Super Magnums

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azredhawk44

Moderator
I've been toying with the idea of a 1500+ ft/lb handgun. Not sure what I want, but here's what I want to do with it:

It's not really for self defense while hunting/hiking. I'd rather carry my .44 unless life finds me in Alaska for some reason (possible someday, but unlikely).

I'd like to start pistol hunting in Arizona for deer, elk, black bear, and javelina. I'd also like to be able to hunt anything in the Pacific Northwest also, since I will probably relocate back there at some point. I think the bear and elk are bigger up there, but still not grizzly-sized or moose-sized.

My leading contenders are:

1. Dan Wesson 445 supermag. Also shoots .44mag and .44special.
2. S&W .460 XVR (.460, .454, and .45LC)
3. Super Redhawk .480
4. Magnum Research BFR in .45/70
5. Thompson Center Contender in .44, .357, .30-30, .223 and .45/70

Shot capacity is really not an issue. I don't expect to empty the cylinder on any of these except for at the range.

I have a friend with a Dan Wesson that had the forcing cone blow off the barrel. I'm a bit leary of that, as well as the number of times the company has gone under and come back.

The .460XVR intimidates me a bit. I've shot a .454 once and it hit HARD. I don't know how high pressure the .460 is.

The super redhawk in .480 sounds good because it is the lowest pressure supermagnum offered by Ruger right now, and I have 2 other ruger revolvers I am very happy with.

The BFR in .45/70 sounds good due to the variety in pressure available for the .45/70. It can nearly match the .44 magnum or eclipse the .454 in energy. The only drawback is I have never handled or shot one, and probably won't be able to do so until I have ordered and purchased one for myself.

The TC sounds like a great investment because I can shoot a lot of cartridges I already have in it. I would rather have at least 2 shots, though, in case a fast follow-up is necessary. Another plus to it is I can also choose the right power level for the game I am after.

Which should I go with? Anyone have experience with these specific 5 guns, or with the .445, .460, .454, .480 or .45/70 in handguns? And lastly, where can you get custom wildcat barrels for a T/C (if I really wanted a .445 badly, or a .414, or something odd).
 
If I read what you are up to right, I reccomend the 445 supermag.

Tons 'o fun, and since you already have a 44 mag all you need is different brass. Everthing else for the 44 works in the 445.
 
DW in 445 and Ruger in 480 just aren't popular enough to bother with IMHO.

BFR in 45-70 would be my choice. Low recoil with high performance is a match that can't be beaten. The newer 45-70 BFRs can also be bought with a 450 Marlin cylinder too!:eek: The 450 isn't popular either but it does make a wonderfull addition to the 45-70 which will never lose it's popularity.

Look at some of the loads on the 450 Marlin by Buffalo Bore:

430 gr. LBT-LFN (1900 fps /M.E. 3446 ft. lbs.)
405 gr. JFN. (1975 fps / M.E. 3507 ft. lbs.)

Expensive yes, but loading your own will solve that problem.

On the 45-70 you would have to call BFR and ask if you can use their ammunition specifically as Buffalo Bore does not list BFR by name in the user disclaimer. If they say yes, the 45-70 is:

430 gr. L.B.T.- L.F.N. - G.C. (1925 fps / M.E. 3537 ft. lbs.)
405 gr. J.F.N. (2000 fps / M.E. 3597 ft. lbs.)
350 gr. J.F.N. (2150 fps / M.E. 3592 ft. lbs.)
500 gr. FMJFN (1625 fps /M.E. 2931 ft. lbs.)
300gr. Speer Uni Core @ 2350 fps (3678 ft. lbs.)

Expensive again, but loading your own will solve that problem.

Also note the 500 S&W BB compared to the 45-70/450 Marlin. You must also figure in for performance loss on the 45-70/450 combo due to shorter barrell length.

400 gr. JFN 1,675 fps M.E.2491 ft.lbs
440 gr. LFN-GC 1,625 fps M.E.2579 ft.lbs
440 gr. LFN-GC 1,325 fps M.E.1715 ft.lbs

Good luck on your pick.
 
