Titegroup not working out.

D

dahermit

New member
Here is my problem. I shoot a lot of light loads under cast bullets, mainly 125 grain .38 Special and sometimes 125 grain very light loads in .357 Magnum. My go-to powder has been Bullseye...for years and years. But, as I posted a few weeks ago, I am getting very low on Bullseye and have tried to switch to Titegroup. Titegroup has worked out o.k. for .38 Special, but it is not working out for the .32 S&W Long.

I load all handgun on a Dillon 550b and the Dillon powder meter will not close-down far enough for Titegroup for the .32 S&W Long. Even with the meter closed all the way (I do have the smallest powder meter slide installed), the smallest amount of Titegroup that can be thrown is 2.3 grains. 2.3 grains of Titegroup seems a little hotter (more recoil), than my standard load of 2.0 of Bullseye. The 2.0 of Bullseye is quite accurate (2 and 1/2 inches for six shots at my standard 50 foot bowling pin range, sandbagged, from the bench, single action),in my .32 S&W Long, as well as the smallest amount the Dillon meter will throw with the metering screw/powder slide all the way closed.

The 2.3 grains (powder slide/screw closed all the way) of Titegroup is a little warm for the Lee 93 grain (nominal weight) bullet so I do not want to go any hotter and using 2.3 grains is not all that accurate (3-4 inch, center to center, six shots @50 ft.).

Due to the Dillon meter, I cannot test any lighter loads, and I do not want to go any heavier than the 2.3 grains of Titegroup. So, I think Titegroup is out for the .32 S&W Long.

Inasmuch as I have not seen any Bullseye in South Central Michigan (Adrian to Coldwater) in a while including a Gun Show in Lansing/Mason recently (where I got the Titegroup), I am again looking for a powder for my .32 S&JW Long Hand Ejector I Frame.

Titegroup is out. Unique does not meter well in small amounts, so that is out. Trailboss is large flaked so I do not think that will meter in small amounts in a Dillon meter...but have not tried it, so if you have used it in the .32 S&W Long (in very light loads), please share your experiences...I am willing to try it if someone can attest to good results with the .32 S&W Long, that is.

What powder meters well in a Dillon meter in small amounts and is suitable for very light loads in the .32 S&W Long? I would find actual experiences from those who hand load the .32 S&W Long with cast bullets more useful than suggestions to try the obvious powders like 231, etc. There has to be others out there who cast for and shoot that cartridge.

Or, who has Bullseye in stock... in South Central Michigan, between Coldwater and Adrian, or Lansing to the State Line?
 
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I shoot a bit of 32 S&W Long, and I have a 550. But I shoot it so little that I don't bother setting up the 550 for it. I do use Titegroup, but I meter it through a Hornady powder measurer, which does fine with the small amount, and use my Lyman turret press.

The best metering, most consistent powder I have ever used is Ramshot True blue. The powder isn't flake shaped, it is teeny tiny little balls. It makes a big mess if you spill it because they roll all over the place. Unfortunately, it's not a candidate for 32 Long. But Zip is. However I have never used it. Looking at the pictures I found on the web, it appears to be small flake shaped, not ball. Probably similar to Titegroup or 231, but I have never seen it first hand. It uses a larger load than Titegroup, which may work to your advantage. According to the Lyman Cast Cast Bullet book, Zip's range is 2.7 - 3.0 grains vs. 2.0 - 2.4 for Titegroup (for a 93 gr cast bullet).

Do you have some 231? It's range is 2.4 - 2.7. If not, I could try it out in my 550 and see how low it can go.
 
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond or not covered by currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

Some points I picked out:

Titegroup: I never had good luck with Titegroup in small cartridges. It was always too twitchy. While clean and economical, accuracy was unpredictable and even 0.1 gr variations in charge weight could be a problem. I'm willing to try it again, since my last go-round was probably 8+ years ago; but all I remember from the time was disappointment.

Bullseye: I'm sure there's some available somewhere within driving distance. I've seen BE on shelves here (S.E. Idaho), quite a few times, over the last six months; and sightings are getting to be pretty predictable. For instance.... As of earlier this evening, the local Sportsman's Warehouse had 48 lbs (six 8-lb jugs) at one end of the powder isle, and 4 lbs (4 1-lb canisters) at the other end.

