What's going on here? (Stuck bullets)

9

9mmSkeeter

New member
I have a smith and wesson 640 no-lock rated for 38+p. I've been loading 4.8 grains of Longshot under a 125 grain FP (xtreme bullets).

The problem is, I'm consistently getting bullets stuck in the barrel. It's about every 3 rounds. This last time the bullet barely cleared the chamber and the flat base was flush with the start of the barrel and powder (along with this yellow gunk) was piled up in the freshly fired chamber. I take a hammer and brass rod with me to hammer and blow out the barrel and chamber(s) respectively. This is how I know it's consistently every 3 or 4 shots. I was under the impression that bullets don't get stuck unless it's a super low powder charge or no powder at all. I've shot powder puff loads with other powders with no problems.

I've not had a good relationship with Longshot in ANY pistol caliber, and I don't reload shotgun...so I'm about to just dump it out as fertilizer. Wondering what's going on here as i meticulously weigh my charges. I may be below threshold but well within specifications to avoid stuck bullets in a 2.25" barrel. Any insight? Thanks!
 
I was under the impression that bullets don't get stuck unless it's a super low powder charge or no powder at all.
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You are under the correct impression; and you are experiencing such condition.

Most likely, there are a number of things stacking up. First, Longshot is too slow for the application - even if you were running 158's. Second, the 125's are too light and are moving before sufficient pressure is being built. And third, exacerbating the situation is the plated bullet. Most likely, your crimp is light - as is always recommended for plated.

The bullet is jumping crimp quickly, the light bullet is moving and expanding the combustion chamber, and all this is happening with a powder that is too slow in the first place. The result is very poor ignition and decent pressure is never building. You need a faster powder.

I wouldn't use Longshot for 38 Special (+p or otherwise) in any application. I suppose it might produce a fairly balanced round if it were under a 158gn jacketed slug, with a heavy - heavy - crimp - and loaded up to the max.

But even if I could produce a decent burning round, I wouldn't feed it to a snubbie. With a powder that slow, I'd want a 4" bbl at the very least; and preferably, 6" or more. But that's for another post, I suppose.
 
Thanks a million, Nick. That was a very coherent, well-thought, concise post and it answered my question. Wish I could give a million likes or rep points (even though this message board doesn't have them).

I'll probably just pull the rest (100 or so...eek :eek:)and chalk it up to wasted time :-/

Thanks again!
 
Longshot

I've not had a good relationship with Longshot in ANY pistol caliber
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I've never used Longshot. But I'm sure it's a good powder in the correct application.

Longshot makes big potent rounds. It's at its best in stout calibers - your magnums, 357 Sig, 10mm, etc. So it likes to be loaded up real good; preferably under heavy bullets, so it has something to push long and hard against.

Longshot has no place under light bullets in low pressure cartridges (e.g. 125's/38 Special).

Getting back to your situation: Judging by the bullet, I'm assuming your purpose is for range practice. For some perspective, Unique is the slowest powder I ever use for 38 Special. Anything slower is just going to create a sooty mess and inconsistent ignitions/performance.

I currently have some 125 plated Berry's FP's with 5.7gn of Unique under them. But I consider them to be something of a novelty round - just to have some muzzle blasting fun. Because of the light bullet, they are actually a little out of balance and don't produce much pressure. Unique/38Spl finds a much better home under 158's.

With my Berry's 125's (very similar to your X-treme slugs), my most common 38 Spl recipe is 5.0gns W231. It has decent pop; burns clean; and makes for a great practice round. And there's room to move up the charge, if I felt so inclined. This is what I would shoot if I wanted to get some range time in with a snubbie.
 
....4.8 grains of Longshot under a 125 grain FP
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Youi are not even reaching 7,000psi w/ that loading, and dumping [literally] 50% out the muzzle unburned.

You need something FAST, like Clays and/or TiteGroup, for that barrel/bullet combination.
 
I do not have experience with that specific powder, but what you describe is exactly what will happen with H110/296 if you have light loads or do not have strong crimp. There is a reason the manufacturers state to NOT download those powders! Since your powder is also a slow powder for heavy loads, I'd bet your problem is the same.
 