I've shot every one of those except the BFR in 45-70..which I hope I can do soon. Even though I havent shot the BFR I'd say that would be my choice. Also, the 460 isnt as bad as you'd think. Less recoil than a Ruger SRH in .454 Casull. Really I'd say you cant go wrong with any of these guns.
 
I think the S&W 460 is interesting as it is very versatile and packs quite a punch. It offers rifle ballistics and range from a handgun, while also being able to shoot 454 and 45C. That is awesome. I also agree with BigYac that the 460 isn't that bad. I think the reason why is that the loads are fairly light for it, so it doesn't generate horrendous recoil like the 500S&W does. I only shot about a cylinder full of the 460 cartridges through my buddies and although stout, the recoil wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be.
 
I like options 2. 3 and 4. The calibers are common enought so It narrows it down to platform. I like the BFR the best. I havnt shot one but those who have like it and say the recoil is very tame. however it is a handloaders gun do to lite commercial loadings you may want to reload them hotter. I like the super redhawk but would choose it in 454 caull ( you can shoot hot 45lc's out of it as well) nothing wrong with the 480 ruger . The bfr is single action the ruger and the smith are double's. The smith is versitile in that it shoots 45lc and .454 casull as well but is rather large for them to better suite the .460 mag. Ammo is too expensive in .460 mag and a little to much gun mass I think compared to the bfr. If your a handloader go bfr.
 
Of your top contenders, I vote for the 460 S&W. As others have said, the recoil isn't as bad as you think.

I shot the 460 & 500 about a month ago. The weight of the guns and the compensator take out a lot of the "felt recoil". Honestly, they didn't have half the recoil I was expecting. They were more comfortabe to shoot than my 357 snubby.
 
I agree with what cje and Garand Guy say, I believe its the compensators that help the recoil on the 500 and 460. I shot both, several boxes of each (thankfully we reload) and the muzzle flip is nothing like my Ruger Super Redhawk in .454 Casull. Where my .454 rolls in your hand and flips upward, the 500 and 460 are more of a push back into your hand, the muzzle maybe raises 4 to 6 inches. Actually I took some vids with my digital cam when I was shooting my .454 the 500 and the 460. Maybe its the engineer in me but I tend to look at and analyze things a bit too much, anyways I played each movie slow and at times went frame by frame and you can definately see my .454 rolling back in my hands then rotating my arms upward a bit, which happens so fast when you shoot you dont realize it. While doing the same with the videos of the 460 and 500 there was no rotating of the gun in my hand, just a straight back push and the muzzle coming up a few inches. My experience with every big bore I've shot is that the stories you hear about the recoil is pretty much all hype. When I got my .454 I heard stories of front sights to th forehead...its nowhere near that bad as long as you have a firm grip on it. I actually one handed it for the first time this weekend which wasnt bad either. I definately see a 500 and 460 in my very near future, along with a BFR in 45-70 and possibly .444 Marlin too:D One last thing, I loves muzzle flash, I get nice big flames from my .454 with 296 powder also with those compensators on the 500 and 460 you get a nice flame from the end of the barrel.
 
Okay, so I am hearing big noise for the S&W 460xvr and the BFR in .45/70. Does anyone have max and min pressure stats for these two out of their respective guns listed here? And then bullet weight and velocity? I'd like whatever one can throw 300-400gr downrange as flat as possible to 150 yards out of an 8" barrel. Also interested in lighter bullets (200-250gr?) for deer and javelina, still flat out to 150 yards. I figure that will be my furthest distance for a scoped handgun.

Also, since the BFR is single action, doesn't it roll back hard in the hand and pinch the web of your thumb, as well as have a lot of muzzle flip? I am hearing from some of you guys that the recoil on the S&W is more linear and that the muzzle break helps a lot.
 
