Those who are apathetic, undecided, or voting Gore - read the party platforms here...

R

RH

New member
Please folks, let's wise up and take back our nation. 80,000,000 of us out there, for crying out loud ! That's more than actually VOTED in the last election. You can go to the DNC & RNC party websites to verify this, I lifted the appropriate portions verbatim:
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Democrats:
"Democrats believe that we should fight gun crime on all fronts - with stronger laws and stronger enforcement. That's why Democrats fought and passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent.
Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks, to protect our children. We should require a photo license I.D., a full background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun in America. We support more federal gun prosecutors, ATF agents and inspectors, and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime."

Republicans:
"We defend the constitutional right to keep and bear arms, and we affirm the individual responsibility to safely use and store firearms. Because self-defense is a basic human right, we will promote training in their safe usage, especially in federal programs for women and the elderly. A Republican administration will vigorously enforce current gun laws, neglected by the Democrats, especially by prosecuting dangerous offenders identified as felons in instant background checks. Although we support background checks to ensure that guns do not fall into the hands of criminals, we oppose federal licensing of law-abiding gun owners and national gun registration as a violation of the Second Amendment and an invasion of privacy of honest citizens. Through programs like Project Exile, we will hold criminals individually accountable for their actions by strong enforcement of federal and state firearm laws, especially when guns are used in violent or drug-related crimes. With a special emphasis upon school safety, we propose the crackdown on youth violence explained elsewhere in this platform."
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Some of you hard-liners might disagree with the GOP's stance, but really folks ... this is a 2-WAY race and the distinction is quite obvious.

Please............
Don't vote Dem because your union supports Dems, or they promise you free this or that for life.
a) if you believe the promises - I have a bridge to sell you
b) there is no such thing as a free lunch. Or free health care. Or free child care. Or free prescription drugs. Or ...

Don't stay home.

Don't vote 3rd party.
Not now. Not this time. Now is not the time to roll over, or try to make a statement with your 3rd party vote.




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Act as free men, and do not use your freedom as a covering for evil, but use it as bondslaves of God.
1 Peter 2:16.
 
Gore's platform follows the Communist manifesto practicly line for line.

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Sam I am, grn egs n packin

Nikita Khrushchev predicted confidently in a speech in Bucharest, Rumania on June 19, 1962 that: " The United States will eventually fly the Communist Red Flag...the American people will hoist it themselves."
 
And the LP platform on self defense:

"Criminals will always be armed, even if they have to smuggle, steal, or manufacture the weapons themselves. They will never buy them in ways that involve registration, background checks, waiting periods, or safety locks. So gun laws have no effect on true criminals; their only effect is to intrude upon your privacy and make it harder for you to defend yourself.

Democrats want even more gun laws. Republicans want tougher enforcement of the existing gun laws. But the gun laws are bad laws - every one of them.

In the presidential race, only Harry Browne, the Libertarian candidate, wants to repeal all these harmful laws - so you’ll no longer be at a disadvantage to criminals."
 
Hmm. Harry Browne has zero chance of winning, the next president will appoint at least 2-3 judges, and those judges will determine whether the democrats' census plan (which increases the official population in democratically controlled areas, thus providing more representatives) is constitutional. If enough people vote Harry Browne and Gore gets in as a result, you won't have either firearms or an effective vote in 2004.
 
EricM - true
buzz_knox - truer still

EricM, would you feel good about your vote, like a real patriot, like someone who really stands on principle - if Gore's margin of victory can be attributed to Browne votes stolen from Bush ? In that way, the only true libertarian candidate could be remembered as the single greatest ally for the liberty-grabbers. Swell.

Think. The job of the Executive - the chief law enforcement officer - is to what ? Enforce the laws. Not judge their constitutionality, not argue their merits - enforce them. So, Bush is saying, "I will do my job as Chief exec and Chief LEO".
But... part of his job will also be to appoint judges (federal & Supremes), whose job is...? Bingo! To judge the constitutionality of said laws. And if these judges will be, as I think they would be, since GWB has said as much - "strict constructionists", you will see a lot of decisions in favor of liberty and freedom instead of political activism.

You idealists have my undying admiration for your uncompromising pursuit of true liberty, but is the this starting to make sense ? I know it's a bitter pill, but is the gravity of this situation starting to sink in ?

Please, if you don't think you can do the "right thing", just do the "better thing". I promise I'll respect you in the morning.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RH:
EricM - true
buzz_knox - truer still

EricM, would you feel good about your vote, like a real patriot, like someone who really stands on principle - if Gore's margin of victory can be attributed to Browne votes stolen from Bush ? In that way, the only true libertarian candidate could be remembered as the single greatest ally for the liberty-grabbers. Swell.

