Thoughts on new CA gun laws?

Under definition of an assault weapon it says "Pistol. . with a pistol grip."

Anyone ever seen a pistol without a pistol grip?
 
On another thread I have been discussing "reasonable vs infringement" with another poster. I've been arguing "reasonable" and he's arguing "infringement". These new ammo regs strike me as total infringement. I sure hope these regs get challenged in court. I mean, a background check just to sell ammo or buy it online? Seriously?! Any ammunition designed to penetrate metal is now banned? DUH? What about FMJ, which can pass through automotive metal? If Joe Blow wants to sell his friend some leftover ammo from a gun he no longer owns, they have to go through a licensed ammo vendor? OMG! I usually don't have a whole lot of problems with regs, but this is STUPID, STUPID, STUPID!! Um, yeah. Buy as much as you can or reload as much as you can.
 
I've only been getting into firearms for the later half of this year but I wanted to ask and hear about people's thoughts on the new changes in California for 2018. Should I invest in buying a lot of ammo now or look into reloading?

http://www.laxrange.com/california-gun-laws/

First, if you can get a good deal on ammo online, I'd do it now before 2018. Even though you can get it sent to an approved vendor, you may have to pay to have it transferred to you and you want the state to have as little record of you as possible. Second, I don't think California has gone after reloading stuff yet but that is likely in the near future. After you get as much ammo online as you can, you'll probably be broke, so incrementally start to build up your reloading supplies. Third, start scoping out places to move to as your state starts to resemble a jail :)
 
Reloading and casting are excellent skills and not that difficult to acquire. Finding lead might be a little more difficult in Cali, not sure what their environmental laws are like for lead, but you should be able to get some and casting is not expensive, really. Reloading can be as simple as following a recipe.
 
The new laws INCLUDE bullets:

Penal Code - PEN
PART 6. CONTROL OF DEADLY WEAPONS [16000 - 34370] ( Part 6 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

TITLE 1. PRELIMINARY PROVISIONS [16000 - 17360] ( Title 1 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

DIVISION 2. DEFINITIONS [16100 - 17360] ( Division 2 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

16150.

(a) As used in this part, except in subdivision (a) of Section 30305 and in Section 30306, “ammunition” means one or more loaded cartridges consisting of a primed case, propellant, and with one or more projectiles. “Ammunition” does not include blanks.

(b) As used in subdivision (a) of Section 30305 and in Section 30306, “ammunition” includes, but is not limited to, any bullet, cartridge, magazine, clip, speed loader, autoloader, or projectile capable of being fired from a firearm with a deadly consequence. “Ammunition” does not include blanks.

(Amended November 8, 2016, by initiative Proposition 63, Sec. 8.1.)


https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=16150.&lawCode=PEN
 
are they really defining a pistol with a pistol grip as an assault weapon? How is that supposed to work?

It works very simply, they put the words on paper, enough other lawmakers vote yes, it passes, the Gov. signs it, it becomes law. No matter what reality is, no matter how the rest of the world defines it, whatever they put in the law becomes the legal definition.

It's a rather simple editorial change, really, from the original assault weapon law, using the same terms, but in a slightly different application.

Someone who doesn't understand firearms (or who does and just wants to ban/regulate as many as possible) might not even notice the actual effect of the change, ..immediately.

The original law defined "assault weapon" as any semi automatic rifle, pistol, or shotgun with 2 or more of the "listed features". The lists were slightly different for rifles, pistols, and shotguns.

Two of the features in the rifle and shotgun list were a pistol grip, and detachable magazine. (there were others, as well)

In the pistol list, a detachable magazine was a prohibited feature, if it went into the gun anywhere OTHER THAN the pistol grip.

My guess is that some brilliant fellow looked at the lists, and decided that since a pistol grip and a detachable magazine made a rifle an assault weapon, and a pistol grip and a detachable magazine made a shotgun an assault weapon, and since an assault weapon could be a rifle, pistol, or shotgun, then a pistol with a pistol grip and a detachable magazine must also be an assault weapon, and it's a relatively simple matter of an editorial change to cover that previous "oversight". :rolleyes:

Actually, I'm surprised it took them this long....

Also, brace yourselves for the next "leap of logic" they will make, banning revolvers as "assault weapons". The language is in the law, already, and has been since 1994. The made the Streetsweeper and Striker 12 assault weapons, (by name) and included language that said (essentially) "the named guns, or any other firearm with a mechanism substantially similar to the named firearms".

