Why I won't carry a CZ75/85 pistol...

4

4V50 Gary

Staff
Just returned from the range today. I brought my CZ-75 and wanted to try out a new magazine which I exchanged with a member here. I'm pleased to report that the magazine worked flawlessly.

After practicing the failure drill, I decided to practice clearing drills and loaded my magazines with live rounds and empty shell cases. Performing Tap, Rack, Ready was easily accomplished as with a 1911, Sig, S&W, Beretta, Glock or Ruger. As the CZ has a smaller ejection port, it took greater effort to clear the empty shell than with any of the other aforementioned guns. Sometimes it necessitated the removal of the magazine (Tap, Rack, Rip, Rack & Rack) to clear the CZ.

While it may be a matter of practice, I find that the awkwardness in clearing the CZ a definite disadvantage over guns of the other makes. Of course it may be said with good ammunition and proper maintenance, the user need not worry about clearance drills - but why tempt fate? The firearm must be reliable and user friendly. The small ejection port doesn't do the gun justice.
 
Thats a very good point.
Would some Dremmel time help this situation? Grind the opening a little larger or bevel the opening in some way?
That was a problem with the older 1911s and it was often part of custom work to make that opening bigger...
I think the same would help the CZ75... This is a very fine handgun... I would hate to see it disqualified so easily.
 
CZ-75/85s-

Greetings all from beautiful Los
Anchorage, in my point of view Gary
you've gone a bit overboard. I'm as
paranoid as the next guy but in some
thirty odd years of shooting I can
remember only two failures with
factory ammo. One was with Speer
Lawman .44 Rem. Mag, it had a bad
primer and the other was Federal
Premium 223 that somehow never got the
primer hole bored. Many years back
Col. Cooper gave the CZ-75 a very high
rating saying it was 100% reliable,
I've not had any problems with mine
but I do prefer the 1911s. For what
purpose or how does placing empty
brass in the magazine duplicate a
probable failure in real life? Thanks
all, henry
 
I agree,while a big ejection port is better than a small one in general I don`t think the CZs is any kind of liability. There are LOTS of other autos with relatively small ejection ports such as the HiPower,PPK,Beretta Cougar,Sig210 etc. I`m much more concerned that the gun be 110% reliable in the first place rather than worrying that it may be 10% slower to clear a jam. Marcus
 
Gary. I'm gonna have to disagree with ya here too. I've never had a malfunction that I couldn't clear in the 75. Don't currently own one, but that was more of a weight and size issue there... the 5903 is much lighter. To tell you the truth, I never had a malfunction PERIOD in my CZ. I treat my 9mm's to prodigious quantities of ammo. Always the cheapest on the market. Never skipped a beat.
 
Henry Bowman wrote:
For what purpose or how does placing empty brass in the magazine duplicate a probable failure in real life? Thanks all, henry


Henry - If your pistol will chamber a fired cartridge case, this would duplicate a bad round (misfire, light primer strike:(, contaminated primer, etc.) stoppage. If your pistol won't chamber a fired cartridge case, this would duplicate a failure to feed stoppage. Both of these examples can be resolved with a Tap, Rack, Bang Drill. In some pistols a fired cartridge case will cause a double feed stoppage. This example is resolved with a Lock, Rip, Rack, Tap, Rack, Bang Drill. All of these scenarios can, and have, happened to all makes and models in the hands of people in harms way. These drills can be the difference between an AAR or a funeral.

Gary - I know where you're coming from and I'm with you Brother.:cool:
 
And yes, I don't recall ever having a jam. But to answer the question posed to me above as to why load a magazine with empty shell casings, to simulate a malfuction and to practice the clearance drill of course. It's good to practice these things and I didn't bring any snap caps with me.

Now, I do these goofy things because I'm a strong believer in trying to find the flaws of a gun or a system and then overcoming them. It's far better to do so at the safety of a range than by happenstance in a combat situation.
 
