Weapon Mods

O

OBIWAN

New member
Seen on another board...supposedly from AH Ayoob files or something

In the example cited a Florida man used a bone stock pistol to defend himself during an altercation. After the incident police recovered a Browning Hi-Power (sound familiar) in his car, that he had NOT used to defend himself with. Yet he had disabled the magazine safety himself on this pistol. (sounding very familiar isn't it)



The Prosecuting attorney for the family of the dead/wounded perp SUCCESSFULLY painted the shooter as an irresponsible gun owner due to the fact he had tampered with and intentionally eliminated the safety device on his HI-Power! Even though the gun was not even involved. This guy went to the Gray bar hotel.

Anybody got any additional info????

Or a copy of the article they can scan so I can dig further?

If true, is seems like a clear cut case of negligence on the part of the defense....or else the jury was made up of the same people that couldn't figure out punch card voting:D

thanks,

Bill
 
I am always suspicious of these "Ayoob said..." stories.

I think he tells lots of stories to get his point across that may or may not include all the facts.

In this case for example, how do we know that some manipulating of a weapon is the ONLY thing that sent this guy to prison. There could be any number of things in these cases, but there is never enough detail given.
 
Exactly right....and why I want to look further

Personally...I don't even look to gun rags for firearms knowledge....let alone legal advice
 
Found this...not quite the same

Guns feb 2004


"I know of one case in which the prosecutor made a big deal out of a Hi-Power with disconnector removed being proof that its owner was reckless with firearms. This despite the fact the Browning was not even the gun involved in the shooting in question."
 
I believe the new Florida law does not allow for civil prosecution if the shooting is found to be justifiable.

The state's attorney prosecutes crime not a family attorney, as far as I know
 
Found some more

From Ayoob's column in the August 05 issue of Combat Handguns :

"In Case One, which I've written about in the past in this column, the prosecutors based their Manslaughter case arising from an accidental fatal shooting, in part on the fact that another of the defendant's pistols--not even the death weapon!--had its magazine disconnector "safety" removed. Their argument was that it showed he was the sort of reckless person who deactivated safety devices on lethal weapons. It's a trap you'd be foolish to fall into."

Sounds like it was an accidental fatal shootingthat they were trying to prosecute...that explains the attempt to make the person look "unsafe"
 
Sounds like it was an accidental fatal shootingthat they were trying to prosecute...that explains the attempt to make the person look "unsafe"
Click to expand...
Makes more sense and even seems like a plausible theory in today's world.

Kinda like when they showed that a girl who ran over two children had a history of speeding tickets even though she was not speeding when she hit the children
 
As a former prosecutor and longtime defense lawyer, I can tell you that the only way to guarantee that you don't have legal problems because of some idiot with some stupid theory about your gun is to sell all your guns and move to another country. :rolleyes:

There are no guarantees in the law. Sometimes the idiots are running the show. Sometimes they're on the jury (I live in the McDonald's coffee-case state). Sometimes the idiots win.

It's a good idea to be able to justify any firearms mods to a reasonable person. That doesn't mean that you will only have reasonable people reviewing your case or sitting in judgment of you.

Again, if you want to guarantee that nothing bad can happen to you because of your gun ownership, get rid of your guns.
 
Well said.....

Someone said the only wayto be sure to not to get sued was to come in second:D

Can't help thinking your estate would still be in jeopardy
 
I don't believe the story. I wouldn't believe it if I heard it roll from Ayoob's lips...I ESPECIALLY wouldn't believe it if I heard it roll from Ayoob's lips.
 
I can easily believe the matter might be raised

I just can't believe the verdict hinged on that fact...which is what is implied

And I hate letting half truths fester...there is enough bad info on the internet....we don't need more
 
Ayoob has an obvious agenda....making Ayoob look good

No problem there...he is a gunwriter...his livelyhood is related to looking like the guy with all the answers.

But just like the mainstream media...I am certain he sees value in sensationalising the details

My only concern is that letting anecdotes like this stand may lead someone to make what is arguably a bad choice

IMHO guns should go BANG when you pull the trigger...anything that stops that from happening can arguably be said to make them less safe...not more.

Intelligent people can disagree on that point, but it would be nice if they had factual information to base a decision on.

Whether it a wise choice can be debated....but it is a legal act.....and there are enough stupid gun laws without us creating more...even if only in our heads

So far...I am not convinced to put my MS back in
 
I personally wouldn't worry too much about it. I don't see what is not believable about the story, who knows...Lots of crazy things happen in court, and until you have the whole transcript of the case, hard to say what really happened.
 
"until you have the whole transcript of the case, hard to say what really happened."

Exactly right...which is why I was looking for more info...I hate to let these "urban legends" grow

I actually got in trouble on the other board for pursuing more detailed information...how dare I question He Who Quotes Ayoob


Evidently the open exchange of viewpoints and information are only welcome on TFL and a few other enlightened sites

Gosh I love it here!
 
How did anyone even come to notice that the safety was missing?


There's a point when some of this stuff truly becomes unbelievable.
 
That is one of the first things I thought of!

Get hauled into jail for an accidental shooting and the police start dismantling all your other firearms:confused:

As I said....this one smells

Wish I could find the original reference....and hopefully enough info to dig deeper.

Are there no Ayoob groupies out there???

The guy I originally heard it from seemd to take it as gospel

But he couldn't cough up a copy
 
The last thing I'd ever want, should I ever have to use a firearm in s.d., would be for a prosecutor to be aware of who Ayoob is. Most of what Ayoob writes could be used against an innocent person in a legitimate case of self-defense. Ayoob's writings and opinions are worthless to me. They're worse than worthless; they're potentially damaging.
 
As I pointed out on another forum

Use hollowpoints and they will point out that New Jersey does not allow them...even if you are not in New Jersey

Use an SKS and they will point out that they are only suitable for killing hunters in WI

Use an AR-15 (beltway sniper)

Use my Marlin lever action- no crossbolt safety

I just hope they don't check my mattress for tags:eek:
 
Thats me...FFA..(FutreFelonsofAmerica)

Seriously...I would love it if some Ayoob groupie had the actual details.....

( don't take that badly.....just hoping somebody saves this stuff)

My post regarding this actually got deleted on the other board (poor practice imho) because I dared question the legitamacy of the claim...the mod that regurgitated it as gospel was lacking in detail....

And I truly hate letting bad info fester (and grow)

We have a pretty "plugged in" group here...and the owner even lives in Florida...seems like we could run this to ground:confused:
 
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