Think. The job of the Executive - the chief law enforcement officer - is to what ? Enforce the laws. Not judge their constitutionality, not argue their merits - enforce them. So, Bush is saying, "I will do my job as Chief exec and Chief LEO".
But... part of his job will also be to appoint judges (federal & Supremes), whose job is...? Bingo! To judge the constitutionality of said laws. And if these judges will be, as I think they would be, since GWB has said as much - "strict constructionists", you will see a lot of decisions in favor of liberty and freedom instead of political activism.

You idealists have my undying admiration for your uncompromising pursuit of true liberty, but is the this starting to make sense ? I know it's a bitter pill, but is the gravity of this situation starting to sink in ?

Please, if you don't think you can do the "right thing", just do the "better thing". I promise I'll respect you in the morning. [/quote]

I don't need your respect. GWBush just doesn't represent my political beliefs. I'm voting for Harry Browne, not against Al Gore. Nothing wrong with posting another party's platform. BTW, the republicans approved every single gun control law on the books.
 
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"the republicans" approved "every single" gun control law on the books
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my, my. We are painting with the B R O A D brush now !

Are you saying EVERY REPUBLICAN who has been in office since 1968 (1934 ?) has APPROVED or voted for EVERY SINGLE gun control law ?
Come now. Get a grip.

My voting record in this election cycle is this:
- I financially supported Gary Bauer, and a very pro-RKBA and former Libertarian candidate for NJ Senate (Murray Sabrin).
- I voted for Sabrin in the primary, he lost miserably to two left-centrist "Republicans"
- Gary Bauer disappointed me with his support of McCain, and was out of the running by the time NJ had our primary - I voted for Keyes

I felt good about all of these actions, knowing that my money and my vote were going to otherwise unpopular causes that mean a lot to me.

But now the time for fun & games & making a 'statement' to the 'establishment' is past. Now it's for keeps.

Make no mistake, this is a two-way race and you cast a 3rd party vote at the peril of our freedoms.
 
As far as the RKBA goes, its simple - a vote for anybody but Bush is wasted at best and a strike against freedom at worst. I don't favor everything Bush espouses, but I have enough common sence to know that if our voices as Patriots aren't heard in unison this November, we will march one step (and probably many, many more) towards tyranny. The socialists LOVE division in our ranks - VOTE FOR BUSH!
 
It would be interesting and an eye opener if bore is elected. Now, now, don't get the blood pressure up... what I mean to say is that Americans are going to have to decide sooner or later if they want the Republic or if they want the "new" america. I also think that all gun owners will like their new home in the Republic of Texas :D. May even have a few other places to go and live (Idaho, Alaska, Montana, Wyoming, some parts of the South). This may or may not split the U.S. as a Nation but let the liberals/communist/ socialist, etcc.. get thier "new" america and us True Americans get some good land and live the American way. It would be nice.

What's that old saying... "be careful what you (talking about the anti's) wish for because you just might get it".

USP45usp
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RH:

Are you saying EVERY REPUBLICAN who has been in office since 1968 (1934 ?) has APPROVED or voted for EVERY SINGLE gun control law ?
Come now. Get a grip. [/quote]

No. I wrote the republicans approved the laws as they were either in control in congress or had the presidency. Enough of them voted yes to get them passed, and they haven't been repealed, so . . .
 
In the years since 1968 there have been many Democrats who've voted against gun control. And many Republicans who voted for it. Today there's not even a handful of Democrats who would oppose any kind of gun control. And we have some very solid Repub's like Tom DeLay on our side. Face it: as long as Rather, Jennings et al control the gun debate, any politician who opposes gun control will be pilloried. The only politicians who can stand up against the media are those whose electorate OPPOSE GUN CONTROL. If your pro-gun congressman knows that he can oppose a gun control bill and still be re-elected, he will. Better yet, if your congressman knows that if he votes for a gun control bill he'll lose a ton of votes, he won't. Our fate isn't in the hands of our elected officials, it's in ours.

As for Bush, I've said it before and I'll repeat it now: he's as pro-gun a candidate as we've had since Reagan, maybe even before. He just needs his feet held to the fire. Hence my signature line:

Dick
Want to send a message to Bush? Sign the petition at http://www.petitiononline.com/monk/petition.html and forward the link to every gun owner you know.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EricM:
No. I wrote the republicans approved the laws as they were either in control in congress or had the presidency. Enough of them voted yes to get them passed, and they haven't been repealed, so . . .

[/quote]


What he is saying is that George Dubya is saying that the 20,000 gun laws on the book do not violate your 2nd Amendment right and should be enforced.

