Why do i shoot better semi rapid than slow?
- Thread starter SPUSCG
- Start date
This is quite common in Bullseye (even taking into account the 25 vs 50 yards).
I think its mainly the lack of follow through on slow fire. Follow though is keeping the sight lined up on the targets. I teach to help with follow through as soon as you release the trigger, get back on target as if you are going to fire a second shot. What happens in slow fire you sub consciencely drop the gun. Problem is you do it while the bullet is still in the barrel causing wild shoots. It don't take much. With a 5 inch sight radius, a .0166 movement of the sights will move the sight 1 MOA. .0166 ain't much.
Now comes rapid fire. You don't have to worry about follow through, your rapid fire requires you to get back on the sights for the next shot.
PS: Before you jump on me about Not having to worry about follow through on rapid fire, that's a figure of speech. What I mean is you are sub -consciously getting back on target instead of dropping the gun as in slow fire. Follow through is important in slow, timed and rapid fire.
I think its mainly the lack of follow through on slow fire. Follow though is keeping the sight lined up on the targets. I teach to help with follow through as soon as you release the trigger, get back on target as if you are going to fire a second shot. What happens in slow fire you sub consciencely drop the gun. Problem is you do it while the bullet is still in the barrel causing wild shoots. It don't take much. With a 5 inch sight radius, a .0166 movement of the sights will move the sight 1 MOA. .0166 ain't much.
Now comes rapid fire. You don't have to worry about follow through, your rapid fire requires you to get back on the sights for the next shot.
PS: Before you jump on me about Not having to worry about follow through on rapid fire, that's a figure of speech. What I mean is you are sub -consciously getting back on target instead of dropping the gun as in slow fire. Follow through is important in slow, timed and rapid fire.
shootniron
New member
One thing that will help your slow fire, and rapid fire shooting as well, is to practice calling your shots (saying where your shot point of impact was based on where the sights were when the shot broke) while at the range. When you are concentrating on being able to tell where the sights are when the shot breaks, it will make you hold the gun on target long enough for the round to clear the barrel.
Try this on your next few trips to the range. On the first few trips it will be difficult but you will improve if you persevere. You will be surprised at how quick you will pick this skill up and at how your shooting will improve.
Try this on your next few trips to the range. On the first few trips it will be difficult but you will improve if you persevere. You will be surprised at how quick you will pick this skill up and at how your shooting will improve.
Stressfire
New member
I do the same. I can nail bullseyes all day with semi- and rapid, but when I slow down there have been times that I miss the paper completely (at 25-50 yards that is, missing paper at defense distance would just be plain embarassing
)
Part of it on my part I think is that I over-think when I slow down and get distracted from the shot by rechecking my positioning, ie what stance am I in, straighten elbow, focus on fron sight, etc
)Part of it on my part I think is that I over-think when I slow down and get distracted from the shot by rechecking my positioning, ie what stance am I in, straighten elbow, focus on fron sight, etc
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I think its the expectation of recoil and the movement prior to that recoil AKA a flinch.
During slow fire you are slowly expecting the gun to go off. You know the trigger is gonna break right about *NOW*. That little dip of the muzzle if right handed will take your rounds low and left usually.
*just before the expected trigger break you push the gun down to compensate for the expected jump*
To correct this have someone load your firearm with a snap cap mixed in. Somewhere that you don't know when its gonna be in the chamber.
In rapid fire you don't have time to mess up LOL.
During slow fire you are slowly expecting the gun to go off. You know the trigger is gonna break right about *NOW*. That little dip of the muzzle if right handed will take your rounds low and left usually.
*just before the expected trigger break you push the gun down to compensate for the expected jump*
To correct this have someone load your firearm with a snap cap mixed in. Somewhere that you don't know when its gonna be in the chamber.
In rapid fire you don't have time to mess up LOL.
Could also be what golfers call the "yips"
"Yips or the yips is an expression used to describe the apparent loss of certain fine motor skills seemingly without explanation in one of a number of different sports."
This usually only happens with slow, controlled fine-motor skill movements. That's why for golfrers it doesn't affect when they drive the ball or do a chip shot, but kicks in when they try to putt the ball.
Something similar affects musicians and is called Focal Distension.
Could be the same thing going on there...
It could also be just how muscles are. If I flatten my palm and move it from left to right, my hand doesn't shake during that movement. If I were drawing a line on a wall - the line would be fairly smooth. When I try to hold my palm face down, just hold it still - I begin to get muscle tremors. If I were holding a pen against a wall it would show a ragged squiggle - not a dot.
"Yips or the yips is an expression used to describe the apparent loss of certain fine motor skills seemingly without explanation in one of a number of different sports."
This usually only happens with slow, controlled fine-motor skill movements. That's why for golfrers it doesn't affect when they drive the ball or do a chip shot, but kicks in when they try to putt the ball.
Something similar affects musicians and is called Focal Distension.
Could be the same thing going on there...
