totalitarian double standard

Prototype

Inactive
i must admit.....it is great to be able to communicate with like minded individuals concerning gun rights...over the past few years of my life...when i began to really become interested in firearms, i noticed something rather disturbing.Everyone, including myself, likes to equate gun control with the policies of Nazi Germany.What bothers me though, is the lack of acknowledgement that similar measures were and are taken in communist governments around the world.Another problem with the media i have (among other things) is the fact that Stalin and Mao killed far more people than Hitler. Where are the Shindler's List type movies for them? I mean, they were human beings who also suffered from the results of gun control.Makes you wonder where our media's sypathies lye doesn't it?..

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resistance to tyrrany is obedience to god...thomas jefferson
 
Welcome to TFL, Prototype.

I don't wonder where the media's sympathies lie, I know.

Since you mentioned double standards, here's another one for ya. The anti-gun crowd tells us that self-defense isn't a "legitimate" use for firearms. After all, we have police and military to protect us, and civilians (BTW I am a citizen, not civilian. Ever read Starship Troopers?) might misuse firearms.

However, why does the US have an Army and Navy? To defend itself, right? Why is it "legitimate" for a nation to use armed force to defend itself, but not its citizens? Why does the US "need" to defend itself? After, we have the UN to protect us, and if the US had an Army they might misuse it...


I hope this was coherent enough to make sense. The eyestrain from starin' at a 'puter screen all day is makin' my brain hurt.

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"Is fhe'arr teicheadh math na droch fhuireach"
-Sarabian Oomodo

If it isn't Scottish, it's CRAP!

A firearm isn't a weapon until it is used as such.
 
Prototype, welcome as well. If you're not familiar with them, visit http://www.jpfo.org . You'll enjoy it, especially relative to your thread.

Regards from AZ.

[This message has been edited by Jeff Thomas (edited August 17, 1999).]
 
Blitzkrieg,

I agree. In my opinion, the US has not demonstrated a legitimate use of its armed forces since the War of 1812, with the possbile exception of WWII. The "campaigns" against American Indians? Does that sound legitimate to you?

Such things are the very reason the Founders feared standing armies and why there are Constitutional limits to its size, as well as protection for our RKBA.

BTW, the statement "they MIGHT misuse it..." was meant as sarcasm. :D

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"Is fhe'arr teicheadh math na droch fhuireach"
-Sarabian Oomodo

If it isn't Scottish, it's CRAP!

A firearm isn't a weapon until it is used as such.
 
Welcome, Prototype.

Your point is a good one. We should recognize that once a government gains all the power, they abuse it.

Looking forward to your future posts.
 
Welcome, Protype. You're among friends and like minded patriots here.

Drop by the "Legal & Political" forum, too, and jump right in!

[This message has been edited by Leadfoot (edited August 18, 1999).]
 
Proto-
Welcome to TFL. Please check your email settings. You have requested that the software email you when there is a response to this thread. However, the email continues to bounce back to me...bad addy.
Rich Lucibella
rluci@ix.netcom.com
 
Here's something not too many people take notice of. When they think of far left, they usually think Communist. When they think of far right, they usually think Nazi. The thing of it is, BOTH were some form of Socialism (that is, the State handles--and consequently controls--everything). We remember the nationalist part of Hitler's regime well enough, but many--especially liberals--forget that the second letter of NSDAP was Socialist.

An email sent to me a while back by a conservative Jewish friend of mine in BC describes it pretty well:

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During the past several months in the American press, the Democrats have
frequently denounced the Republicans as Nazis due to their attempts to control runaway federal spending. How very ironic. I remember the Nazis. Let me share a little about them and recall some of their exploits.

First of all, "Nazi" was gutter slang for the verb "to nationalize". The Bider-Mienhoff gang gave themselves this moniker during their early struggles. The official title of the Nazi Party was "The National Socialist
Workers Party of Germany". Hitler and the Brownshirts advocated the nationalization of education, health care, transportation, national resources, manufacturing, distribution and law enforcement.

