The Almighty AK Why?

J

Jamie Young

New member
I have previously owned a Russian Saiga rifle but got rid of it for one reason alone. It only came with 5rd mags and I got into a bad situation one time up the mountains and that was the only Semi Auto rifle I owned at the time. I was so freaked out by the fact I was so undergunned in the situation that I sold the gun and went out and got a Mini 14 with PMI mags. I really liked the gun otherwise and I kinda regret selling it. I'll buy something eventually in the AK family again but I have this question.

As far as I know the Saiga rifle is mechanically pretty much an AK and I am familiar with that design. What exactly is it about the AK that makes it so durable. The bolt to me seemed to be a lot stronger than other semi auto's I've fired. Is it less moving parts? The gas operation?
 
The AK is a very rugged gun. All the parts are big, easy to clean, and require minimal maintenance. No special cleaning tools or techniques are required. Reliability is excellent, even in adverse conditions like cold, snow and desert sand. It is controllable in full auto fire thanks to the relatively light recoil and in spite of a less than optimal stock shape for maximum control. It is relatively light (compared to full power rifles with selective fire capability, like the M14) and carries easily.

The cartridge was designed and intended as a military cartridge, and considered more than adequate for use against personnel and light vehicles. Obviously, it may not be the caliber of choice for hunting dangerous game, even if multiple shots are available.

Some of the advantages apply mostly to a military role, but the AK was designed as a military rifle. For a purely hunting rifle for medium to large game, a bolt action sporter might be better.

Jim
 
If you like the Saiga you might want to look at a Kreb's
converted Saiga. He cuts the barrel down to 14" puts a very effective muzzlebreak on and recongures the receiver into an AK-47 pistol config that takes high-cap mags.
 
AK design has looser tolerances than most rifles, so dirt and wear affect it less. But this adds to inaccuracy while shooting.
 
"Krebs" is Mark Krebs who does the above described modifications of the Russian Saiga. Since Kalashnikov USA uses him for their modified Saigas, he's got to be good.
 
Is he like a gunsmith you send your Saiga out to? I really like the way the scope mounted on the gun and I liked the scope recticle. I HATE THE MAGS. The Gun shop that sold me the gun told me it took AK mags to make matters worse. Luckily I tried one of my buddies mak90 mags and they didn't work so I never wasted money on mags. Atleast if your A Mini 14 owner you can find mags for the gun. I don't think anything but 5rd mags ever existed. The gun manual said they had 10rd mags but I spent 3yrs looking for them and everyone said they never made them. WHAT A WASTE! I know its meant for hunting but they didn't have to make different mags for them. I did figure out how to modify AK mags but I didn't want to waste time or risk doing things illegally. SOLD! I'd rather buy a Mak90 or something else.

How good are those Saiga .308's?
 
I have been looking real hard at the saigas in .308. They seem like a well made gun and the ones I looked at all had 10 rnd mags. They seem a little expensive at $500.00 or so, around here.
 
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I had this Saiga built last year.My original idea was that this would beat SB23's definition of an AW.Which it did untill Aug of last year when the Kali DOJ changed the standards again making it an AW.The newer more modern gas system in the Saiga,with an AK74 brake,makes recoil almost non-existent.Much better than the AK 47,much more accurate to.
 
guess all ak users walk around with safety disengaged

because that thing adds an entire second to your raise and fire times. Screw how reliable it is if it lets ALL my enemies get off 3-4 good shots before I can even FIRE! Gotta at LEAST a smith create a speed safety for it. Lack of .22 unit = a lot less snapshooting practice, no indoor range practice, no foraging. Lack of GI rd means gotta carry LOTS more ammo for it, and both the ak and its rds weigh a lot more than 223's. Fatique = trouble, before gun ever even gets fired.
 
A simple solution to the slow safety: leave it off while on patrol.

Another solution, if you want to incur the expense, is to get the rifle converted to use a Galil style safety/selector.

Personally, my index finger is long enough to flip off the safety without moving my hand completely off the P-grip.
 
I suppose it was terribly un PC to to show an unengaged safty on an empty magazine,excuseeeeeeeee meeeeee!The safety on the AK is the biggest drawback,wether you use your forefinger to disengage the safety or chambering a round by pulling the bolt back there is an audible noise to effectivly thwart the element of surprise.
 
