What is FBI's standard pistol load?

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El Rata

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I know the FBI is now issuing the Glock 23 to new agents. What is the duty load for the Glock? What are its specs?

I know they're using the Rem. GS 230 grain in the SWAT & HRT .45s, but do they also pick GS for their .40s, remaining 9mm SIGS still in service, and even the S&W M13s that still might be out there with the old agents?

Thanks for you help
 
It was my understanding that they were going to use a special 165-grain Federal Hydra-Shok loading that launched the bullet at just under 1000 fps. This was sometime ago, but I have heard nothing new since.

- Anthony
 
I think that the FBI uses the Federal Personal Defense load, no?

In .40 S&W, the bullet is 135 grain and the bullet design is Hydra-Shok.

Please someone correct me if I am wrong.
Skorzeny
 
I seriously doubt the FBI uses the Personal Defense line of ammo by Federal. The reason being is that the Pers Def line does not meet FBI criteria for penetration. Which I believe is one of the selling points of that particular ammo.

I've read somewhere that they do use Federal Hydrashocks, but I would not try to state that as a fact.

Am I all wet on this?

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Dan

Check me out at:
www.mindspring.com/~susdan/interest.htm
www.mindspring.com/~susdan/GlocksnGoodies.htm
 
Well, the other night I saw Agent Mulder draw his gun, hold it a foot from his ear, and fire it stright up into the air to chase some wolves away from a body. Didn't even flinch. So I can only assume they're using some special hi-tech FBI round that is ultra-quiet.
:D
 
X-files...


I have seen Moulder draw Glocks, Sigs, Smith and Wessons, and a 1911...

I wonder how hard it is for the show to keep up with the FBI.. :)

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Every man Dies.
Not Every Man Truely Lives...

FREEDOM!

RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE
 
Hey, I've seen Agent Sculley with a PPK!

Skorzeny

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For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the supreme excellence.
Sun Tzu
 
Scorz - I believe that was actually a SIG P230 or P232.

I'd swear I heard the FBI was using Remington GS in their .40s, but I don't recall what weight... Somebody must know?
 
Scully has used the Turkish MKE, Walther PPK, SIG-Sauer P230, Glock 19/23, S&W 4006, and SIG-Sauer P228.

Mulder and Scully swapped around sidearms a bit in the first season, quickly settled on the P228, had a brief flirtation with the 4006, and came back to the P228.

Of course, this would be a good time to point out that Mulder and Scully are _not_ real FBI agents. It always annoys me when someone insists some bit of firearms trivia is true simply because they have seen it on TV or in a movie. :(

[This message has been edited by Daniel Watters (edited July 09, 1999).]
 
The FBI has made one thing clear on all their semi-auto firearms that they would be able to shoot the Remington Golden Saber Ammunition.
 
El Rata,

The FBI uses the Federal medium velocity 165 grain Hydra Shok as they found that the recoil was controllable for all agents unlike the full power forties.

I'm of the opinion they should have stayed with the 9mm and just switched to a dependable 124 grain load.
 
What?

Scully isn't real?

Are you guys telling me that a sexy, smart redhead with guns and FBI training and interest in crime-fighting and para-normal phenomenon isn't real?

I don't believe it.

Only two things in the world would make me disarm myself willingly - my wife and Agent Scully (okay, maybe if the SWAT showed up, I just might too...).

Skorzeny

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For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the supreme excellence. Sun Tzu
 
Had a couple of FBI types show up at a IDPA qualifier a while back. They kept asking the people around them all kinds of questions. None of their business type questions, if you were to ask me. Started talking to me and asking a question or two. I turned it back on them. "Gee guys... those Federal Hydra Shok rounds are awfully danged expensive to be shooting in a simple IDPA qualifier, aren't they???? " Uhhh Welll err... need to practice with duty loads... Ohhh... so this IDPA stuff is part of your training?? They turned away and left me alone. ;)




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Bubba
IDPA# A04739
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It is long been a principal of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully. - Jeff Cooper
 
Bubba, ROTFLMAO!

You crack me up! So those G-men were asking "none-of-their-business" questions, huh? Good thing you scared them off! ;)

Believe it or not, shooting enthusiasts exist even within Federal agencies. Did you consider maybe they were just trying to be friendly and meet some other shooting-enthusiasts? I know at my gun club we welcome ALL people to our misunderstood sport. Even those Fed-nerds.

BTW, FBI-issue hydra shoks have to be used up after they've been crammed in a mag for a few months. Then they DO turn into "training" ammo.

No flame intended here -- really. I've just been in those guys' shoes. I think we should welcome everyone to our sport!

Keep those feds at bay! :)
Regards,
JR1
 
I understand the comments that have been made by all. What I still can't figure out is, what the big deal is with everyone wanting to know what specific ammo any LE agency uses. Another thread would read what gun does X LE agency use. I know that some of us care very much. But whats the big deal ? Who cares ? (obviously someone does). There is no flaming intended here, just some observations/comments.

Personally, I do ask as a matter of course what the LE groups I work with use as duty ammo. But this is only out of simple couriosity and not to get an edge as to the type of ammo I should be using. Hydra Shoks, Starfire, GS, Silvertips, Glaser and others all make excellent defensive ammo. But it really is a matter of what brand your specific gun shoots best that will make the difference.

I hope (and believe) that no one here goes by the old addage that "If the FBI uses it its good, and its gotta be the stuff I use". I hav eseen all to many folks fall into this trap. Heck the FBI can't even make up its mind about what it likes and what it doesn't. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like every couple of years they completely change their issue/carry guns and the ammo thats approved for them. Me, I've been using either Hydra Shoks or WW Silvertips since they initially came out. I liked the reports that I read about these rounds and they function flawlessly in my pistols. I wouldn't care if Everybody in the world switched to Corbons "Most Bestest Brand". I'd still stick with the Hydra Shoks and Silvertips.
Rob

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It's amazing what a large group of stupid people can accomplish.
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Rob62 - I can think of three reasons, offhand, why I care what law enforcement is using.

1. I'm innately curious.

2. It gives one a good starting point on ammo selection. We must keep in mind that peace officers have different missions than we, and choose their ammunition for their mission. Yet, I don't see any of them using MagSafes, Triton (pre-frag), or such non-standard (gimmick?) rounds. Is that because they're not suited for the mission of law enforcement, or because they just stink? Food for thought.

3. If I'm ever involved in a shooting I can never be accused of loading up with a non-standard, "killer" round. For liability reasons, what the FBI uses IS good enough for me.
 
FBI duty ammo for 38 was the 158 LHP +P, manufacturer varies w contract.

357 Magnum was 145 Silvertip, now 158 HS IIRC.

10mm was the 180 Federal.

9mm was 147 HS, 45 230 HS, and 40 165 HS, and there is a lot of that still around. They piggy-backed a DEA ammo contract (and signed some new ones?) so will also be using the 147/165/230 GS from Rem too.



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I personally know Agent Moulder and he is deaf in both ears from running wolves off bodies. If I had my way I would cut back on the funding for the FBI and they would have to shoot reloads.
 
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