What's This Thing? G88? Please Tell Me Everything You Know... Thanks!

Josh Smith

Moderator
Hello,

I got it in my head today that I wanted a Mauser. I went to a few gunstores and they all wanted around $400 to $600 for one. Nope. All had bent bolt handles, too, and I wanted a straight one, being a lefty and all.

So I saw this thing in my favorite gunstore. Said "Amberg 88" or some danged thing on it. It had been sitting there for the better part of the year.

The gunstore owner said he wanted to see it gone, and he'd make me a deal. It had rust in the bore but looked OK overall.

I called up a friend who knows some about these things, told me some of what to check for. I told the gunstore owner that I'd have to come back for it after doing some research as I didn't know if it would be a wall hanger or a shooter, though I do like a project.

He told me that I know how he dislikes old milsurps. I know... too much research to find their value. He also knows how I like a project and to make an offer. I told him I didn't feel right doing so because I'd likely insult him.

He said he was thinking 50 bucks.

Not to pass up a deal, I came back with "How about 25?"

"40."

"30."

"35."

"Sold!" says I. $37.50 out the door.

I got it home and pulled it apart. One dent, very little surface rust -- just one spot on what appeared to be a hood on the barrel. The barrel was pristine under that hood. I had been afraid maybe it was rusted through.

Happily, it was not.

I was pushing what looked like mud out of the barrel, and after liberal amounts of Fluid Film and bore brushes wrapped in steel wool, it started to shine.

Not the best bore I've ever seen, but far from the worst. I've seen worse bores on Mosin-Nagants shoot well.

Here are some pics:

DSC00129.jpg


G88 pictures by WabashShootist - Photobucket

Now, only a couple questions are of very great importance to me: What the bloody hell is a G88, and what ammo do I shoot from it? 7.92 Mauser? I wanna make noise! :D

Thanks,

Josh
 
Thank you.

I just slugged it four times to be sure -- it seems that the lead comes out to 0.310" x 0.316", but it's tighter at the muzzle.

To be sure, I took a 0.310" bullet (I reload for the Mosin-Nagant) and it just barely rode the lands most of the way down, then dropped.

If I'm reading things right, the throat was opened up, but maybe not the barrel, and the 0.32x" bullet swages down safely.

Or, I could be wrong.

Do I need to find 0.318" bullets?

Thank you,

Josh
 
That is just too cool for school. I would have jumped right on it myself for the price you got it at. Good deal. I believe .318 is correct.
 
The 88 does shoot the 8mm J bullet, which I believe is indeed .318. Do not shoot standard 8mm bullets in it as they are .323. Could cause some problems. Finding the correct bullets for it could be difficult.
 
The Germans had supposedly reworked all of their older rifles to be safe with the larger .323" diameter S bullet by 1905, but you still do run into a few that have the .318" bore. The reworked rifles have an S stamped over the chamber area or on the front receiver ring. US-made factory 8X57 ammo is pretty low pressure and reportedly swages down, or you can shoot gas-checked cast bullets. But please, do not shoot any military surplus ammo in it.
 
Hello,

I have reloading stuff on the way, including 200 grain 0.318" bullets.

I do not plan on shooting military surplus from it at all, not even the Romanian stuff that is supposedly safe.

I do have a new thread going in the reloading section on reloading for these. Recipes would be appreciated. Not too sure I want to go as low as Trail Boss, but rather I'll probably use Varget and its starting load, which gives around 2100fps.

Varget is also my favorite for handloading the 7.62x54R, so it does make logistical sense.

Thanks!

Josh
 
What you have there is a...

Posted by Josh Smith:

Hello,

I got it in my head today that I wanted a Mauser. I went to a few gunstores and they all wanted around $400 to $600 for one. Nope. All had bent bolt handles, too, and I wanted a straight one, being a lefty and all.

So I saw this thing in my favorite gunstore. Said "Amberg 88" or some danged thing on it. It had been sitting there for the better part of the year.

The gunstore owner said he wanted to see it gone, and he'd make me a deal. It had rust in the bore but looked OK overall.

I called up a friend who knows some about these things, told me some of what to check for. I told the gunstore owner that I'd have to come back for it after doing some research as I didn't know if it would be a wall hanger or a shooter, though I do like a project.

He told me that I know how he dislikes old milsurps. I know... too much research to find their value. He also knows how I like a project and to make an offer. I told him I didn't feel right doing so because I'd likely insult him.

He said he was thinking 50 bucks.

Not to pass up a deal, I came back with "How about 25?"

"40."

"30."

"35."

"Sold!" says I. $37.50 out the door.

I got it home and pulled it apart. One dent, very little surface rust -- just one spot on what appeared to be a hood on the barrel. The barrel was pristine under that hood. I had been afraid maybe it was rusted through.

Happily, it was not.

I was pushing what looked like mud out of the barrel, and after liberal amounts of Fluid Film and bore brushes wrapped in steel wool, it started to shine.

Not the best bore I've ever seen, but far from the worst. I've seen worse bores on Mosin-Nagants shoot well.