Mark, What part of that Saiga is now illegal per SB23? You did a good job "sanitizing" it, I see no conspicuously protruding pistol grip, muzzle brake vs. flash supressor, no bayo lug, no folding stock, for all practical purposes it would appear to be every bit as legal as the California-modified Springfield M1A, or the Ruger Mini-14. Or is that a threaded muzzle under that brake?

I couldn't leave Sacramento, California for Florida fast enough when SB-23 was passed, My AK, AR, BM-59, M14NM, and FAL had already been labeled by the DOJ as "evil". The big sticking point was when my wife's Browning BAR with BOSS was placed in that gray area, especially when they were arguing the definition of pistol grip, to include drawing that famous red line from the bottom of the receiver, through the exposed trigger, and backwards through the grip. This was about the same time Turner's yanked Browning BAR's and Remington 7400's off the shelf, to avoid any Lockyer/DOJ extreme interpretations and subsequent arrests. After 10 years in California, Florida was awfully nice, they actually sell guns and ammo at the gun shows here, vs. the coin, indian jewelry, beef jerky, and antique show with the occasional gun here and there. (Cal Expo)

And my AK has the fishing line modification on the safety bar, so it's a lot quieter and quicker into action. Although, if the gun were to see some action, I'd be more than comfortable leaving the safety off, considering the escalation of the events dictating the need for the AK's firepower to begin with.

Shiro, I agree, it appears Hardin has been saving up a lifetime of posts, and has unleashed them upon an unsuspecting TFL population. Things could get real interesting soon, depending on how hard he pushes people's buttons...
 
Gewehr98,in the DOJ's infinite wisdom after they released the list of restriced firearms back in 99 they realized that any firearm with a Kalashnikov type reciever was inherently evil.A/o Aug 16th Saiga's were no longer legal to buy in Kali.But Ah hah!It's still perfectly legal to buy a Fal in Kali without a pistol grip.

This Saiga does have a threaded,and shortened barrel and the brake is welded on.There is no difference from the Mini 14's or the M1a's except for where it came from.
 
dog1 I have never seen a Saiga rifle sell for anything more than $400. I saw a few .308 ones at a gun show for $300. I paid about $400 for my rifle at the time and I probable could have done better. I know the Saiga .308 mags are a rip off if you can find them though. I don't know how accurate they are anyone know? The .308 that is?

Do all AK rifles not have the bolt open feature? Are guns that don't stay open after the last round is fired more reliable? I was wondering about that. Nobody has answered that question I originally asked about the AK bolt? Is the Ak Bolt stronger than AR's Mini 14's FAL's? My Saiga was a bitch to hold back!!!
 
SodaPop, There were only a few AK variants that had the bolt hold open feature, I think some of the Yugoslavian or Finnish versions, and they needed something special on the magazine follower. The AK-47 forum, in particular Tantal, would be a good place to find out exactly which model.

As far as reliability is concerned, the bolt hold open doesn't really mean that much. It's actually extra parts, and the more complicated a design, the more that can go wrong. Sure, in a firefight, it's good to know when you've run empty, but that doesn't preclude a tactical reload partway into a 30, 40, or 75 round magazine. You're not going full auto, anyway, where 30 rounds blip out before you know it. (Not a lot of full auto firefights documented in the US, hence my assumption)

I have no idea if the AK bolt is any stronger, or less so, than the Ruger Mini-14 or Mini-30. The average user isn't going to know the difference in bolt strength between the AK, AR, FAL, Mini-14, G3, M14/M1A, etc. It either works or it doesn't. The only thing leading to a possible advantage is the fact that the AK and it's derivatives have armed a huge chunk of this world's armies, with a history that will take a Mini-14 a LONG time to catch up to, if it ever does.
 
The only AKish rifle, of which I am aware, that has a bolt hold open device is the Czech Vz-58. However, the Vz-58 isn't really an AK, although it looks prett similar. It has a tipping bolt, like a FAL or BAR, the gas system is short stroke (if I remember correctly), the recoil system is different, and the magazines are longer from front to rear to allow for the tab that trips the hold open device. That's not even all, either.

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