Long-ago before I loaded any pistols. I received some hand loads from a friend to shoot in my 38. The friend was just starting with the hobby of loading. I noticed a odd sound when firing the rounds in my pistol. When I went to fire a second round I discovered the cylinder was jammed with a bullet located between the cylinder and the barrel. As I remember I was lead to believe that the round had no powder thus the primer alone had launched the bullet to jam. I don't recall the presents of any powder. With that I can say that yes the primer alone can launch a similar situation as when powder dose not burn. By the way that was the last time I had some one load ammo for me.
 
If you are to use Longshot w/ 38 Special ANYTHING.. load to top of jacketed data. If you are in +P loads, so much the better. You should be running 7.0 gr...see Hodgdons reloading Center on line.


Blue Dot in 38 is VERY inconsistant. Very wide velocity swings


Some loads do not do well with the advice start low work up. This is one of them.
 
Everyone has covered the fact that LongShot is just no good at all in .38 Special (I have tried it also and my experience has me seriously wondering WHY Hodgdon has elected to publish data for it...) but there is another problem that nobody has mentioned.

Making horribly light loads (whether on purpose or by mistake when stuck with an out-of-range propellant), the flash gap of any/every revolver seriously complicates the issue.

When you have very, very low pressure...
Your biggest goal is to get that bullet out of the firearm.
And when you attempt this in a revolver, you now have a major pressure-release valve that knowingly and willfully bleeds off that (very precious) needed pressure.

A swaged or even cast lead bullet offers less resistance going down the bore. A plated or jacketed slug offers more. When you have very little pressure -AND- you give that pressure the freedom to escape in the gap between the cylinder and forcing cone... it will do exactly that.

Put the cap back on the Longshot and save it for some day in the future. Great powder for other uses and I get a lot of use from mine.

But never in .38 Special.
 
Also loose bullet tension in .38 Special cases can result in wide velocity changes. Even with appropriate powders loose bullet tension can cause blooper loads and even the possibility of a stuck bullet. Even a firm crimp doesn't help loose bullets. Some .38 Spec. cases have thin walls and some dies don't size thin brass enough to hold bullets tightly. Velocity "can" drop 300 or more fps with a loose bullet situation. Slow powders makes it worse.
 
MAY I ASK, SIR, where did you get the loading data you used that caused the problems you've noted ?

And so it goes...
 
Hodgdon publishes .38 Special data with Longshot on both their web-accessible resource as well as their annual paper magazine style load manual.

In my experience, the loads are erratic and unless I was stranded on an island, I will never make them again.
 
Making horribly light loads (whether on purpose or by mistake when stuck with an out-of-range propellant), the flash gap of any/every revolver seriously complicates the issue. You have a major pressure-release valve that knowingly and willfully bleeds off that (very precious) needed pressure.
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Yes.

I forgot to mention this in my original post.
 
I'm new-ish to loading hand gun ammo and longshot was the first powder I ever used because it was all I could find . How ever I did not use it in 38 but 45acp and so far it works pretty good for me . I was going to give it a try in 9mm but maybe not after this thread . I have other powders now like titegroup , autocomp , HS-6 so I have others that should work for the 9mm
 
Over an expanse of time, it has almost always shown to me that if it works great in .45, it works great in .38 and vice-versa, but admittedly, I have never found any use for chasing "performance" or velocity-tilted .45 loads.

I do love the Longshot, but not in .38 or .45. Just way too many terrific powders that I keep plenty of on-hand to use it there.
 
if it works great in .45, it works great in .38 and vice-versa,
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haha , I don't know if it works great , only that it works in my 1911 and that's with 230gr plated bullets . It's the only powder I've used so far in my 45 and that's only 150 down the pipe and another 150 on the shelve ready to go . I just worked up loads using 200gr XTP's and longshot but haven't tested them yet .

I have to assume it's the low charge and the bleed off the wheel guns giving the OP the problem . Would it change anything if he loaded the 38 up to +p charges or would he get the same result with more unburned powder .
 
Longshot makes pretty darn good .357 Magnum loads. They look, feel and mostly act like full-tilt .357 Magnum but missing some of the bullet velocity. (I base my assessment on the fact that Longshot-powered .357 will happily run my Coonan where the ammo simply MUST be solid to make that pistol shine)

And that is fully TWICE the pressure of .38 Special.
I think it is a losing game, a waste of time and energy and a waste of Longshot to try and get proper loads in .38 Special with it.
 
Metal God.. Longshot works fine in 9mm..some call it LoudShot. 9MM works in the pressure window that LS likes to be in.
 
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