When will we talk about Parental Responsibility?

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Doc Holliday 1950

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I wrote this to another post in this section. I think it's very important to discuss this.

" Now that we've kicked the can around on the age and maturity of young adults buying any weapons or taking their parents weapons. Let's talk about the responsibility that the parents of many of the school/other mass killings have or any shooting where the shooter uses a relative's weapon.

All of the people that I know that have weapons and have children or young adults living at home with weapons have gun safes that can only be opened by the parent or parents.

Some of these mass killings at schools would not have happened if the parents had locked their weapons up. My father never let on to me that he kept his 45
semi-automatic pistol from WW2 locked in a safe in our home. It was only after I joined my home town Police Force(at 21 years old) as an AuxLEO did I find out that he had his 45. This is what I'm talking about. The responsibility that parents have when owning weapons and have children or young adults living with them.

All of our weapons are locked in a safe except when we are carrying and/or have one on our nightstands. When anyone comes to my home, regardless of who they are, my weapons are in a safe or concealed on us. Only 2 of my neighbors know that we have guns as we both go to the same range with these neighbors.
One of my neighbors has 2 young girls who they take to our range. They want their kids to understand safe gun ownership and handling of guns. Their father locks up their guns when they get home. This is just plain old good sense and parenting".
There is no excuse for not being a responsible gun owner.
 
Now one should have access to your firearms without your permission, its being a responsible gun owner by making sure that cain't happen as far as possible.
 
I applaud your sense of responsibility, and agree that all should exercise that degree of responsibility. In a couple of cases, though, responsible storage of firearms was overcome. It appears from news reports that the Sandy Hook shooter may have killed his mother to gain access to her safe. The people providing a home for the Parkland shooter had his guns locked up and thought they had the only key, but were deceived by the shooter.
 
I applaud your sense of responsibility, and agree that all should exercise that degree of responsibility. In a couple of cases, though, responsible storage of firearms was overcome. It appears from news reports that the Sandy Hook shooter may have killed his mother to gain access to her safe. The people providing a home for the Parkland shooter had his guns locked up and thought they had the only key, but were deceived by the shooter.
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You can only do so much, but locking away firearms will prevent children for example getting them and shooting themselves or a friend, both things have happened because of irresponsible gun owners.
 
Agreed, but both have happened when gun owners have been responsible as well. My point is that you decrease the risk with proper storage, but not always to zero.
 
Parental responsibility goes beyond locking up guns. Guns were more accessible to teens back in the day. Why didn't we have more school shootings?

Like a couple of others said, locking 'em up would have done little in Sandy Hook or Parkland.
 
Parents should be more involved in all aspect of their children's lives and set a proper example, but even that won't guard against those who are just plain evil.
 
For every heavily-reported case of a teenager taking an non-safe-kept weapon and becoming a mass murderer there are 100 cases of non-heavily-reported cases of a teenager taking a non-safe-kept weapon and preventing murder, rape, home invasion, kidnapping, theft, etc.

The real solution is getting the nation back to where it was society-wise in the 1980's. Only real solutions work.
 
The whole reason self-defense doesn’t sell to many people is because those people are terrified at the thought of accepting responsibility for their own security. They want to believe someone else will solve that problem for them - whether true or not.

I don’t think people who feel that way are any more interested in accepting parental responsibility.
 
Yes, many parents have neglected to properly secure firearms. The fact that schools are feeding children should tell us something about the state of parental responsibility today.

30 percent of kids are growing up in one parent homes. Mom can't work, be everywhere and do everything. Most boys from one parent homes do well: We hear about the exceptions. i was a Big Brother: i have a good grounding in the difficulty of working with headstrong boys. One boy i mentored is presently a US Army Special Operations officer.

i was a dedicated gun nut from about age 12. My friends and i traded guns all the time. At various times i had firearms my parents never knew about. Had fights but never threatened anyone with a firearm.
 
