' if they are all close.

If one is WAY OFF the other two,
Then use the two that are close.

I've heard a LOT of stories about guys using 'Published' data to load,
Just to have a bullet stuck in the barrel,
Or have to beat the bolt open!
 
Check www.handloads.com. They have a 168 gr Speer using 56 gr. of varget. OAL is 2.900", Primer is LRM. The loader noted that 5 shot group were all under an inch out of a Savage model 12 w/ a 26" barrel. Lots of loads on that site to view. good luck and happy shooting.
 
.300WSM

With Smoky Joe's permission, I would like to continue this thread. If my questions don't fit, I'll start another thread.

I, too, have started loading .300WSM, but have looked for "light load" data. Not squib loads using pistol powder, but something between my 7.62mm/41.5grIMR4895/168SMK and a full house 62-65gr Magnum load. Haven't found the data anywhere. Does anybody have such a load already worked up? Gotta confess, I stick to the "old timey" IMR powders mostly, except for that newfangled Varget stuff:p

On my own today, I tried 47grIMR4064/Nos168grMatch with outstanding results at 100yds. 1" groups with no signs of anything bad, pressure-wise. Am I living dangerously, or on the right track?

Roy
 
You can work up the loads with Quick Load software pretty easily. The reason you do not find published data is because the manufacturers assume one does not want to turn a .300 WSM into a .308 Winchester. Ramshot lists load data for AA5744 @ 1864 fps.
 
Funny...ran into something similar just this morning when loading up early prior to going to the range.

When I got to my son's .308, I grabbed one of the boxes of 175 SMK's I had just gotten in off the shelf.

Except, they weren't 175's- they were 180's. Heck, I didn't even know Sierra made a 180 SMK in .308. Turns out, they shipped me two boxes of the wrong boolits.

Quick check on Hodgdon's site showed no difference in the max load of Varget for the 5 grain increase in bullet weight. His rifle HATED 168's, so I wasn't keen on loading up 100 rounds of bullets we weren't sure would shoot- but he told me to go ahead. His accuracy load with the 175's was a full grain and a half under max anyway (and we'd put over 46 grains down the tube before with no pressure signs) so I didn't hesitate to keep the same load with the 180's. Can't put enough Varget into a .308 case to blow it up, anyway...:D

It was too windy (15-25 and gusty) here today to put holes in paper, but he was still able to hit the small-ish 4" plate at 225 yards without a miss so it seems the rifle didn't know the difference.
 
Permission and...

Skyhawk 172 N--Have at it! I think I've gotten what I need.

Think I'll be loading my .300 WSM with H380. The Nosler #6 book makes this the most accurate powder they tried. The Hodgden annual, the 2015 one as well as my old 2011 annual, list this powder also.

Fortunately, I've GOT some H380.
 
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Thanks for the replies, guys. Seems that I (and my rifle) like the reduced load, so I'll stick with it. Easy enough to reset a scope to shoot full power loads if I have the desire to. Add 12 grains of 4064 and away we go. I'm not a competitive shooter any more, just enjoy loading and shooting as a hobby. Been at both for about 30 years, and looking forward to many more.

Roy
 
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