The mechanisms of those two revolving shotguns is directly copied from DA revolvers. SO, when they get around to it, that gives them the legal basis for regulating revolvers, as they are "substantially similar to" guns that have been on the assault weapon list for decades!!

They aren't coming after revolvers, NOW, but I am certain when they feel the time is right, they will. AND, they will have the argument that it has been the law for decades, why are you objecting now???:rolleyes::eek:
 
When they come for revolvers, they will quote the '5 is enough' folks from the gun world Internet. Couldn't resist. It is sad that court cases and Federal legislation to block state bans have gone nowhere. It is because that the issue was never truly important to the party now in power and Scalia's Heller decision had the double sword lurking in his prose. Scalia fans disagree but that's not how it's played out in reality.
 
They aren't coming after revolvers, NOW, but I am certain when they feel the time is right, they will.

We should never forget that they did come after them in the 70's, and in several places successfully had bans until 2008 b y a single scotus vote. nor should we forget that every national gun control lobby, as well as a number of jurisdictions were fighting tooth and nail, in amicus, spending, research studies and PR work to maintain those bans.

The thing about the California laws, is not just what you think of them -- but what you think will follow. The (frightening) irony is that jerry brown is fairly left and he is actually the main factor in holding back much more restrictive laws in cali.
 
I mean, a background check just to sell ammo or buy it online?

no no it's any ammo and you must be a lic ammo dealer to sell it . You can still by online , you just have to have it shipped to a ammo dealer in the state .

I don't believe the background check has been fully hashed out yet though . The interesting thing is , I understand there so-called logic on this . If you're a prohibited person and should not own a firearm . Why would you need ammo ? The more interesting thing is using that same logic CA says they need a full 10 days to run there background checks to buy a gun . It first was for a cooling off period but when that was recently shot down in court for anyone that already owns firearms ( No need for a cooling off period if you already own guns you can just use those instead ) . CA now say they need more time then the NICS system takes because they check more areas .

OK so here's the interesting part If they believe you're a prohibited person and a background check is needed to stop you from buying ammo . Then clearly the NICS system ( in there eyes ) in not good enough and the system they have in place takes many days to complete . What are they going to do ? Have a waiting period on ammo ? That's not going to fly . Hmm maybe you wait ten days the first time you buy then you're issued a permit to buy ammo for 1yr or maybe 6 months . Hmm well if that works for ammo why can't it work for gun purchases as well ?

CA is going to have to show how the system used in the rest of the United states ( NICS ) is not good enough to use to buy ammo . If they say it is good enough to buy ammo then why is it not good enough for firearm purchases ?

I think CA may have over stepped here and may very well regret ever enacting this law by the time it's done winding it's way through the court system .

Oh sorry OP , I'd buy some ammo online to hold you over through the reloading learning curve . The bummer thing for you is getting into firearm at the worst possible time in CA . I've been here my whole life ( 3rd gen San Diegan ) I got into firearms in the early 90's then took a 15yr break as life and child took up most of my time and effort . Then dove back in about ten years ago . Oh my how I missed a lot that was going on here in CA in regards to gun laws and sorry I was not paying better attention to that at the time .
 
Under definition of an assault weapon it says "Pistol. . with a pistol grip."

Anyone ever seen a pistol without a pistol grip?

It's a feature and the firearm must have at least two of them . So a pistrol grip "&" forward grip , flash hider , barrel shroud etc . Not sure about other states but it's illegal to put those on a pistol in CA regardless of it's type of grip . It also states the "pistol grip" in question hangs down below the mag well . Any pistols you know of fit that description ? It also states center fire rifle , any pistols fit that description ?

Unfortunately I can go on & on about this , CA sucks to live in if you're a gun enthusiast .

To the OP , I'm trying to get conformation but parts of the ammo law has been postponed until 7-1-19 . I believe that is the background check system but after the first of the year you must do all ammo purchases face to face ( FTF ) meaning no internet sales after 12-31-17 . I'd assume many vendors will stop selling ammo to CA before that to insure delivery is by 12-31-17 . My guess would be somewhere around 12-20-17 you will start to see it harder and harder to buy ammo online in CA but that's just a guess about that .
 
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