Hitler came to power by turning the working class, unemployed, and academic elite against the conservative republic. After Der Fuhrer's election ceased being a political conspiracy and was transformed into a fashionable social
phenomenon, party membership was especially popular with educators, bureaucrats, and the press.

Being a Nazi was "politically correct". They called themselves "The Children of the New Age of World Order" and looked down their noses at everyone else. As Hitler acquired more power, he referred to his critics as
"The Dark Forces of Anarchy and Hatred". Anyone who questioned Nazi high-handedness in the German press was branded a "Conservative
Reactionary". Joseph Goebbels, minister of
communications, proclaimed a "New World Order".

The Nazi reign of terror began with false news reports on the Jews, Bohemians and Gypses who were said to be arming themselves to overthrow the "New World Order" and Hitler demanded that all good people register their
guns so that they wouldn't fall into the hands of "terrorists and madmen".Right-wing fanatics of the "Old Order" who protested firearms registration were arrested by the S.S. and put in jail for "fomenting hatred against the Government of the German people".

Then the Reichstag (government building) was blown up and Hitler ram-rodded an "Emergency Anti-Terrorist Act" through Parliament that gave the Gestapo extraordinary powers. The leader then declared that for the well-being of the German people, all private firearms were to be confiscated by the Gestapo and the Wermotten (federal law enforcement and military). German citizens who refused to surrender their guns when the "jack-boots" (Gestapo) came calling, were murdered in their homes. By the way, the Gestapo were the federal marshals' service of the Third Reich. The S.W.A.T. team was invented and perfected by the Gestapo to break into the homes of
the enemies of the German people.

When the Policia Bewakken, or local police, refused to take away guns from townsfolk, they themselves were disarmed and dragged out into the street and shot to death by the S.A. and the S.S. Those were Nazi versions of the
B.A.T.F. and the F.B.I. When several local ministers spoke out against these atrocities, they were imprisoned and never seen again.

The Gestapo began to confiscate and seize the homes, businesses, bank accounts, and personal belongings of wealthy conservative citizens who had prospered in the old Republic. Pamphleteers who urged revolt against the Nazis were shot on site by national law enforcement and the military.
Gypsies and Jews were detained and sent to labor camps. Mountain roads throughout central Europe were closed to prevent the escape of fugitives into the wilderness, and to prevent the movement and concealment of partisan resistance fighters.

Public schools rewrote history and Hitler youth groups taught the children to report their parents to their teachers for anti-Nazi remarks. Such parents disappeared. Pagan animism became the state religion of the Third Reich and Christians were widely condemned as "right wing fanatics".

Millions of books were burned first and then people. Millions of them burned in huge ovens after they were first gassed to death. Unmarried women were paid large sums of money to have babies out of wedlock and then given
medals for it. Evil was declared as being good, and good was condemned as being evil. World Order was coming and the German people were going to be the "peacekeepers".

Yes, indeed, I remember the Nazis and they weren't Republicans, or "right wing", or patriots" or "militias". They were Socialist monsters.

***
Sorry about the length.

jth

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Exodus 22:2 -- Biblical precedent for home defense.
 
Mein Gott! I thought I knew my history quite well, but this short post filled in a number of gaps ... not that I had anything wrong, just missing. I am half tempted to turn this into a "future past" type of writing ... hmmm.

So much if what is going on these days.
 
Ufilas,

Would this letter be available to cut and paste? And are there any references that you could attach to it if it is available?

Thanks.

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John/az

"The middle of the road between the extremes of good and evil, is evil. When freedom is at stake, your silence is not golden, it's yellow..." RKBA!

http://www.countdown9199.com
 
John/az2,

The fellow who sent me the email is Kevin Abrams, co-author of "The Pink Swastika."

But the article he sent me over email came from the Washington Times, in their Letters to the Editor on June 7 (1998, I think).

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Exodus 22:2 -- Biblical precedent for home defense.
 
Ach du Lieber! Now I know where the clintonistas got their agenda...Mein Kampf!!?!

