The definition of Insanity... UK self-defense laws

M

mehavey

New member
> The question at issue asks, “Are there any legal self defence products
> that I can buy?” Succinctly epitomizing the sad state of natural rights
> in Great Britain, the first sentence states, “The only fully legal self
> defence product at the moment is a rape alarm.”
https://www.nraila.org/articles/201...-not-to-harm-their-attackers-get-a-rape-alarm

This is the natural evolution of a state wherein all power -- including self
defense -- is reserved as the absolute prerogative of that State and it's
official organs. That it is happening in what many regard as the mother
country from which this country sprang makes it doubly painful to watch.

It is the very definition of a nightmare... and one which a growing
segment of our own society now see as a most desirable outcome.

Still, there's hope...
https://www.nraila.org/articles/201...ncealed-carry-licenses-to-eligible-applicants
... but it is a never-ending battle.

Film at Eleven
 
I was born in the "Mother Country"

And it has changed a lot! I left in 1965, off to Australia, for three years, we, a family of 4 , my Wife, my daughter, aged 5, Michael aged 2.

Supposed to be our new home! My Wife hated Australia! we stayed the mandated 3 years, off to Canada, I did not want to go back to Liverpool.

My Mother was very ill, we went home, just too late!

Now why the change is recent! Going out for supper, a Friday night, an Indian!

Out with Sister in Law, and her husband. As an aside, 6'4" husband, shoulders as wide as a barn door, couldn't fight his way out of a wet paper bag (past incident as evidence!) needless to say, big punch up in the Indian Restaurant.

Me, ex Bouncer, 33 YOA, 4 yobos, in early 20s. After the 2 minute battle, they left, chased out of door by yours truly with a chair!

The booth the 4 had been sat in, lots of blood, me, swelled right fist, sport coat, collar and tie, creased trousers, shinny black shoes (steel toe caps!) and glasses still on.

Called Police, two responders, two cars. Took notes, one outside, on radio.
Asked description of the 4 hero's, got it. Read from his note book.

Two broken noses, 3 broken ribs (same person) one broken arm (the chair) and various cuts, and contusions!

Was I detained? Charged, arrested? None of those, instructed to eat in the City next time we went out for supper!

The old way of the Cops, 4 against one, they lost, Ah Well! That was 1968.

1962, working on the Door of The Cavern, of Beatles fame, a man I would not let in, it was too late. Tried to kill me with an ice pick (home made one) ended up in my right wrist, he was very badly injured, me puncture wound on inside of wrist.

Was I detained? Charged, arrested? Same answer, no. Times have changed.
Ask English Bobbies if they wanted Glocks on their belts? They would quit!

They do have special units who are armed. Self defense was once a good defense, not anymore.
 
I will never go there again,,,

I visited friends in London about 9 years ago,,,
That country and I will never meet again.

The three of us had gone out to dinner,,,
We walked the 1/2 mile from their apartment.

On the way back a small group of punks started cat-calling my friends wife,,,
I stopped and gave them the middle-finger salute.

One of them charged at me yelling and cursing,,,
I stepped into his charge and dropped him with one good punch.

Cops swarmed the scene,,,
Seriously there must have been a dozen of them.

Long story short the punk with the bloody nose was allowed to leave,,,
I on the other hand was detained at the station for about 3 hours.

I had to listen to no less than three lectures on how "violence" is not allowed,,,
I flew home two days later and will never go there again.

I can't understand the mindset of any governing body,,,
Who willingly sacrifice some of their population,,,
Simply to maintain a façade of control.

Aarond

.
 
My last extended time in London/the surroundings was in `79 when things were exceptionally civilized and the Cabbies could still recite the Knowledge.

It was just beginning its long slide....

Sad.

Aarond said:
"...I can't understand the mindset of any governing
body who willingly sacrifice some of their population
Simply to maintain a façade of control.
Click to expand...
Obviously, Arrond, you and Oklahoma fail the "civilized" test. ;)
 
I altered the title. I wish people would be more specific. I thought this thread might be about the legal issue of insanity.

Insanity is a specific legal usage that people sometimes mistakenly use in common parlance to imply 'crazy' behavior.

It is an issue for L and CR but this is a different topic.
 
I almost married an Englishwoman about 15 years ago. The plan was to split our time between the U.S. and England.

It's probably a good thing the relationship ended.
 
I think the 'Bobbies' concept underwent major sea change
as a result of the IRA bombings starting the in the `70s
 
I worked in England for a while. I carried an ordinary Swiss Army knife. I once forgot it was in my pocket when visiting the Houses of Parliament. The security guard was very nice about it and offered to hold it to be picked up when I was ready to leave. He did inspect it very carefully to ensure that none of the blades would lock. If they had, I would have been arrested, because carrying a locking pocket knife is illegal.

I told the guard I might be absent minded, but I wasn't stupid.
 
Its not just England, although it makes an easy target to point at.
Look at the latest stuff from DC right here.
 
My wife's British, other then a biannual visit to her father and brother she hates going back. As to her friends back home, she reminds them that she's now an American citizen and their very welcome to visit her in the States anytime they wish to come over.:)
 
Wasn't it an Englishman who said, "die if you must, but never fight back" or something like that?

One finds fools in all cultures.
 
I think the legal definition of insanity in the UK is the same as ours, Britain is where it came from, but they have verdicts of Guilty, but Insane.
 
I once accepted the idea of British police as the bumbling, but good hearted village Bobby. After having spent some time in England, I concluded that if I had to choose between being in the custody of the British cops or the Gestapo, I might have a hard time choosing.
Click to expand...
That depends in what part of the UK you are in. The police in Northern Ireland for example had to adapt to meet the threat, all are armed on and off duty. In most of the UK the police are still unarmed, and rely on armed response units. As for self defense you can use whatever force necessary including lethal force. Like I would think you can in most countries.
 
The insanity verdict did come out of England but the US has about 4 versions in recent and/or current usage. Easy to find on the web.

What they use across the Pond now, no idea.
 
I spent some time in Dover England . We did a port call there. I did see two Bobby's near the pier that were armed the day we arrived. However, the rest of the Bobby's I saw, over the next several days, were all unarmed. There were a couple of fights in the streets between locals(drunk), but they were more bark than bite and the Bobby's that responded just broke them up and sent them on their way.
 
The idea that "crazy" people are "touched by the gods", and not responsible is very old, possibly predating civilization and law. It is found in many cultures.

To a degree, some cultures even extended the "not responsible" to drunks and others not in their right minds. And, of course, there is a lot of variation in different times, and places.

Not guilty due to insanity, guilty but not responsible, or any other phrase is just a legal term. It is an identifier, or classifier, if you will.

Too many people think that a not guilty due to insanity verdict is "getting away with murder", literally. It's not. It just means that they don't go to regular prison. Life in a mental ward might be physically safer than life in a general prison, but it is still life behind bars.

As far as my opinion goes, ANY government that denies you the legal ability to defend yourself is denying a fundamental natural right. All it does is give the criminal a "safe work environment".

Even the English government recognized this, once upon a time. Seems like today, they no longer do...
 
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