The Gloves Come Off--MMM Reveals True Goal

johnr

New member
This was posted yesterday on the wagc.com forum:

Gun Ownership and Incest
by
Helen
I work with the National Million Moms March, and just wanted to pass along some info.

Researches at Cornell Univesity have conducted a 5 yr. study into the social implications of gun ownership.

They found that men who own hand guns are 30% prone to bouts of binge drinking, often ending up in court for drunk driving and/or domestic abuse.


19% of *Women* who own hand guns admit to having past experiances with molestaion, date rape or incest.

56.7% of hand gun owning men -- tested likely to engage in incest. The report suggested vasectomies as a remedy.

It's time to protect our children. We can end this sick cycle by banning all forms of privately owned fire arms.
____________________________________________

Read that last paragraph very carefully.
I posted this on freerepublic.com under the subject title & got 35 responses--spread the word!
 
Note that this "Helen" gives no citation for the alleged Cornell study.

That 19% of women handgunowners reflects the same percent in all women across the board, gunowning or not.
And 56.7% of handgun owning men "likely to commit incest"....oh, puhleeze! This is laughable....and the solution is a vasectomy???!!! Yeah, vasectomies are well-known to curb sexual aggression ;)



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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" RKBA!
 
56.7 % of firearms owners would engage in incest ? Where do they get this crap & how could they even research this ?

I suppose a lie told enough to idiots becomes truth.

You know I am really starting to HATE these people as opposed to just being disgusted by them. They are incapable of anything but lies & evil constantly.
 
Scud--I've been in the RKBA fight since about 1966, first politician I supported was Barry Goldwater in '64, and only recently have the scales fallen from my eyes--yes, those opposing us lie easily, glibly, and often! ANd a BIG lie is better, because foolish people say, "well, he'd never lie about something that serious!" In fact, almost always in a debate, the left begins with a slander, slur, insult, or a general denigriation of your humanity--and then it *really* goes downhill. Go to the forum at wagc.com ( it's back a few pages ) and follow "Helen's" post & the responses--it's very educational!

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"live free or die trying..."
 
This is obviously a bogus study that never happened. "Helen" might even be a misguided pro-gun person who thinks that posting erroneous information that can be easily disproved will hurt the anti's cause.

I prefer to use facts and logic to fight the fight. This type of thing really doesn't help our cause. Thanks for posting it though, johnr, it could be an eye-opener for some.


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RKBA!
"The people have the right to bear arms for their defense and security"
Ohio Constitution, Article I, Section 4 Concealed Carry is illegal in Ohio.
Ohioans for Concealed Carry Website
 
Dear Helen,
You have abused your self much too often.
Get help or go back in the closet.

Sincerely (washing my hands)
jeffer
 
Hey, William's on to something here.
"Leading scientists show link to use of white bread and impaired thinking". A recent survey of MMM participants and corroborating study of serial killers shows an alarming connection to the use of white bread. Leading researcher Re Le Kirmungon stated that the alarming results of his study indicate that our prison systems are incapable of holding all of the impaired thinkers in the US. He called for an immediate ban on the sale and use of white bread and requests additional federal funding for studying the long term effects. If we can just save one mom!
 
Something that Helen likely hears often: "Scratch the weenie, sugar, then wash your hands and bring me a salad."

Real intelleckt.
 
An old tactic of anti-gun propagandists; If you do a deliberately crude statistical analysis, of the sort which would get you flunked in statistics 101, gun owners seem to be more likely to do just about ANYTHING which... might result in the police searching their homes.

Well, Duh! You can only guess at the number of people who own guns and lead unremarkable lives, because, let's face it, a lot of us don't comply with registration laws, and lie to polsters. But do something scummy, and the police search your home and KNOW whether or not you're a gun owner.

Legitimate statisticians go to great lengths to adjust for this factor, the propagandists deliberately play it up.

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Sic semper tyrannis!
 
There are many incompetent people in the world.
Dr. David A. Dunning is haunted by the fear that he
might be one of them.

