Was I ripped off by this seller, or wasn't I ripped off?

U

Unlicensed Dremel

Moderator
OK, I got a stainless steel Ruger 77 (my first Ruger rifle ever) off of a gunbroker seller a few months ago (in .223 rem). It has an aftermarket stock (Hogue rubber).

The barrel was described in the listing as a 'custom 19" barrel' with a match chamber, and further described as extremely accurate with said custom barrel.

As a result of this representation, I paid a lot more for it than I would have, otherwise, for a similar factory Ruger 77 - really high, over $700 for this used rifle.

So I got to looking at it more closely awhile back, and on the barrel, on the bottom, hidden by the long Hogue stock is.... you guessed it. "Sturm Ruger; Read instruction manual; blah blah."

So what the seller (ahem) meant to say was, "customizED" rifle with a turned down factory barrel and match chamber (if it really even is a new or "custom" chamber - I guess it is since the writing on the barrel is now on the bottom instead of the side).

It's a close call, but I'd say yes, I was defrauded by this. Of course, I won't care if it proves to be as accurate as he says once I wring it out, but I really thought I was getting some "name" custom barrel maker on this one.

Just a heads up. Shame that some people feel the need to misrepresent like this. Thankfully, I find such things very uncommon on gunbroker. I won't sue or raise a stink, probably... but even on gunbroker, it's definitely buyer beware.
 
Sounds like they cut down a factory barrel and reamed a new, "match grade" chamber, whatever that means.

Disingenuous, perhaps, but DOES it shoot like a custom barrel? If so, it doesn't really matter whose name is on it.

Did you at least contact the seller? Nothing you can do but I'd personally be curious how they would respond.
 
YOu know you could have bought two Americans for that same money... :D

Anytime folks on-line start talking about "custom", I usually move on... I can usually find another plain firearm of the same model and have it customized myself, then I know for certain what went in to it. (Exceptions for Ed Brown, Wilson etc. if they can provide an invoice of work).

I'm the same with home-built ARs... I won't spend a nickel on one because it's to hard to verify exactly whose parts are inside it, and especially the skill of those who did the assembly.
 
I guess it is just me but if I were buying a rifle with a stated "custom 19 inch barrel", I would ask the seller for the manufacturer of the barrel, just as I would if it had a custom stock, trigger job, etc.

That being said, I hope it all works out well for you. Good luck.
 
Happened to me with a gun auction deal.
Rem. 700 BDL in .300 Win. Mag. for fair money, no steal, with an older 3 X 10 Weaver with A.O.
When I got the rifle the scope had been dented on one side, scratches covered over with grease, grease filled the dents, deep gash in the stock right under the pistol grip near the grip cap.
I was highly ticked at the obvious cosmetic cover up.
I called the guy, who was an FFL dealer in another state and complained.
He said " too bad pal."
So I left him a lousy remark on his feedback with details.
He called back asking me to remove the true remark and he'd refund me
$25 bucks. HA! I hung up on him and let the bad feedback stand which I'm sure hurt any further internet sales.
Were I you I'd shoot the rifle and if it's a performer....well, that's what you
wanted.
 
How does it shoot?

I wonder who did the work....most smiths would feel like thieves asking you to put that much money into a factory blank because it is only another $300 to do that work to a barrel that will shoot.

That said, it is customized.....by Bubba.
 
Right, it's "customized". What's it's *not* is a "custom barrel", which is the exact words the seller used.

I'll report back after I wring it out - as mentioned, no harm, no foul. If it's about a 7/8ths MOA or less gun, then I'll call that no harm.

and yeah, I definitely should have asked who the barrel maker was; that would have smoked out the truth. But I was enamored by the comination of SS, barrel length, stock, and custom barrel description (with accuracy claims), for the purpose I wanted, and so I jumped on it once I saw it (found it right at the very end of the auction time). Mea culpa.

YOu know you could have bought two Americans for that same money
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Well crap, I screwed up, didn't I? :)
 
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"Custom" versus "customized", or the difference between them, is a matter of interpretation.