It could also be just how muscles are. If I flatten my palm and move it from left to right, my hand doesn't shake during that movement. If I were drawing a line on a wall - the line would be fairly smooth. When I try to hold my palm face down, just hold it still - I begin to get muscle tremors. If I were holding a pen against a wall it would show a ragged squiggle - not a dot.
moose_nukelz
New member
I have the same issue, it just takes some time of really slowing down and shooting one round to get my group to tighten back up. When I go to the range the first few minutes is firing 2-3 shots quickly from the holster between 3 and 10 yards cold so I know how my shots are going to be if/when I have to draw during a critical stress situation. After that I go into single shot ball and dummy drills to work the basics, then on to what ever drills I have planned.
Not uncommon
I've witnessed this many times. particularly in NRA .22RF gallery competition. Often in slow fire, the shooter "frames" his shots, see a momentary perfect alignment of his sights and target then rushes to get the shot off during that sweet spot, often causing an errant round or flier. Move up to timed and rapid fire and there's no time to frame the shots, often resulting in a better group.
It's just human nature.
I've witnessed this many times. particularly in NRA .22RF gallery competition. Often in slow fire, the shooter "frames" his shots, see a momentary perfect alignment of his sights and target then rushes to get the shot off during that sweet spot, often causing an errant round or flier. Move up to timed and rapid fire and there's no time to frame the shots, often resulting in a better group.
It's just human nature.
Something that hasn't been said, yet
I think kraigwy has probably hit on the biggest part of the problem.
Threegun may be right, too, but maybe not. It's hard to know without watching you shoot, and Kraig's advice would help to fix flinching.
However, something else that COULD be contributing to your problem is trying to grip too hard with your primary hand. When you grip hard with your primary hand, your trigger finger cannot control as finely as you would like.
The reason this would not happen during more rapid, or even rhythmic fire (say one round per second) is that our muscles cannot stay contracted during impact. A friend of mine proved this with an experiment to measure grip strength during a golf swing. At the moment of impact (the time you'd think that your grip would tighten) there is a sharp decline in grip. Your muscles simply give way to even the small impact of the club head on the golf ball. It doesn't matter how hard you try to maintain grip, your body will react by letting go.
During slow fire you have time to reset, and if your habit is to grip too hard you may be doing that before each shot. During rhythmic fire, if you're focusing on other fundamentals, like front sight and trigger squeeze, then your body may not have time to over-grip before each shot.
It may not be part of your problem, but it just might be. As you're working on your follow through, and your trigger squeeze, don't forget the biomechanics that support good follow through and trigger control. Squeeze mostly with your support hand and let the primary hand focus on trigger control.
I hope this helps.
I think kraigwy has probably hit on the biggest part of the problem.
Threegun may be right, too, but maybe not. It's hard to know without watching you shoot, and Kraig's advice would help to fix flinching.
However, something else that COULD be contributing to your problem is trying to grip too hard with your primary hand. When you grip hard with your primary hand, your trigger finger cannot control as finely as you would like.
The reason this would not happen during more rapid, or even rhythmic fire (say one round per second) is that our muscles cannot stay contracted during impact. A friend of mine proved this with an experiment to measure grip strength during a golf swing. At the moment of impact (the time you'd think that your grip would tighten) there is a sharp decline in grip. Your muscles simply give way to even the small impact of the club head on the golf ball. It doesn't matter how hard you try to maintain grip, your body will react by letting go.
During slow fire you have time to reset, and if your habit is to grip too hard you may be doing that before each shot. During rhythmic fire, if you're focusing on other fundamentals, like front sight and trigger squeeze, then your body may not have time to over-grip before each shot.
It may not be part of your problem, but it just might be. As you're working on your follow through, and your trigger squeeze, don't forget the biomechanics that support good follow through and trigger control. Squeeze mostly with your support hand and let the primary hand focus on trigger control.
I hope this helps.
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Nobody wangts to ever say it but.....
When I first read the initial post, "flinch" came to my mind because we all have done it at sometime. You're good at rapid fire because you have less time to think about the loud noise that's going to come.
Threegun beat me to it, & he said it well.
The longer you shoot, the less you'll be vulnerable to the dreaded flinch. But it takes a lot of concentrated & correct practice to aquire good shooting habits.
When I first read the initial post, "flinch" came to my mind because we all have done it at sometime. You're good at rapid fire because you have less time to think about the loud noise that's going to come.
Threegun beat me to it, & he said it well.
The longer you shoot, the less you'll be vulnerable to the dreaded flinch. But it takes a lot of concentrated & correct practice to aquire good shooting habits.
NightSleeper
New member
Not trying to be cocky, but odds are you are "trying too hard" to shoot accurately when you fire slowly. You've obviously got the right idea when you shoot faster - get it to target quickly and smoothly pull the trigger.
Are you jerking when you slow shoot? I'm curious because I also show this same tendency. When I deliberately take the time to shoot extra slowly, I'm no more accurate (usually) then when I fire at a normal pace, say 1 shot per second. When I instead keep a steady pace while firing (about 1 round per second) my accuracy is usually much better.
In my mind, it's like I find a comfortable rhythm when firing at a steady pace which seems to aid accuracy.
Are you jerking when you slow shoot? I'm curious because I also show this same tendency. When I deliberately take the time to shoot extra slowly, I'm no more accurate (usually) then when I fire at a normal pace, say 1 shot per second. When I instead keep a steady pace while firing (about 1 round per second) my accuracy is usually much better.
In my mind, it's like I find a comfortable rhythm when firing at a steady pace which seems to aid accuracy.