Here are some pics:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b191/WabashShootist/G88/DSC00129.jpg

G88 pictures by WabashShootist - Photobucket

Now, only a couple questions are of very great importance to me: What the bloody hell is a G88, and what ammo do I shoot from it? 7.92 Mauser? I wanna make noise!

Thanks,

Josh


You have a Gewehr Model 1888 Rifle. Also know as a Gew 88 or Commission's 88 Rifle. It was Germany's first small bore, smokeless powdered centerfire, magazine bolt action rifle. It was developed by a Commission of Germany military officers. Hence the nickname.

It was originally chambered in M.88 7.92x57mm I. It was a round nose load with a bullet diameter of 8.08mm / .318 in. When Germany adopted the Spitzgeschoß (Spitzer) 7.92x57mm IS in 1904/1905; it had a bullet diameter 8.20 mm / .323 in). The new round was not compatible with older rifles, and they had to be converted by deepening the rifling by 0.15mm which would give a groove diameter of .323. This was similar to the United States change from 30-03 to 30-06 Springfield.

Also the Gewehr 88 is in essence a Mannlicher design, though it is sometimes called a "Model 88 Mauser"; that is incorrect. It has a receiver with a "split bridge" (the bolt passes through the receiver and locks in front of the rear bridge); a rotating bolt head; and the characteristic Mannlicher-style "packet loading" or "en-block" system in which cartridges are loaded into a steel carrier (a charger clip) which is integral to the magazine, where holds the cartridges in alignment over a spring. As shots are fired the clip remains in place until the last round is chambered, at which point it drops through a hole in the bottom of the rifle. This system was used in almost all Mannlicher designs and derivatives, and while it allows for speedy reloading, it also creates an entry point for dirt. To settle a patent infringement claim by Steyr-Mannlicher, Germany contracted the Austro-Hungarian company to be one of the manufacturers of Gewehr 88.

At the time of adoption, the "Patrone 7.92x57mm" was loaded with a bullet that measured 0.3188" in diameter. In 1897, the German Army changed the specifications of the cartridge to use a bullet 0.321" in diameter and Gewehr 88 rifles made from that date on had .323" diameter bores. After 1897 most, but not all, rifles were regrooved to a .323" diameter barrel. However, this is a misleading statement, as the tolerance on the barrels ranged from .318" to .325" (8.07mm to 8.25mm). The more important change was a wider chamber throat to take the thicker brass of the new cartridge. Rifles with this change have the receiver marked with a large "S". Gewehr 88/05 rifles were converted to use the Gewehr 98 type stripper clip by adding stripper clip guides to the top rear of the receiver and altering the magazine. The powder load used for the Gewehr 88 is also less than that of any other 8 mm Mauser rifle, as the makers of the Gewehr 88 did not understand the great power of smokeless powder compared to black powder. Shooters planning to use modern 8 mm Mauser ammunition should slug their bore as there are four different bore and groove combinations found on the Gewehr 88 rifle. Ammunition designated for machine guns should never be fired in a Commission Rifle.

Many of the 1888s were given to Turkey allied aid during World War I. After the war the British demanded as a form of reparations from Turkey her rifles' bolts. Many 1888 bolts were destroyed. In the 1930s. Turkey was cash strapped and was trying to build her armed forces back up due to the coming conflicts. Turkey had the Czech firm BRNO make new bolts for the 1888s. Also Turkey took the rifles and repaired them as they saw fit. The original design called for a sheet metal handguard to cover the barrel. That is what the sights are mounted to. Many of them were removed due to the trapping of moisture and the causing of rust. Yours still has the sheet metal cover. I'd take it apart and give the rifle a good cleaning.

I also have a Amberg made rifle that was "Turked". Your rifle might have been a former Turkish rifle. One way to find out is to look for a crescent moon or arabic stamping on the receiver or bolt. Commerical 7.92x57mm loads from Remington are pretty safe for these old girls since they are very downloaded to start with. I would not advise using milsurp ammo. Use either the cheaper Remington ammo or handload your own.
 
Oh, I forgot to mention that your rifle appears to have been re-arsenaled to take the Gewehr 1898 Mauser stripper clip due to the sheet metal cover on the bottom of the magazine.
 
Oh, I forgot to mention that your rifle appears to have been re-arsenaled to take the Gewehr 1898 Mauser stripper clip due to the sheet metal cover on the bottom of the magazine

I was testing the ejection with a .45acp shell (empty of course). It's fine.

I do need instructions o stripping the bolt down. I got the bolt head off, but I'm not sure if the knob unscrews, or what.

Yup, you're right about the re-arsenal job!

DSC00148.jpg


DSC00147.jpg


The rifle you have used the en bloc clip like the French's rifle, but the Germans figured out it was a liability. They blocked the hole in the bottom and converted it to stripper clips sometime prior to WWI -- I think.

I happened to have some Mauser clips laying around -- why, I do not remember -- and I found that the two brass ones I have work fine, while the newer steel do not go into the guides.

Interesting, eh?

Josh
 
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