War on Drugs

G

George Hill

Staff Alumnus
Now - before I rant on... I know of what I am talking about.
I fought (literally) in this war on drugs doing Drug Interdiction at the source. I have dealt with drugs on the street after they trickled down to the junkies... I've seen all aspects and all the ugliness involved first hand and it sickens me to the core.
Rant on.
It was mentioned that the war on drugs started with Reagan.
This is true - but back then and in the context and limits of what that was then... it made sense. Not much... but it did.
Today - It no longer makes sense.
We are at the point now where we were way back when we overturned Prohibition. We called the '20s the Roaring Twenties... Why? Was it just the memory of the "Flappers"?
Or was it the roar of the battles against moonshiners and runners? Maybe both... Speak Easys and the Mafia... The Catalysts of Organized Crime taking over American Culture.
Well, we have a new culture...
Roadblocks, Hoods, Crips and Bloods, Carjacking, Raids, Government sponsored needle and condom distribution...
I am not condoning these things... but these things are symptoms of the illness.
I am of the opinion that we need to legalize drugs in a fashion that we can control the illness and reduce the symptoms.
Our Bill of Rights are totally out the window for the sake of the war on drugs. This is not acceptable. Just because there is a Crack Whore in Chicago - doesnt mean I should be stopped and searched in Sycamore. (little town outside of Chicago... this happened)
By just one phone call - Any house in the US could be raided. Your family thrown to the floor with guns in there backs and handcuffed like criminals. Property damaged and loved ones killed with no responsability...
The assault is not on drugs... but on our rights.
It's time for this to end.
The war on drugs is a failure. We need a new approach.

Any ideas?
 
First...decriminalize marijuana.
Second...Re-alocate funds for MORE education
and REHAB clinics.
 
The Bill of Rights should be maintained.

If verifiable, scientific experimentation finds a medical use for dope, then document the uses and prescribe the dope as you would any other drug.

Unlawful drugs should remain unlawful.

LawDog
 
George,
We need to decriminalize drugs and fight the battle by stigmatizing their use. Look at the strides we have made against drunk driving in the past 15 years.

It seems that our grandparents had the guts to see what the "noble experiment" of prohibition was doing to our society and repeal it. We should have the same nerve.

Lets keep up the drug testing in the workplace, lets continue to put a social cost for drug use. But lets decriminalize it. I for one, have given up all the rights I care to, so that I can be sure that Joe down the street doesn't do a joint on Friday night.

Let me say that I will still enforce the laws. I will still look down on people that use drugs and do my best to discourage them. I won't use them myself or tolerate there presence in my home. But I won't give up any more of the Bill of Rights in the name of fighting them.

Jeff
 
Agreed on REHAB!

Rehab...sound a little bleeding heart liberalistic? Maybe, but apparently it works. I'm fuzzy on the details, but a few communties have offered first time, non-violent drug offenders a choice between prison and comprehensive rehab programs. The rehab-ers go straight at a much higher rate than those who choose jail time (who, by their choice, may just want to be criminals, who knows...)

Prisons have not, do not, and will not solve the drug problem. Ever. Address the physiological/pyschological issues, and you've won most of the battle.
 
My opinion is that drugs should be as available as alcohol.
If you want to use drugs, that is your business. If you want to destroy your life with drugs, that is your business. Most of the violence and crime behind drug use comes from the gvmt prohibition against it.

Educate your children the same way you would for alcohol.

Freedom is freedom. The same freedoms exists to make mistakes as those to act responsibly. If we proclaim to be a free society, then we should sack up and take the responsibilities that go with it.

Ken
 
My opinion is that drugs should be as available as alcohol.

If you want to use drugs, that is your business. If you want to destroy your life with drugs, that is your business. Most of the violence and crime behind drug use comes from the gvmt prohibition against it.
Click to expand...

Y'all do some history research. Back around the turn of the century, cocaine; marijuana; heroine; etc. were not illegal and we didn't have the drug problem(s) we see today. Heck, you could go into any pharmacy and get these over the counter!

You ever wonder why they are called Dr. Pepper; Pepsi; Coca-Cola??? Hmmmm?

KenPaul is right. The real problems started when the Feds (in their infinite wisdom) made this stuff illegal.
 
I agree with Antipitas. George Washington grew opium and hemp. Now he wasn't an addict, but the opium eased the pain from his dentures and hemp is a very strong natural fiber. I believe that drugs, just like alcohol can either be abused or treated with respect. Our goverment should take a look at certain european countries where drugs are leagal. Things seem to be working over there, and we would also be saving a hell of a lot of money which could go to the control of drugs, like alcohol, instead of the war on drugs. People should be able to live there lives the way that they choose and not have restrictions put on them for everything that they do. If they choose to become a drug pheen, let them. You only have one life, you should be able to live it how you want.
 
1) Legalize all drugs.
2) Penalize the drug users by ending state-sponsored rehab centers and programs. Private sector can run these if they want. There would still be for-profit centers and some free clinics run by charity groups. Removing a percieved safety net may help keep people from starting to use drugs in the first place.
3) Heavy sentences for those who commit crimes while under the influence.
4) Tax the stuff heavily.
5) Stigmatize the druggies. Portray them as human trash.

In general : Make it a very uncomfortable and unforgiving world for drug users. Let them know that if they do start using drugs, they WILL be screwing up their lives.

I am rarely accused of being a nice guy. :)
 
Dare we threaten Law enforcement's cash cow?

We've got about 9 responses here, all but one agreeing with George (including myself and this is only the second time that has happened... I'm keeping track). Each of the supporting posts offer a strong supporting arguement.

Then we have our single response of dissent-- Lawdog. No explaination offered. Simply: ".. unlawful drugs should stay unlawful.." Well! I'm convinced!

