The NRA and Gun Owners...A Bunch of Useful Fools??

F

Frank Haertlein

Moderator
OK, so as gun owners we have promoted enforcement of existing laws to control gun crime. We have supported and helped pass "Three Strikes and Your Out" laws and generally put forth a get tough stance on crime.

As gun owners and second amendment activists, why have we done this?

Aren’t we trying to show that if you get tough on crime it will reduce gun violence and crimes and thus we hope to show that there is no need for new gun laws that infringe on the right to bear arms?

We have done this to some extent. Crime is down in virtually every category. Murder rates are at or below those we had in the 1960’s......... yet the gun grabbers are still not stopping! We have shown that get tough on crime laws WORK yet the gun grabbers are not stopping.

So now we got laws, like in California, that make it illegal to own semi automatic rifles, magazines with more than 10 rounds capacity, etc, etc. Some gun owners have been asked to turn in their SKS’s. This is gun confiscation, plain and simple.

And now his Hitlerness, clinton, want’s to add 500 new BATF agents to go after crooked gun dealers. That’s a good thing. And the NRA supports it. But in reality, those agents can and will be used against you when you refuse to turn in your rifle or pistol.

Imagine those poor souls in California who refuse to turn in their SKS’s. They are now criminals and we now need more law enforcement officers to go around and confiscate these arms.

Do you think the gun grabbers will stop at that?
 
This $280 million for more resources His Billness wants is a typical liberal snow (blow?) job.
Think about who he is trying to impress...both the organized gun control faction and the uneducated populace. He failed to get all the GC he wanted last year, even with the massive push and has lost a great deal of credibility with the GC folks. This keeps his image as the "Gun safety" Pres alive to the sheep and placates the GC professionals by keeping gun control in the headlines.
What really needs to be blasted in headlines and opinion pieces all over the media is the utter and disgraceful lack of prosecutions by DOJ in enforcing existing laws.
I've lost track of the numbers, the "huge success of Brady" in keeping guns out of the hands of criminals they constantly boast about....a million or so....but, they don't tell about the prosecutions and the literally mere handful of convictions of these "criminals".
The utter hypocracy, venal showboating and shameless lying the Clinton admin consistently demonstrates must be blasted across the media



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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" RKBA!
 
In addition to supporting pro-gun organizations with our donations, gun owners need to take a hard line stance individually against all of these un-Constitutional laws (which violate our 2nd Amendment). Remembering how clear and plain the english language is; "shall not be infringed", means just that.

Taking the approach of a "law abiding citizen", regardless of the Constitutionality of the law, only feeds the flames that power the engine that is driving your rights to their grave. Registering, licensing, obtaining a CCW or CHL, voluntarily giving your fingerprints, purchasing firearms through FFL dealers (filling out form 4473), submitting to NICS investigations, etc, all fall into this participatory category.

If you don't want to live in a police state, stop participating in this illegal insanity, following these clearly un-Constitutional laws.

The midnight "knock at your door", is a fear tactic as old as the Communist Manifesto itself. Remember, you reside in a country with close to 300 million privately owned firearms. Nearly 80 million gun owners. Probably half of which will gladly and proudly defend freedom if pushed to do so. Nothing short of a full blown invasion by 4 billion Red Chinese soldiers is going to take your guns away.

That is, so long as you haven't already red flagged yourself by participating in the illegal acts of government who are violating your unalienable rights.

Stand for freedom. Lie down for no one.
 
Is all this going to be done at the federal level, or are they going to allocate money to the states?

How much of that $280 Million is going to be used to go after the people in CA who refused to turn in their SKS's, I wonder...
 
One of the things they bragged about was the 25% increase in gun prosecutions cited in a recent justice department report.

You mean they had FIVE this time?

WOWEE kiddees!

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Gun Control: The proposition that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her own panty hose, is more acceptable than allowing that same woman to defend herself with a firearm.
 
It appears that the NRA has fallen in their own trap in supporting enforcement of existing gun laws.

Klinton has out foxed them again!

Now the NRA is supporting the Klinton anti-gun rights technology project. The NRA is also providing tacit approval of hiring 500 new ATF agents to enforce existing gun laws.

I seem to remember that the NRA previously called the AFT agents "jack booted thugs." So now the NRA wants to give us more "jack booted thugs". Oh, I forgot, there has been a change of attitude since Moses has come to save the NRA and take our so called assault rifles away. GIVE ME A BREAK !

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Always Condition Yellow
 
Yup, Klingon the fox done outfoxed the NRA dummies, who are too busy trying to protect their Washington fat-cat status than to stand up and be counted on the RKBA (have they ever?). As I said before, Thanks, but include me out! ;)

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Be mentally deliberate but muscularly fast. Aim for just above the belt buckle Wyatt Earp
"It is error alone that needs government support; truth can stand by itself." Tom Jefferson
If you have to shoot a man, shoot him in the guts, it may not kill him... sometimes they die slow, but it'll paralyze his brain and arm and the fight is all but over Wild Bill Hickok
Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up.
45 ACP: Give 'em a new navel! BigG
 
I'm with BigG on this one. The NRA has gradually compromised away our rights. In spite of that so many still praise them. Jerry
 
Read through the GCA of '68 and tell me you think all those laws should be enforced. The only people that should be barred the right to bear arms are violent felons, and the psychotically deranged. That's Thomas Jefferson's version of gun control, and its the only version the NRA should support.
 
Add one more to the list of things who should not be allowed to bear arms: Tax agents.

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If stupidity hurt, liberals would be walking around in agony.
 