Of course, if those laws are okay, then why shouldn't more of these "reasonable" gun laws be passed?

Both the Republicans and Democrats have the same principles that we should be concerned for the welfare of the nation. At what cost? Our individual rights.

What difference is there between a king taxing his subjects so that he can gain unearned income than legislature taxing citizens to give to those who didn't earn it?

Will you yell out "HOOOORAY!!!" when George W. Bush gives the money that YOU earned to Russia? to Korea? to China?

Why doesn't he allow you to decide what YOU want to do with YOUR money?

Because he feels it is okay to sacrifice you and your rights for the "common good." Isn't that called communism?



[This message has been edited by Libertarian2k (edited September 23, 2000).]
 
This topic has been beaten to death. I tired of typing replies to this. Are the Libs in the right when it comes to 2nd Amendment? Hell, yes. Do they have ANY chance of winning this presidential election? Hell, no. Could they cause Gore to be elected? Hell, yes. Wake up people. If Gore wins, there may not BE another election for gunowners. We may be unarmed or in prison by ALGORE's second term. I appreciate your patriotism, but I don't want to lose my guns, and that's why I'm voting for Bush.

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NRA Life Member
GOA
GSSF
 
You're going to let the government take your guns?

Hm. Perhaps this explains the difference of opinion here.
 
Mort, that statement doesn't reflect a difference of opinion. Just a matter of fact.
Are you fully prepared to take on the government today? Do you have all your "troops" ready? Do you want to be dead one year from now or be alive and fighting to keep RKBA? That is the fundamental question.
Gore has made it abundantly clear what his objectives are concerning guns. Right now, he's trying to evade statements he's made about licensing and registration. But, if he's elected, make no mistake that our worst nightmares will be pushed full tilt through congress.

Maybe you're ready to die today. I'm not. I'd rather prolong my death, however inevitable, as long as possible. If it is inevitable, then I'd like four more years to at least get my wife set financially.

Your vote, your call, your conscience.

Dick
Want to send a message to Bush? Sign the petition at http://www.petitiononline.com/monk/petition.html and forward the link to every gun owner you know.
 
In this election, the "Libertarians," could end up being as destructive to our remaining Liberty, as Bill Clinton, and the Democrats.
 
By the time voting for Libertarians begins to make a difference we will have already lost our country by dividing the votes that could help us to hold on. There aren't enough patriots in this country that are going to vote for a libertarian without some kind of campaign that equals Gore and Bush. If they can't get the money for a good campaign and advertising then they also won't get the votes. Votes and money come from the same place, supporters. A lack in either area boils down to a lack of supporters. No supporters=No win. Why do I need to waste a vote too prove that a Libertarian can't win this election.

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"It is easier to get out of jail then it is a morgue"
Live long and defend yourself!
John 3:16
NRA lifer
GOA
GSSF
KABA
 
Thanks, Monkeyleg. I too, choose to live as long as I can. I don't fear death. I fear making my wife a widow and my two daughters orphans. I fear no one to contradict the education and conditioning that our kids receive today in the State-run schools. I fear my kids reading a copy of the bill of rights without mention of an individual's right to keep and bear arms. This is what I fear. The idea, that somehow it is better to die in a blaze of glory than to fight for your rights in the area of politics may be appealing to some, but it isn't realistic. Hopefully, everyone in this forum is a patriot. Sometimes, death is the easy way out. Courage is the hallmark of those who choose to stay and fight for their rights. That's what I intend to do.

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NRA Life Member
GOA
GSSF
 
As a die hard, yes I figure on dying hard to regain our liberties, Libertarian...

As much as I hate both parties, Democrats are nothing short of traitors to this nation and to Jefferson's dream. Yes, I mean TREASON written in blood!

That said, here are my tortured thoughts...

If the polls are anywhere close, I will vote for Bush and not Browne. Gore and his axis are dangerous in the sense that this nation may not survive a Gore presidency and it definitely will NOT survive Democratic control of both Congress and the Presidency.

The only way I will vote for Browne is if Bush will win by a landslide. If I voted for Browne and Gore won, then I'd feel like I just helped sell this nation down the river.

A perverse justification for a Gore win is that the treasonous rat and his Democrat traitors deserve to be in the hot seat when this nation comes apart because then the Democrat party may be over for good (or at least for decades). The only reason to vote for Gore, or for Browne in a close race, is to bring about an ATLAS SHRUGGED collapse. Perhaps the sooner we get this over with, the faster we will recover BUT the meantime will be a combination of World War III and Depression II or Inferno on Earth.
 
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