This is a very good subject and should be brought up more frequently in circles like ours. You know what amazes me most is how quickly we are catching on! Had this thread been posted on TFL a year ago it would not have been so well received... two years ago? Forget about it entirely! You would have been flamed off the board! It's just a "no-brainer" to anyone willing to take a honest look at the issue.

The real ADDICTS are the politicians, law enforcement, correctional officers, etc. Money and power are their drug and they are TRULY HOOKED. Luring them into Rehab will likely prove impossible.

Second only to the 2nd, this issue should be our most passionate pursuit... I feel it is really THAT important.
Also, IMHO, the "medical marijuana" and "hemp" arguements are red herrings... it's about freedom and resusitating the 4th amend.
 
No argument against the legalization of dope is going to change the minds of the pro-legalization people.

Anyone who has followed the anti-drug war threads on this forum, on Bladeforums, or on any of the other forums knows my stance on the legalization of drugs. My arguments against the legalization of recreational pharmaceuticals have been posted, re-posted and posted some more on this forum, and on others in the past four years.

George, who originated this thread, knows my feelings about dope. He asked for an opinion. I opined that the medical aspects should be treated as any other medical substance, but not legalized. As he asked for.

Now. If this thread deviates one iota into ad hominim attacks, thinly veiled sarcasm or anything other than a courteous debate by civilized persons concerning Georges thread subject, it goes Lights Out.

LawDog
 
I have seen mny of my friends lose brain cells because they continued to abuse drugs. I agree that the war on drugs has brought serious injustice to many completely innocent citizens and that the only way to stop drugs is to stop people from using. Unfortuntely this is impossible since most users i know would never stop especially if drugs are legalized. A very good friend whom i grew up with now cannot from complete sentences or remeber were he is sometimes because of his drug use. I believe that in some sense drugs should be legalized from the standpoint of justice. But me personlly i can not condone the use of any drugs that dont cure illness or releive pin from injury. I have toomany friends that turned into pin cushions and lost the ability to think.
 
Legalization of Drugs

My recomendation for any one interested in the legalization of drugs is to read the book:

"Drug Crazy" By: Mike Gray.

Particularly persons who are vehemently opposed to any legalization.

Of course, the book should be available @ Amazon.com, that's where I bought it.

My opinions are to be found in the book.

Greg S.

Quote of the day:

IF YOU TORTURE A BALLOT LONG ENOUGH, IT WILL CONFESS.

Former Senator Alan Simpson, MSNBC, November 14, 2000
 
I would rather the drugs be legal then my rights be void. I seriously doubt there are many drug addicts that cannot get drugs anyway. If these drugs were legalized in some way or another and available cheaper I think there would be less reason for joe rockhead to break in to someones house etc. Not to mention that the drug war has financed gangs and all other kinds of crap and our disgusting .gov is up to it's ears in the distribution of these substances. I agree that rehab is better then prison. This is a war that will not be won. Even now there are so many drugs on the street that it is fantasy to think that little johnny can't buy them at his school, so what is the difference if they are legal ? At least then they would not be toxic, financing gangs etc.
 
Amen, George. People with obsessive-compulsive addictive disorders have always been ad always will be with us. How do we 'manage' them - do we jail them or treat them?
The really hard core addicts aren't are unlikely to be productive members of society in any event, but the cost of managing them medically (i.e. give them the sh*t) & with welfare is a damn sight cheaper (& safer) than leaving them on the street, doing crime and them warehousing them in jails & guaranteeing that they will never be contirbuting members. I could care less about somebody who wants to do a joint eith his/her pizza and rented movie on a Friday night.
The Rand Corp. (a canservative think tank) did a study a fes years ago that found that tratment was seven times more effective that interdiction in reducing the number of junkies on the street. Ask any city cop what percentage of street crime is drug related (in DC the going rate is about 80%).
IMHO, the choice isn't too hard - education, decrimianlization, and treatment vs more jails and less rights. We're gonna pay either way, but under the current approach, I think we're paying WAY too much. M2
 
The whole subject sickens me. I have seen the people and the results of drug abuse. I have seen the neglect of the children of drug abusers. It disgusts me in a way that I can not articulate into words. There was a time when I thought every drug user should simply get a 9mm to the back of the head. Then as I have matured - that changed to .45... Now, I realize that I dont care about these scumbags enough to waste my ammo on them or pay for it wiht my tax dollars. What I do care about is the way the governemt has used these scumbags as an excuse for the sidestepping of the bill of rights.

I am sick of the concept of punishing the innocent because of the activity of the wrong door. This is NOT an American ideology. This is not what our country was founded on.
Personal Responsability is just out of style.
If drugs are made legal - then all of the various drug related crimes would disipate. The War on Our Rights would lose a great deal of its spark. The DEA would reduce to an FDA like role. Regulation is the key.
I NEVER thought I'ld entertain these ideas... Dispite my revulsion of making drugs legal... My revulsion of total domination and opression of police and government for the sake of a joint is even more so.
Seriously - I know a family... a good upstanding family that had there home of over 40 years confiscated because the teen age son had friends that sold dope between themselves behind the sons back. House taken - family car - taken. For what? For 4 joints and a dozen pills of Ecstacy.
The Kids? Probation. Thats it. This kinda thing is WRONG.
Remember the story about the retired Pastor? He took all his money out of the bank for some reason... Was stopped for traffic and ended up with his life savings confiscated for nothing more then he had more money than the Officer had in his pocket. Wrong. Justification? Suspicion of Possible Drug Transaction. Right.

Its time we called a Cease Fire on the War on Drugs.
 
I think we could lose our freedoms in "wars" on other types of crime as well...legalizing drugs would not end the problem.
 
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