Hello-o! If the NRA was doing its job, there would be NO GC Acts of 1968, '34 etc., etc. Excuse me, I have to retch! :(

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Be mentally deliberate but muscularly fast. Aim for just above the belt buckle Wyatt Earp
"It is error alone that needs government support; truth can stand by itself." Tom Jefferson
If you have to shoot a man, shoot him in the guts, it may not kill him... sometimes they die slow, but it'll paralyze his brain and arm and the fight is all but over Wild Bill Hickok
Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up.
45 ACP: Give 'em a new navel! BigG
 
When Clinton says he wants to enforce gun laws, does he mean the laws that forbid the using of a gun in a robbery, mugging, rape, etc? Or does he mean the laws which says I cannot have a pistol-grip on my post 1994 FN-FAL?

One law could be said to fight crime. The other only makes criminals of the peaceful gun owner.

Rick

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"Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American." Tench Coxe 2/20/1788
 
All the NRA can do is work with what the American people send to Congress.

All the NRA can do is go to a Congress-critter and say, "This is what our 3 million members want, and this is what we think 80 million gun owners want."

The NRA presents facts, reason and logic. And they hope that when they spend their money, the poli-critters are honest (ie.,stay bought).

When you have a political climate of greed and rampant emotionalism, the NRA's only weapons (logic and facts) are ignored.

WTF else can they do? Start assassinating politicians? Is that what you want them to do?

Did y'all ever thank them for helping clean out Congress after the Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban?

They are doing the best they can, in the current climate, with the current crop of politicians.

And, it seems to me, taking a beating from the very people they are taking a beating to help.

Gratitude. Ain't it grand.

:(LawDog
 
They're doing all they can! :rolleyes: Life is a $h!t sandwich -- you either eat it or starve!! LOL



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Be mentally deliberate but muscularly fast. Aim for just above the belt buckle Wyatt Earp
"It is error alone that needs government support; truth can stand by itself." Tom Jefferson
If you have to shoot a man, shoot him in the guts, it may not kill him... sometimes they die slow, but it'll paralyze his brain and arm and the fight is all but over Wild Bill Hickok
Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up.
45 ACP: Give 'em a new navel! BigG
 
I am with LawDog!
I am impressed with the fact that the highest recommendation for the NRA comes, though accidentally, from the antigun groups like HCI, Sarah Brady, Clinton, and the like. The blame (credit) for the defeat of antigun legislation is always that rotten NRA, as far as I can see, and I have yet to see any other group mentioned regarding such defeat. We are told we have some 80-90 million gun owners in the USA but only 3 million members in the NRA. If we had 80-90 million members, or even half that number, does anyone think we would ever be in the position of having to make those compromises. The small minority seem to be carrying the financial load of fighting for our gun rights while a lot of others carp about their lack of being totally on top of the problem and 100% effective. I will listen to the critics with more sympathy when I see some other progun group given credit for the defeat of antigun measures. We need to stick together!
O J KING, MD

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OJ
NRA LIFE MEMBER
Gun control is a steady hand and hitting with the first shot.

[This message has been edited by OJ (edited January 19, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by OJ (edited January 19, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by OJ (edited January 19, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by OJ (edited January 19, 2000).]
 
Is there any reason that the NRA can't bring lawsuits against the laws such as CA SB 23? If not then they are not doing what they could do. I find that unacceptable. Why can the ACLU go to court and not the NRA? Will some of you NRA dieharders answer that question? Please. Jerry
 
I wish the people who blast the NRA would run and get elected to the Board of Directors and use their big mouths to try and change things. Just how much money do you think the NRA is already spending on law suits around the Country and in different states? How much money have you help raise to fight all these lawsuits. It is a never ending fight. Either lead, follow or get the hell out of the way@%#^%$#&^%$###$%%^

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From my cold dead hands.
 
Fourdiamonds,
Emotionalism won't convince me or anyone else. I asked a question. Do you have the answer? Give me some info on the NRA lawsuits around the country. Tell me what they have done in the courts. I first joined the NRA about 1957 and have been fighting the 2nd Amendment battle for a lot of years. I have seen the NRA deteriorate to an organization of compromise and don't find it acceptable. No I don't intend to try to get elected to the board of directors for a lot of reasons. I still expect the NRA to fight and not compromise. They have no plan to restore rights. I'll support them when I think they are doing the right thing and I won't when I think they are on the wrong track. I don't give blind loyalty to any organization. They seem to have rolled over in CA and in many other areas. Regards, Jerry
 
JERRY.
You asked the question and you will now get an answer.

CRPA AND NRA are joining forces to fight SB23 "ASSault weapons law" that took effect Jan 1st 2000.

CRPA AND NRA have retained Chuck Michel of LA, along with nationally known self defence Civil rights adovocat Stephen Halbrook of Virgina, and Second Amendment scholar and civil rights attorney Don Kates of Frisco.

There's one of your legal battles don't have time to find all the rest for you. No group is perfect but you've got to change them as we are trying to change the government. If we took you viewpoint and put it towards the real problem (government) we would all stop paying taxes. Have you done that yet?
 
;) They woulda hired OJ's lawyers if they were really serious!! :D

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Be mentally deliberate but muscularly fast. Aim for just above the belt buckle Wyatt Earp
"It is error alone that needs government support; truth can stand by itself." Tom Jefferson
If you have to shoot a man, shoot him in the guts, it may not kill him... sometimes they die slow, but it'll paralyze his brain and arm and the fight is all but over Wild Bill Hickok
Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up.
45 ACP: Give 'em a new navel! BigG
 
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