Dunning, a professor of psychology at Cornell,
worries about this because, according to his
research, most incompetent people do not know
that they are incompetent.

On the contrary. People who do things badly,
Dunning has found in studies conducted with a
graduate student, Justin Kruger, are usually
supremely confident of their abilities -- more
confident, in fact, than people who do things well.

``I began to think that there were probably lots of
things that I was bad at, and I didn't know it,''
Dunning said.

One reason that the ignorant also tend to be the
blissfully self-assured, the researchers believe, is
that the skills required for competence often are the
same skills necessary to recognize competence.

The incompetent, therefore, suffer doubly, they
suggested in a paper appearing in the December
issue of the Journal of Personality and Social
Psychology.

``Not only do they reach erroneous conclusions and
make unfortunate choices, but their incompetence
robs them of the ability to realize it,'' wrote Kruger,
now an assistant professor at the University of
Illinois, and Dunning.

This deficiency in ``self-monitoring skills,'' the
researchers said, helps explain the tendency of the
humor-impaired to persist in telling jokes that are
not funny, of day traders to repeatedly jump into the
market -- and repeatedly lose out -- and of the
politically clueless to continue holding forth at dinner
parties on the fine points of campaign strategy.

In a series of studies, Kruger and Dunning tested
their theory of incompetence. They found that
subjects who scored in the lowest quartile on tests
of logic, English grammar and humor were also the
most likely to ``grossly overestimate'' how well they
had performed.

In all three tests, subjects' ratings of their ability
were positively linked to their actual scores. But the
lowest-ranked participants showed much greater
distortions in their self-estimates.

Asked to evaluate their performance on the test of
logical reasoning, for example, subjects who scored
only in the 12th percentile guessed that they had
scored in the 62nd percentile, and deemed their
overall skill at logical reasoning to be at the 68th
percentile.

Similarly, subjects who scored at the 10th percentile
on the grammar test ranked themselves at the 67th
percentile in the ability to ``identify grammatically
correct standard English,'' and estimated their test
scores to be at the 61st percentile.

On the humor test, in which participants were asked
to rate jokes according to their funniness (subjects'
ratings were matched against those of an ``expert''
panel of professional comedians), low-scoring
subjects were also more apt to have an inflated
perception of their skill. But because humor is
idiosyncratically defined, the researchers said, the
results were less conclusive.

Unlike unskilled counterparts, the most able
subjects in the study, Kruger and Dunning found,
were likely to underestimate their competence. The
researchers attributed this to the fact that, in the
absence of information about how others were
doing, highly competent subjects assumed that
others were performing as well as they were -- a
phenomenon psychologists term the ``false
consensus effect.''

When high-scoring subjects were asked to ``grade''
the grammar tests of their peers, however, they
quickly revised their evaluations of their own
performance. In contrast, the self-assessments of
those who scored badly themselves were unaffected
by the experience of grading others; some subjects
even further inflated their estimates of their own
abilities.

``Incompetent individuals were less able to
recognize competence in others,'' the researchers
concluded.

In a final experiment, Dunning and Kruger set out to
discover if training would help modify the
exaggerated self-perceptions of incapable subjects.
In fact, a short training session in logical reasoning
did improve the ability of low-scoring subjects to
assess their performance realistically, they found.

The findings, the psychologists said, support
Thomas Jefferson's assertion that ``he who knows
best knows how little he knows.''

And the research meshes neatly with other work
indicating that overconfidence is common; studies
have found, for example, that the vast majority of
people rate themselves as ``above average'' on a
wide array of abilities -- though such an abundance
of talent would be impossible in statistical terms.
This overestimation, studies indicate, is more likely
for tasks that are difficult than for those that are
easy.

Such studies are not without critics. Dr. David C.
Funder, a psychology professor at the University of
California at Riverside, for example, said he
suspects that most lay people have only a vague
idea of the meaning of ``average'' in statistical terms.

``I'm not sure the average person thinks of `average'
or `percentile' in quite that literal a sense,'' Funder
said, ``so `above average' might mean to them
`pretty good,' or `OK,' or `doing all right.' And if, in
fact, people mean something subjective when they
use the word, then it's really hard to evaluate
whether they're right or wrong, using the statistical
criterion.''