Had fights but never threatened anyone with a firearm.
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For most of us, physical violence was a dispute resolution mechanism, not a "Lord of the Flies" free-for-all. Used correctly, it can make bonds between lads stronger and gives both participants greater respect for one another. It's a social act. I had friends in school I made specifically as a result of employing that mechanism.

Murdering one's classmates is an asocial act. I don't pretend to understand fully the goings on inside the head of an in-school murderer; I do wonder if an element of the underlying condition that allows it is the prohibition of the normal ways lads can challenge one another and resolve it short of death.
 
Agreed, but both have happened when gun owners have been responsible as well. My point is that you decrease the risk with proper storage, but not always to zero.
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Yep, there is never a zero risk. Security is like the layers of an onion. Its a deterrent.
 
The whole reason self-defense doesn’t sell to many people is because those people are terrified at the thought of accepting responsibility for their own security. They want to believe someone else will solve that problem for them - whether true or not.

I have believed that to be the case since at least 2001. I was riding with a college guy from across the dorm hall and the subject of crashing into a body of water came up. My impression was he was rather frightened of drowning in his car. I'd though of it before so I practiced the steps needed to get out of a sinking car. He just declared "that would never happen!"

Violence scares a lot of people and instead of planning to succeed over it, they choose to deny it can happen to them. That way, they don't have to think about scary things.
 
The real solution is getting the nation back to where it was society-wise in the 1980's. Only real solutions work.
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I disagree, about the decade, anyway. The mass shootings with what have become named "assault weapons" BEGAN in the 80s.

1986 Stockton CA, Patrick Purdy committed mass murder at a schoolyard with a semi auto AK variant. Despite passing CA 15 day waiting period and background check TWICE. He killed himself, and the news media was left with nothing to focus on, but the rifle. This began the entire fecal storm that led to the 1994 AWB, and is still going on today.

1988 Louisville KY Joseph Westbecker committed a copy cat shooting at a printing plant. Even going so far as to send the rifle he ordered back, to get the exact same model that Purdy used. When police searched his home, they found a Time magazine, open to the article covering the Stockton killings next to his chair...

The trouble with saying "we ought to go back to..." decade is that no matter which one you pick there are horrible social injustices that people simply will not separate from gun laws.

That is, usually the first stop on the discussion. And the other side simply won't look any further. Say you want to go back to the gun laws of the 50s, and oh my gosh, you want to go back to segregation!

I'd be very happy with the gun laws of 1900 (aka "none"), but OMG that means I don't want women to have the right to vote! (and everything else that was socially unjust from that era)

that's what they'll say you want, anyway. And they'll do their best to shout down anything else you say...

Some of the things from the past are worth keeping, some aren't. Our problem is that so many of us disagree on which are which.
 
I found out too many years ago, there is no going back.

Wishing for the 50/60/70/80s is akin to spitting into a Category 5 Hurricane.

You might also think about some of the progress, children reporting adult molestation is no longer hidden, depression is being treated, we solidly know smoking can kill you.

What we have to accept is that as the 2nd amendment says anyone can own a gun, then the NRA pushing of guns ensures that not only do responsible people own and use guns, anyone can get a gun.

Gun restricted states can't stop the flow of guns from the fire hose suppliers in other states.

So, rather than beating our heads against the wall yelling its not fair its not fair, we should consider how to handle and deal with the situation in today's world and what its likely to be going forward.
 
RC20 said:
What we have to accept is that as the 2nd amendment says anyone can own a gun, then the NRA pushing of guns ensures that not only do responsible people own and use guns, anyone can get a gun.
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The NRA didn't alter what the 2d Am. says, so the consequence of "anyone get[ting] a gun" is both factually false and doesn't follow logically.
 
Too many kids are just a meal ticket for the mother.
Remember, "It takes a village". So the rest of us are supposed to sacrifice and give up liberties.
50-60 years ago we had the guns. When I was 5 or 6 I would sneak up to the attic to play with the M-1 Carbine my old man bought back from WWII (Never got to fire it.). We didn't have the drugs though.
A phrase I often heard in my youth : "You're not the only pebble on the beach."
 
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