Hmm, interesting concept Gary. Any thoughts about the size of the slide and how that could come into play? I have trouble jacking a round in at times due to the size of the slide.(Gawd I envy you young'uns, I can't make a fist until 10AM these days without wincing)I don't carry my CZ75B, but I had planned on having it do nightstand duty in another 500 rounds or so. So far, the 100% functionality of mine has impressed me, even using my own experimental reloads.

FWIW, I don't see anything goofy about it. IMNSO, the goofy thing to do is assume everthing will go according to plan. Anything that impeeds(sp) the action can cause a failure, not just a bad round right?
 
Non-real life situation

Never in real life will your CZ have to chamber empties, unless you load them. Will your CZ reliably eject a spent round manually?

Regards,

Ledbetter
 
Interesting, mine wont feed empty cases at all while my Colt 1911 will. As for getting the empty case that is hung up,rack and tilt works just fine.:)
 
I understand failure drills but fail to understand the use of empty brass intentionaly loaded into the magazine. Used brass can have dinged extractor grooves, raised primers or even be swollen too large to chamber if from some other gun. There are several ways for Mr. Brownings gun to fail and most are ammo related, the only way I can think of having an empty casing still in the gun would be caused by a extractor failure. None of Mr. Brownings guns will work without the extractor, maybe someone will make a fluted chamber barrel? I wonder if the Beretta would function without the extractor? Thanks for the subject matter, you folks have an interesting forum here. henry
 
Seems kind of silly to me too. But just to see how bad you can get the perfect gun to screw up it seems to work. Its not that much of a concern to me as I tend to put loaded rounds into my guns, they seem to work better that way.:):)
 
Greetings radom, interesting handle there. The empty case thing has always bothered me, like I said I'm the paranoid type too. Since we've learned the rag writers tend to lie we all gotta do our own road tests on the gun we carry, the old axiom still stands..."talks cheap", so we all spend a too many bucks on ammo seeking our own indiviual perfect defensive firearm. You mention the "perfect" gun radom? The CZ? I dunno, I grew up with 1911s, softball and hardball versions with all the differnt calibers including the one serves all .38-45 Clerke. I've got CZs and have shot all the whiz bang hybreds from Glock/SIGs to the ultra trick IPSC space guns. Hi-cap 10mm's on Paras and H&K USPs were my answer to the ultima-ratio of personal defense until I carried the beasts around all day. These days I'm back to the 1911 that's self tuned, the Kimber Pro Carry alloy is my current favorite. AA-7 in custom loadings provide ample horsepower in the short barrel..you CZ owns do have a spare extractor and a couple springs don't you? It's late here, gotta fly,..henry
 
If you load your own try this...

Make up and mark a few rounds with no load so you could replicate your failure with a "whole" round. I think in most misfires of any sort, you almost always have a unfired round don't you? With my FEG 22 I have had an empty casing cause a misfeed but I believe it was with crappy ammo which altogether could not cycle the ammo correctly. But I feel you should try all kinds so you know what not to use, like the time my 22 became an full auto pistol with some federal gold ammo...
 
Empties, empties, empties. It matters not whether it is an empty case or a dummy round. The exercise was to practice clearance drills.

Last night I was conversing with another firearms instructor who made some suggestions which I may try later. I'll post the results.
 
sounds like a good idea to practice that drill, I have done that a lot with my 1911 due to the the amount of bum mags floating around for them. What I find to be the real stinker is the loaded round that does not chamber and needs to be ejected. In most cases tossing the mag over the left shoulder will cure that problem unless you want to spend a lot of time trying to readjust the feed lips. If you want a large port get a P-08 and see what that gains you.:)Better yet find out what is wrong with that CZ.
 
The only drill I use is the 'tap, rack, bang' drill. A little awkward to start, but I smack the bottom of the magazine, turn the gun 90 degrees to the right, rack the slide, and finally pull the trigger. Should take about a half second. After a few cuts and generally wearing the crap out of my fingers, I got pretty good at it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top