But Dunning said his current research and past
studies indicated there are many reasons why
people would tend to overestimate their
competency and not be aware of it.

In various situations, feedback is absent, or at least
ambiguous; even a humorless joke, for example, is
likely to be met with polite laughter. And faced with
incompetence, social norms prevent most people
from blurting out ``You stink!'' -- truthful though this
assessment may be.
=A92000 San Francisco Chronicle Page A1
 
This is some kind of Internet fake.
I know the social sciences well and a relation to gun ownership and incest of that magnitude would be known by now.

Vasectomies make no sense in this context.
Castration wouldn't either.

So, it make a be hoax by a progunner, like
the fake HCI plan or Hitler quote, or an antigunner.

So JohnR, put up or shut up with a citation and source of the study.
 
Lighten up Glenn--it's not my study. I agree that it is nonsensical--I posted it, verbatim from the board it was on for educational purposes. Later, a pal on the board e-mailed me that this "Helen" claims she's being spammed and that "we should all lay off her." Real or hoax, I make no claim--it's there for your consideration.
 
I wonder what percent of presidents in the last eight years who are Anti American gun haters have commited sex crimes?????????? <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by johnr:
This was posted yesterday on the wagc.com forum:

Gun Ownership and Incest
by
Helen
I work with the National Million Moms March, and just wanted to pass along some info.

Researches at Cornell Univesity have conducted a 5 yr. study into the social implications of gun ownership.

They found that men who own hand guns are 30% prone to bouts of binge drinking, often ending up in court for drunk driving and/or domestic abuse.


19% of *Women* who own hand guns admit to having past experiances with molestaion, date rape or incest.

56.7% of hand gun owning men -- tested likely to engage in incest. The report suggested vasectomies as a remedy.

It's time to protect our children. We can end this sick cycle by banning all forms of privately owned fire arms.
____________________________________________

Read that last paragraph very carefully.
I posted this on freerepublic.com under the subject title & got 35 responses--spread the word!

[/quote]
 
Helen obviously knows nothing of logic or real statistical analysis, but then, so do most of our opponents.

Nuttier than my Mom's Christmas fruitcakes.
 
I will say it again:

Correlation does NOT equal causation.

Although this may seem like a natural logical progression, we accept the opposite to be true on a daily basis.

A study was once done which tested the SAT score of schoolchildren ages 6-18. One of the correlations that came from this study was that there was a strong positive correlation between the SAT score and the child's arm length. Before you put Junior on the rack, let's not forget about the fact that Age and Education come into play :)

The most famous example is the "genetic" arguement for alcoholism. Children do have a higher disposition of becoming alcoholics then the general population, but many try to imply that this means that it is somehow an inherited trait. (I'll dig this one up later for anyone who cares)

Almost %99.999999 of serial killers are men. Should we round up men because serial killers come from their ranks? No, that would be silly.

However, this same logic applies to 70,000,000 gun owners being punished for the actions of a smaller subset.

Besides, we're x times more likely to die because we own a firearm-- x more times likely than the person who lives in a bubble, I suppose.

Unless you can control all other factors, you cannot validly say that one thing "causes" another.
 
Sumabich, how bout a scientific study that links participants in the .05Million Moron March to driving minivans, attending soccer games, AND impaired logical processes.
 
To One & ALL--Thanks for your participation in this thread.
I'm going to close it out, because a pal of mine at wagc has requested "we lay off Helen."
It seems this 'Helen' claims she's being spammed, didn't originate the post, etc. ( cut to the Mussolini of the Ozarks saying, "Hey! I didn't do that--that other guy did it! ) Whatever.
I STILL have no doubt that the 1,000,000,000 Moos DO have "total victim disarmament" as their goal while they hide behind "sensible" sanctimony.
Stay vigilant--and support sas-aim, jpfo, goa, etc.--they're fighting for YOU!
johnr


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"live free or die trying..."
 
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