460 S&w

The only factory loads that I know of in 460 come in a 260gr polymer tipped bullet. They clock at 2300 fps. From what I've read, if you're holding zero at 50 yds, then you will be holding zero at 250 yds!:D

FWIW, the 500 mag I shot was a 350gr bullet clocking at 1900 fps.
 
azredhawk44 said:
Okay, so I am hearing big noise for the S&W 460xvr and the BFR in .45/70. Does anyone have max and min pressure stats for these two out of their respective guns listed here? And then bullet weight and velocity? I'd like whatever one can throw 300-400gr downrange as flat as possible to 150 yards out of an 8" barrel. Also interested in lighter bullets (200-250gr?) for deer and javelina, still flat out to 150 yards. I figure that will be my furthest distance for a scoped handgun.

Also, since the BFR is single action, doesn't it roll back hard in the hand and pinch the web of your thumb, as well as have a lot of muzzle flip? I am hearing from some of you guys that the recoil on the S&W is more linear and that the muzzle break helps a lot.
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yes the BFR rolls in the hand, much like my .454 in Super Redhawk does. The best way to hold one of these big handguns is to lock the elbows and leave the wrists free to roll with the recoil. Yes the muzzle will flip up some, but when holding the gun this way after the wrists roll the arms will follow and go upwards a bit too. Rolling takes away some of the recoil. Atleast thats how it is for me
 
There really is no need not to use the .44 magnum you already have. The big caliber and hosepower craze of today is not really needed for any game animal in the lower 48 states of America.
 
There really is no need not to use the .44 magnum you already have. The big caliber and hosepower craze of today is not really needed for any game animal in the lower 48 states of America.
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I agree assuming it's a sturdy .44 that can handle hot loads. I just shot my Super Blackhawk with the Buff. Bore +P+ rounds. Fun!! I have to load only 1 round at a time because this gun does not have the long cylinders that others have, like the Redhawk family.

However, if you need justification for another gun, go for it!! Heck, I bought my Marlin just because I was sent the wrong ammo, was told to keep it, but didn't have anything to shoot it with!:D
 
For hunting I always think of a single action since all shots are generally taken in single action and this style gun allows a follow up shot if one is needed.

From your choices I would choose a bfr and while everyone is talking about the super duper loads I am thinking that the light duty factory loads would more than do the job since you are still talking 45-70 loads.

The only other single action I would consider besides a bfr is a freedom arms single action, but they are a lot more expensive though. I am not up on current prices though but I am thinking double the price.

The one thing about freedom arms though is you could get the 475 linebaugh version and this is the round the 480 you mentioned comes from. The 480 is just a shortened 475 linebaugh. You could also get the 454 casull version if you wish.

I think part of your choice might come down to if you want to shoot very low pressure rounds like the 45-70 vs very high pressure rounds which is what most of the others seem to be.

Another reason I would consider the freedom arms is that you are dealing with pistol rounds in a handgun rather than rifle rounds in a handgun. While the bfr is neat looking I don't know how I would like handling a lot of rounds target shooting with the gun to get used to how it shoots.
 
I just shot a BFR in 450 Marlin (10" barrel) using some 350gr factory loads. It was rather unpleasant!
Recoil was quite massive and somewhat painful. It was controlable and not as bad as I was expecting but I wasn't up to the task. Full power loads out of a 450/45-70 BFR are something you would need to work up to. The gun is also very large and very heavy. It was very well made and is probably quite accurate.

I also just shot some 320gr. hardcast hand loads out of my 4" 629. (light barrel) My starting loads were more painful and unpleasant than the 450.

I would think that the 45-70 would be very pleasant with factory ammo, due to it's size and weight. I would likely have it Magnaported and slowly work into full power loads.With the right bullet and load I don't imagine there is anything you couldn't ethically hunt with this gun.
 
I'd get a Ruger SRH in .454....

There are some real bunny fart .45 colt loads out there, as well a moderate .45 colt will take any game you'd be after, and you'd have the advantage of .454.
 
You don’t need a supermag to get 1500ft-lbs, Buffalo Bore makes .44mag +p+ that gibes you over 1600ft-lb from 7.5in redhawk;)
 
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