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Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up... Yankee Doodle
 
Anyone remember the term "Doublespeak" (those of you who had to read Orwell's 1984 surely must)? It's funny how government officials recognize the need for guns for their own safety, but care less for the security of the peasants they rule. I think it was John Lott who challenged anti-RKBA officials to disarm their bodyguards if their concern about gun safety was sincere.

Got a chuckle at a picture in the latest Newsweek "If We Ban All Guns, We Get Instant Nirvana" issue, where good ol' Mr. Brady was reading his latest plea for Gun kontrol (with Wilhelm Jeffersonivich Klinton holding the mike) WHILE SURROUNDED BY ARMED GUARDS!

Ahhhhh--Demokracy



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Exodus 22:2 -- Biblical precedent for home defense.
 
Orwell on "doublespeak"? I highly recommend you grab a copy of 1984. Read the appendix (yes, fiction with an appendix): it's a how-to manual on changing minds by changing language thru doublespeak. It's a short, worthwhile read.
 
Yes, for sure Stalin leads the "hit" parade as far as murders;up to perhaps 100 million if you include WWII since he so weakened the Russian Military with purges and poor prewar strategy that huge looses were inevitable. Mao would be second, and Hitler comes in third in this infamous "hit" parade. Stalins camps were as bad as Hitlers and had the exact same effect but were much more numerous. The elites who have been running the western nations since before WWII are found to be strong admirers of the communist system and FDR comes to mind especially. Very little is publicized in the co ntrolled media of Stalins huge crimes against his own people. The starving of the Ukrainian people was at least 10 million alone which exceeded the extermination of the Jews by Hitler by 4 million or more. Unless the average American has a ethnic connection to the peoples Stalin killed, he has no idea of Stalins crimes. How can he when the socialist-communist media doesnt dare tell the truth. And now the ultimate for the American people; a pure Stalinist as president! Strangely , as far as gun ownership goes, the Nazis allowed some of the occupied European peoples to be armed,especially the militias in countries like France and Greece where local people were armed to fight communist insurgents. Yes there is a double standard by our educated people in the school and media systems. The crimes of Hitler are well known ,but Stalin is given a whitewashing especially in the US and England where the socialist-communist influence is so strong in schools(public fool system) and media. Our elites have been in bed with the communists for decades and now the final deception for the west is the contrived and false"collapse" of the communist system in the Soviet Union. One world merger of communist and monopoly capitalist systems(both really the same rotten can of worms) is very close.
 
This thread has reminded me of an incident when I was getting my bachelor's almost 20 years ago. Even at that time, I was "a nontraditional student", being 30 years old and a Vietnam era vet, in classes with 18/19 year olds fresh off ranches in west Texas. While we were studying WW II in US History class, I pointed out the whitewash of Stalin's vicious and ignoble slaughter of the Ukrainian peasants. Specifically, I'd stated that while Hitler's name was almost universally synonymous with evil incarnate, Stalin should have equal infamy on that level. I knew about the massacre from an old gentleman who I had worked with in my early 20's and had barely escaped with his life, and from some chance reading some years later. The comment I made was belittled by the professor as irrelevant and ridiculous, but strangely enough he acknowledged it as true.
 
Right on Ckurts1 These college professors aere not only mostly left wing commies,but are intellectual whores as well. It is too bad these pro Stalinist intellectuals in America coulnt have been in Stalinist Russia where Uncle Joe would have taken care of them!
 
Not surprisingly, all the genocides of the 20th century were perpetrated by leftist governments. There's a fine website giving detailed info on all the genocides, but I don't have the URL handy. Try a search for the word "democide" or "death by government".

Orwell was heavily influenced by the economist F.A. Hayek and his work, "The Road to Serfdom" which was written in England in the early 40s, and explains how and why socialist governments invariably become totalitarian. Hayek even explains how governments use "doublespeak", altho Orwell coined the term. It's a fascinating read, available from www.lfb.org. There's even a chapter called, "Why the Worst Get on Top" explaining why the "authorities" in these states are so corrupt.

If you like the message in "1984" you'll want to read what prompted it.

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"The sole end for which mankind are warranted, individually or collectively, in interfering with the liberty of any of their number is self-protection."
John Stuart Mill
 
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