Why is it, Safety's

J

jaguarxk120

New member
Why do O/U's come with automatic safety's that go on when the gun is opened.

Yet autoloaders and pumps have manual safety's and the safety stays off
when the guns are cycled or fired.

It seems that a gun, that is open with the barrels showing is much safer than one with a closed bolt.

Just wondering!
 
Good question. Years ago when the SxS was the main gun, it was a big deal to have them with automatic safeties. I don't know why pumps and autos didn't carry on the tradition. Because I don't hunt and just shoot clay birds, and 99% of my guns are old SxSs, I fix them so they're all manual safety.
 
I would offer that O/U have immediately & naturally-accessible tang safeties as the gun comes up in the field.
Pumps & Autos, not so much
 
It would take some pretty advanced engineering to make automatic safeties on pumps and autos. Pretty easy with doubles. Of course it would be just as easy to make a double with or without automatic safeties.

Just a guess, but doubles started out with hammers which when down were essentially automatic safeties. When hammerless guns were 1st introduced I suspect people preferred them to be automatic.

At this point is just is what it is. I don't consider it an advantage or disadvantage.
 
None of my O/Us or my SxS have an automatic safety and they came that way from the factory; even several which are field guns and not target guns.
 
I can't believe it's such a big deal to some people. I have shot every type of shotgun, some with and some without auto safeties, in 62 years of it, and I have never missed anything because of a safety, except once when I did fumble around because the button was in front of the trigger.
 
I agree with Virginian; I've shot both variants for decades and it doesn't make a whit of difference in practical terms to me. I think the target shooting fraternity are the biggest advocates for not having safeties that engage automatically on shotguns but, again, I shot in a trap league for years and never missed a shot due to an auto safety-and if I ever did, big deal. Same for missing a shot at game when hunting-if I ever did, big deal (unless it involved a chance at a possible double on grouse :eek: :o :().
 
auto safety feature was mostly used on hunting/field grade shotguns, since most carrying shotguns then always had the safety on as per hunters safety rules.
it also gave one more level of protection from one going off on closing due to a bad sear.
some mfg'rs kept the concept. some didnt.
 
I have my Grandfather's Ithaca, which he bought new (and made to his order) in 1909.

He was not a duck hunter, nor a competitive shooter, he was a farmer, and that gun was his fox gun, and also for rabbits, squirrels and any other pests.

The gun has a rather unusual 3 position safety. Forward position is fire, and moves back to Safe when the action is opened. The 3rd position is all the way back, and the gun will fire and not go on safe when opened. Also, with the safety all the way back, pulling and holding the triggers when closing the action leaves the gun uncocked.

I don't know if he ordered the safety that way, but I have examined other Ithaca's of the same era that only have the usual two position safety. I do know he ordered the gun 26" choked Full/Full and with the stock to his measurements, because he told me he did. The stock has a bit more drop than is common these days, and comes "up" smartly when fired by someone who is not a perfect fit to the custom stock measurements.
 
safeties

A pump man all my life, only recently started shooting doubles. Both mine( very blue collar) have auto safeties. Not a problem afield, pain in the neck on a round of skeet.

I do like being able to break the gun at fences, creeks and the like, and the ability to plainly see if the gun is loaded or the breech locked.
 
I think that it was one of the selling points, for field use. We were taught to break action open as an added level of safety when crossing obstacles, some would even say to go so far as to unload the gun.

Having the gun automatically go on safe when you opened the action meant that unless you chose otherwise (took it off safe), the gun was on safe when you closed it, (assumedly loaded).

The 3 position safety where the 3rd position disabled the automatic ON feature was useful for those shooting trap and skeet, where moving around with a loaded gun didn't happen.

having the safety automatically engage when the action is opened is not a desirable feature on any single barrel repeater, where the action is opened and closed every shot, nor will you find it on double rifles used for dangerous game.

Many doubles do it, some don't, just seems to depend on what the gun designer thought was a good feature, or not.
 
I can tell you from my own experience, I use either a SxS or an O/U with no auto safety and when walking the chambers are loaded and the gun is broken open. using decent to good dogs means i have more than enough time when they go on point to close the action and get ready
 
Please note the Savage 219/220 rifle/shotgun single shot had a automatic
safety. It is a single shot, biggest pain when at the range.
 
Do note the Savage 219 single shot is a hammerless break action design, essentially a break action shotgun with a rifle barrel.

The Savage 24 combo gun is also a break action design, but doesn't have that kind of safety, it has a hammer, instead.

Personally, I don't see any problem with an automatic ON safety on a break action sporting gun NOT meant for dangerous game. The most its going to be is an inconvenience on a bird gun, or a varmint or deer rifle.

On a double rifle intended to stop LARGE DANGEROUS beasts (Africa, etc.) I think its a dangerous feature and as far as I know, so did the people that made them.
 
The 219 maybe a break action, but it is different from the 220 action.
A Model 219 action has the smaller firing pin for rifle cartridges.
 
The only SxSs I've seen without either a manual or automatic safety are "Live Bird or Pigeon grade" guns, and a couple of dedicated target guns. Maybe someone could say what common everyday SxS shotguns for small game hunting don't have a safety.
In shotgun registered target games if you leave your safety on it's a lost bird - no do over. That's why some of the O/Us and SxSs don't have a safety. Because I have quit hunting and just shoot clay birds, I have on all my break open guns removed the automatic feature and made them manual only.
When I use to hunt, it's was just easier to put the safety on when needed, than to walk around with the gun open and try to close it when a bird or rabbit goes by. With hammer guns you have two options. Load the gun and walk around with the hammers cocked or down. If down you have to cock them when game is present, or should I say cock one because it's pretty hard to cock two at once. Then you don't get a quick second shot. Or cock the hammers and leave the gun open, closing it when game presents itself. Sometimes though if you lift the barrels instead of the butt stock, the shells will slide back and you can't get the gun closed. I love my hammer guns but don't take them hunting.
I had a Ithaca with the three position safety I'd use for trap but had to quit using it because on recoil sometimes my hand would slide forward and put the safety back on for the next shot. I wouldn't know I had done this, and lost bird for the next shot. It may have been a good idea, but didn't work out so well for me.
 
When I use to hunt, it's was just easier to put the safety on when needed, than to walk around with the gun open and try to close it when a bird or rabbit goes by. With hammer guns you have two options. Load the gun and walk around with the hammers cocked or down. If down you have to cock them when game is present, or should I say cock one because it's pretty hard to cock two at once. Then you don't get a quick second shot. Or cock the hammers and leave the gun open, closing it when game presents itself. Sometimes though if you lift the barrels instead of the butt stock, the shells will slide back and you can't get the gun closed. I love my hammer guns but don't take them hunting.
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Imo, people who say they hunt for game with the action open on their double barreled shotguns have little experience in shooting at flushed ruffed grouse in heavy cover; let alone trying to get a second shot off-and that's even with having the benefit of a pointing dog maintaining a staunch hold.
 
My fellow SxS hammer gun enthusiast tried it one time and also went back to his hammerless SxSs. There is a high end custom manufacture in Italy that hand makes SxS hammer guns and you can order a sliding safety between the hammers if you so desire. At first I thought it was pretty stupid, but no, it makes sense for a hunting gun. Grouse don't give you any time but to bring the gun up and shoot. Sliding your thumb fore ward is pretty easy.
 
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