Unique: For me, Unique metered well (exactly like Bullseye and Red Dot) all the way down to about 2.3 gr in Dillon powder measures. Beyond that, I was simply out of adjustment.

It seems like you don't want to hear it, but W231/HP-38 is one of my go-to powders for .32 S&W (hot) and .32 S&W Long (light). It has treated me very well, especially with 90-100 gr bullets. And it (HP-38 in this case) was the most reliable powder for extremely light loads with less than 25% case fill in .32 S&W Long (just 1.8-2.2 gr).

I don't remember using Trail Boss in .32 S&W Long. I've messed with it in quite a few cartridges, but can't recall doing so with the 'little' .32s. I never really had a reason to try it.

Running some numbers through Quick Load, based on the data you shared and my past experience (to fill in some gaps)...
Your 2.0 gr Bullseye charge should be approximately duplicated by (listing only charges under 3.0 gr, with none exceeding 55% Pmax):
Vihtavuori Tin Star (2.2 gr)
Alliant HERCO (2.6 gr)
Trail Boss (2.3 gr)
Alliant UNIQUE (2.3-2.4 gr) (Bullseye's predicted velocity for my parameters falls exactly at 2.35 gr for Unique)


.
 
Bullseye: I'm sure there's some available somewhere within driving distance. I've seen BE on shelves here (S.E. Idaho), quite a few times, over the last six months; and sightings are getting to be pretty predictable. For instance.... As of earlier this evening, the local Sportsman's Warehouse had 48 lbs (six 8-lb jugs) at one end of the powder isle, and 4 lbs (4 1-lb canisters) at the other end.
Click to expand...
I don't live in S.E. Idaho...here in South Central Michigan, unless all the gun shops I can find on the internet and call (and frequent), are lying, there is no Bullseye.

It seems like you don't want to hear it, but W231/HP-38 is one of my go-to powders for .32 S&W (hot) and .32 S&W Long (light). It has treated me very well, especially with 90-100 gr bullets. And it (HP-38 in this case) was the most reliable powder for extremely light loads with less than 25% case fill in .32 S&W Long (just 1.8-2.2 gr).
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I would be glad to have access to some W231, but it is as scarce as Bullseye around here. So, it is not a matter of not wanting to hear it, it is a matter of finding it.
 
I don't have your powder measure si I can't comment on how these will drop.

Red & Green Dot have both worked well for me in 32 S&W & Long. W231 also works well but is hard to find.

Herco works but you will have to drive it over "Current Max" to make it perform well.
 
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond or not covered by currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.


I don't know why they weren't showing up before, but I just ran some QL predictions with the same parameters as before.
For the same approximate velocity as 2.0 gr Bullseye:
Alliant Red Dot (1.9 gr)
Alliant Green Dot (1.8-1.9 gr)

And some additions:
Accurate No.2 (2.3 gr)
Accurate No.5 (2.9 gr)
Accurate Solo 1250 (2.1 gr)
Alliant POWER PISTOL (2.9 gr)
Norma R1 (1.7 gr)
Ramshot Zip (2.1 gr)
Vihtavuori N310 (1.5 gr)
Vihtavuori N320 (1.9 gr)
Vihtavuori N330 (2.2 gr)
Winchester WAP (2.6 gr)


But, as with the previously listed predictions, case fill is quite low (23-56%), some of these powders don't burn well at low pressure, and chamber pressure is very much on the mediocre side. Position-sensitivity, unpredictability, and massive amounts of soot are to be expected.
 
If you can find it, AA2 has become my favorite light load/target powder for both .38 Special and .45 ACP. It is just as fine grained (or more so) than Bullseye and meters very well in both my RCBS and Dillon powder measures. It seems to be a little cleaner burning than Bullseye as well.
 
I've recently found a very nice load for .32 S&W long, using Red Dot. It meters very well (Hornady LnL measure) for me. Might be worth a try for you if you have that powder.
 
I've recently found a very nice load for .32 S&W long, using Red Dot. It meters very well (Hornady LnL measure) for me. Might be worth a try for you if you have that powder.
Click to expand...
I do have some Red Dot, however, having such big flakes (just like Unique), it does not meter well through my Dillon measure.
 
Eureka! I drove over to Johnson's Sport Shop in Adian, MI today and they had an 8# container of Bullseye. My powder problem is over. I bought the eight pounder and two 1,000 boxes of Federal small pistol primers. I am back in business.
 
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