Which 44 mag for trail use incl. bear

B

Bill357

New member
My question is which gun to buy:

S&W Mountain Gun in 44 mag, 4" barrel

or

S&W Classis 629 44 mag, 5" barrel

I would like to get some options on this, I am leaning towards the Classic with the 5" barrel. I don't think
that one inch will matter that much and it is only marginally heaver. The 5" Classic will recoil alittle less too making it easier to shoot. What do you think?

Thanks.
 
BillMD; I responded to your question over at the other thread. I'd say go with the S&W 629 Classic if you don't go on long hikes or backpacking ventures. Good Luck, J. Parker
 
Ok, my opinion is that you've got the right caliber and the right idea--so the particular gun doesn't matter.

You could just as well look at the Rugers and the Dan Wessons. The key is you have a heavy caliber such as the .44mag and you want to be able to carry while hiking or whatever. The 8 inch barrels are long and cumbersome if you are not specifically hunting with them. The 4 inch barrel is a good all-around choice, but typically not as much accuracy or velocity for reaching out there. The 6 inch barrel is a great compromise, as long as it also is not too combersome. 5 inch barrel is probably perfect for what you want.

But honestly, as far as the specific gun, which one do you like better?
 
I like your caliber choice, but suggest you consider a Ruger Redhawk loaded with 300 grain bullets.

I suggest Redhawks not from political reasons but because they are hell for stout and will hold up better to a steady diet of heavy loads with heavy bullets.

If it were my money on the table, and S&W was the choice, I'd go with the 4" Mountain Gun for ease of carry.

Doc Hudson
 
Greeting's All:

BillMD, I have owned Smith & Wesson models 29's in all barrel lengths that were commonly available: 4, 6-1/2;
I have no desire to own the 8-3/8" length, as I would
have no use for it.:eek: Currently, I own the 629 Classic
with a 5" barrel; and perhaps it's the best of them all.
If the choice were mine, this is the one I would choose.:D

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, Life Member N.R.A.
 
Well, Doc ... the obvious questions are: what kind of bear and what kind of trail?

I have both revolvers that you refer to. The MG was made for packing and the most comfortable big bore you'll ever wear. Weight DOES matter on a long, arduous hike. A stroll in the woods makes little difference and the 629 Classic 5 in. is the best all-around Smith, IMHO. Load either up with Garrett's 310. gr. HammerHeads and you've got yourself a respectable black bear gun.

Now Griz is another matter entirely. I recommend a bigger caliber: the Ruger Redhawk .45 Colt 5.5 in. with Buffalo Bore 325 gr. LBT-LFN or, better still, a Tarus Raging Bull .454 Casull 5 in. Best of all for serious bear defense, a short-barreled, big bore rifle (.338 Mag minimum) or shotgun with slugs -- with handgun backup.

http://www.garrettcartridges.com/

http://www.buffalobore.com/
 
WESHOOT2:
Would you care to explain if, and how, you are able to zero the sights of a Redhawk (or, for that matter, a Super Blackhawk) with bullets weighing over 300 grains? I really would like to know, if you'd be willing to share your experience.
Do you have to replace the front sight? Any superheavy I have shot at workable velocity has always printed 'way above the sights, and had excessive drop at range. Plus they beat up the gun, and the shooter.
I've always felt that the 240-260 grain (depending on whether it's jacketed or cast lead, and what alloy) is sufficient bullet weight in the .44 Magnum. They'll shoot through a deer, or bear. How much more killing power does one need?
---------
I carried a 7-1/2" SBH .44 or a 4-3/4" Blackhawk .41 while visiting bear baits, and felt well protected. My guide pard was carrying a 4-3/4" Stainless SBH .44 when he encountered a mama bear in thick brush while retrieving a 'sport' after sundown. His 240 gr. jacketed loads with W296 (AKA 'Flamethrowers') fired into the air in front of her nose, were good enough to make the surly mom retreat. If she hadn't, the cubs would have had to be orphaned: not a desirable outcome, but better than a chomping.
Another guide was taking pictures of a medium-sized blackie while his dog played tag with it in the open. The bear left the dog and chased the man, and he had to shoot it at three feet range. One .44/240gr did the job.
 
I shoot the Lee 310 gr. FNGC which I cast myself from wheelweight metal plus 2% tin. The bullets drop from my mold at 315 gr. I load them to around 1300 fps from my 7.5" Redhawk and I've had no trouble with the rear sight. I have the Ruger sighted to be dead on at 50 yards. I use the Lee 310 because I wanted a wider meplat than most of the lighter factory and non-LBT style cast bullets offered. When you go to a nose heavy wide meplat LBT style bullet, you need a little more bullet weight to achieve the same penetration as the lighter Keith-style bullets. I like having the best of both worlds: penetration and slap. When using this bullet in my .44 Mountain Gun, I back the velocity off to 1100 fps and use it sparingly.
 