Think of a "custom" 5.0 Mustang, or whatever you prefer. It doesn't mean there aren't stock parts or it didn't start out as a plain old Mustang. It just means it's been worked over.

Plus, "custom" generically means "made to order" or "one off". A shortened, rechambering stock barrel could well be considered custom.
 
did you ask where the bbl came from before you purchased it? I wouldn't pay more for a custom barrel without asking who made the barrel. not trying to harp on you, just curious if you asked or if it was mentioned in the ad.
 
You also have recourse through Gunbroker itself.

If its misrepresented they will deal with the seller.
 
As the old saying goes "experience is what you get when you don't get what you want." In this case you gained experience...

Tony
 
If they don't say who customized it and the parts that were used I generally either give it no creedence or if I am really interested I will ask the seller. Even if it was custom work , who did the work? Easily could have been the guy selling it with no experience and screwed it up, now looking to offload it. A lot of wanna be gsmiths. More so on the pistol side I think. But generally id try to stay away from custom guns if there is no evidence of a recognizeable gsmith. Hope it works out, I've had some stock ruger barrels that shot very well. What caliber is it?
 
If the rifle was intentionally misrepresented in its add or physically not as stated. By all means send it back. Other than that. If you chose to keep it. You grin and bare any & all there after problems.

I've over the years come to realize now and then there are similarities in sales technique when buying a FFL holders used firearm or a Use Car Dealership's vehicle.

but even on gunbroker, it's definitely buyer beware.
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From what I've read. Apparently you didn't get that Great G/B Buying Experience. Thus a reasonable reaction too and commented. (above Quote)
 
"Custom" versus "customized", or the difference between them, is a matter of interpretation.

Think of a "custom" 5.0 Mustang, or whatever you prefer. It doesn't mean there aren't stock parts or it didn't start out as a plain old Mustang. It just means it's been worked over.

Plus, "custom" generically means "made to order" or "one off". A shortened, rechambering stock barrel could well be considered custom.
Click to expand...

If you read online what is offered in various products for custom and customized, then the scope of the lack of distinction expands considerably and overlaps considerably, though BP's customized explanation applies nicely. Not only may a custom offering have some stock parts, it may have all stock parts, but simply in a configuration not typically offered. There seems to be no percentage of change that determines when a product becomes custom versus standard. Often we assume custom to mean somehow better, but that just isn't the case. There also seems to be no clear cut determination as to who or when the work is done.

"Made to order" may give the impression of being originally manufactured to non-standard/different specifications, but it can also mean "modified to order" after original manufacturing.

I cannot find any sort of legal marketing definition that distinguishes between customized and custom.

This sort of begs the question that if you have specifications that meet some manufacturer's regular product line, say you need a new 18" .308 barrel and Kreiger (a custom barrel manufacturer) just happens to have some in stock (so not made to order), is it a custom barrel? Obviously, it is a quality barrel, but no different in quality than an 18.5" custom barrel made for a customer that specified the order for the exact same barrel in a different length.

The barrel was described in the listing as a 'custom 19" barrel' with a match chamber, and further described as extremely accurate with said custom barrel.
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..., but I really thought I was getting some "name" custom barrel maker on this one.
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I don't think you were defrauded on the "custom" wording of the deal. The barrel was custom, modified to the specifications of the person who wanted it modified. Nowhere I can find that "custom" implies a special name. You may have defrauded yourself in that regard, so to speak.
 
OK, I got a stainless steel Ruger 77 (my first Ruger rifle ever) off of a gunbroker seller a few months ago (in .223 rem).
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It's a little late for the 3 day inspection period, why a 2-month wait before inspecting the rifle??
 
Because I'm a lazy lazy negligent negligent man. I thought that part was obvious, ha ha.

I actually screwed the pooch - gunbroker won't show anything beyond 90 days in the past, and my stupid cloud email deletes my "trashed" items after 30 days.

So it's mine to live with, regardless of whether it's a lemon. I was just wondering if people considered what he did "wrong" or "within acceptable limits of puffery."
 
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