Vest Pocket Weasel in .45 Whimp: any takers?

O

Oleg Volk

Staff Alumnus
Expert opinions on the feasibility are welcome.

Vest Pocket Weasel in .45 Whimp (Maybe .45 Lite or .45 Ferocious Toothy Killer would sell better
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The main problem with mouseguns is that their projectiles generally lack energy to expand *and* penetrate far enough. Increasing the caliber leads to heavy and painful recoil, increasing bullet velocity increases muzzle blast and flash. The Pocket Weasel is an effort to improve close-in performance through a different set of trade-offs.

Caliber = .45 Whimp, with bullet set back in the case up to the ogive to reduce the case capacity.
Projectile weight = 75gr (similar to .410 shotgun slug and .32acp bullet). Jacketed ammunition would probably provide better terminal performance.
Cartridge = 45acp brass case. Loads use fast pistol powder designed to burn up in a 2.5" barrel. Muzzle velocity of 1000fps should be realistic: the trade-off would be rapid drop-off with distance. I would expect the velocity to be sufficient up to 50ft.
Recoil system: blowback, with double recoil spring to moderate the kick.
Expected weight=12-13oz through use of plastic frame and relatively thin barrel (low pressure round).
Ignition: striker
Trigger: take-up disconnects firing pin block, further pull fires the gun.
Sight: Truglo front protected with radiused "ears" similar to AR15 sight. No rear sight, instead top of the slide would have shotgun-style pointing grooves. Sight regulated to POI=POA at 25ft
Magazine: single-stack, 4 or 5 rounds
The idea behind this design is to create a dedicated short-range defensive pistol. Because low-energy cartridges cannot effectively use up part of the bullet energy to mechanically deform (expand) hollow points and still penetrate, using a larger caliber light projectile would use all of the kinetic energy for penetration and still provide a large wound channel. Loss of long-range performance is an acceptable trade-off, in my opinion. BTW, shorter chamber would mean regular .45acp won't fit and blow up the gun.
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The original idea was to use .410 slugs in metal cases (maybe necked-down .45) because the entire concept was based on looking at the deficencies of .410 handguns. Unjacketed projectlies just didn't look good once I thought about it some more.

Can anyone point me to ballistic software on-line or do the trajectory and velocity loss calculations for this cartridge for me?
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Oleg "cornered rat" Volk

[This message has been edited by Oleg Volk (edited March 30, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Oleg Volk (edited March 30, 2000).]
 
Hi, Oleg,

Someone once advocated using only the .45 bullet jacket as a projectile, and some early pistols used a jacketed wooden bullet to achieve high velocity in a blowback system.

Jim
 
That is a good idea but is also illegal in the US. A brand of .25acp "JHP" jacket-only was taken off the market over this. ATF classifies that type of projectiles as "armor-piercing". Perhaps plastic or aluminum core would work but I was curious about viability of buullets with very large cross-section for their weight.
 
Interesting idea but I will stay with my Walther .380. 90gr at 1000fps. with a flying ashtray looking HP. The fps does not have a rapid drop off. I have thought about a .41 mag cut back to about .45 auto length or so and a light bullet in the American Derringer.
Much more poop than the old .41 rimfire model and possable to hang on to when shooting? Always wanted to play with that idea. The .45 jacket just need some shot in it with some epoxey over the HP,glasser style at home.
 
I don't know about the idea, but the name is awesome!

"Gee Correia, whats that?"

"This is my Pocket Weasel, baby."
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I have seen small light low capacity .45 auto's before(Detonics etc.) and even one that required the user to manually cycle the slide for every shot(ouch, the recoil has to be tremendous in that one!). The thing that I find intriguing though is the ".45 Ferocious Toothy Killer" loading. You could have something there. As far a flying ashtrays go, a .45 ashtray beats a .380 ashtray anyday.

On such a critter, are any sights really neccessary. Hmmmm lets see, the slug will turn how many times before leaving the barrel? Maybe a 1/3 turn, that ain't gonna stabilize the trajectory of a bullet of that mass, at the velocities you mention, to really gain that much from aiming(caveat, I assume mouse guns to be strictly for close in, point and shoot work anyways right?). For this reason, I would make the same gun you mention with no front sight and leave the shotgun/cz-75 type slide top. An integrel laser sight/light would be a neat option as well, especially if the dot was the size of a dinner plate at 21ft.

Another thing would be pronounced grooves or knurling along most of the length of side of the slide to aid in gripping the little thing. I like the concept overall. This could really fill a niche. -ddt
 
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