.44 vs. .45 Colt

Old Reb, the .45 Colt load you mentioned has an advertised 1267 ft lbs vs the .44 mag load of 1400 ft lbs. I was wondering why you think this would be a better load. This is not a flame BTW just curious. Also, what does everyone think about the .45 Colt vs. .44mag in terms of a bear gun. I've been waffling back and forth between .44 and .45 colt for awhile now. This will be a hiking/hunting defensive gun.
 
I usually take my 44 mag vaquero with me in the woods. Its a nice cowboy gun and more than enough power to knock down big game. Grizzlies aren't a problem in Colorado but a 240 gr. jacketed soft point is more than enough gun to take out a black bear. Some guys prefer really hard cast lead that acts like a "solid", I'd rather have penetration AND expansion.
 
MSS--When comparing the .45 Colt to the .44 Magnum, we first have to level the playing field by loading the .45 to its full six-shot capability in strong guns like the Rugers Blackhawk and Redhawk, Colt Anaconda, and the Freedom Arms. The .44 and the .45 will now both push a 300 gr. bullet to 1300. The .45 now has the advantage not only because of its larger bore size, but because it is running at about 20% less pressure than the .44 Mag. This extra breathing room allows magical things to happen when the 5-shot conversions are brought into the picture. The 5-shot .45 blows the .44 out of the water. I personally shoot .44s because that is what I started out with when I was a wee nipper and it has never failed me. Also, it is the most powerful chambering in my favorite N-frame Smiths. I am however saving my pennies for a 5-shot .45 Colt Bisley from Hamilton Bowen. A more thorough discussion of this topic by one of the master gun builders, John Linebaugh, can be found on http://www.sixgunner.com.
 
fascinating stuff but...

OK, you got my attention. Let's look at off the shelf Rugers.....44 mag vs. .45 Colt with some hot loads. Can an off the shelf Ruger in .45 Colt stand up to the hot loads needed to bypass the .44.
 
MSS

The answer to you question is "NO". ALL the primary custom builders are recommending five shot cylinders in order to go past the 32000 CUP threshold needed to make the 45LC step up to the plate and be undisputed king of the middle magnums. And that is what we would be talking about! In no way, shape or form does the 45 Long Colt approach the level of power to lets say .445, .454, .475 or .50 and those ARE the next level of power. The 45LC does not even close the gap between power levels.

This entire thread make for some great baseball talk (don't mean to make it sound like a bad thing. These debates are good and very entertaining. It is what this sport is all about. FUN!), but in reality, it is all hairsplitting numerics that leads to a bias conclusion in favor of the author's favorite cartridge. And there is nothing wrong with that either. :)

Robert
 
Humm, bears, my friend that lives in Kodiak says that all 44mags do is piss bears off! He and his guide buddies(Salmon fishing guides) carry 454 Casulls. They swear by them and that round will knock a mulie on it's butt. just a thought. It is a little big, but you can get a Ruger or a Taurus in 6 and 6.5 inch respectively for around 600.00. 45 LC's are very good round also but that Casull sounds mighty tempting....
 
ROCK-n-GLOCK

This bear don't look to pissed off. It's Dead! Pulled this from Randy Garrett's web page (lucky fellow, these pic last a lifetime!). If I understand the story correctly, it was shot with a 629 short barreled revolver (not good enough?) and one of Garrett's 310 grain custom loads. Before 454 was even a gleam in the eyes of its creator, forty-four had already killed every species of wild game on the face of the earth numerous times.

At short range, a 44 Magnum will do everything the 454 can. You can only make something so dead and nothing can protect a shooter from a poorly placed shot.


3.jpg


Robert
 
slabsides,


I use Millett orange-ramp front blades on all my Redhawks and GP100's (except the 7.5" 357 Redhawk, it sports the gold bead front).

No trouble, low cost, easily replaced, and BRIGHT!!! Superb.

My heavy loads, while often over SAAMI (screw SAAMI), are normally NOT excessive, nor are they for everyone.
Not everyone believes the 240g is adequate for big biting animals....

Frankly, my personal choice is my 45 Colt with a 325g Swift A-Frame at 1300fps+. Or a CP 335g WLN....
...or being someplace else LOL.
 
Well I have been following with great interest. For a buddy of mine is having bear problems. But Robert's last post sorta sums it all up.
 
41MagFan(Robert),
I wasn't flamming the 44Mag or any other cal for that matter. Was just relaying info from my friend who lives in "Bear" country and has been there! I agree, any cal when placed properly can kill big animals......But if I had the choice against Bear ahead of time, I personally would go with the bigger is better theory. 44 Mag can do some serious whoop ass, but so can 454 Casull or 45 LC or a host of others.

Now if I could just get that 300 Win Mag in 6 shot wheel gun! I would have much more confidence against bears! And a sore arm I'm sure......
 
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