Suggestions for my first rifle - Help!!

R

rvb

New member
I'll be starting a new job in a couple months and I'm thinking about setting aside a portion of the signing bonus on my first long-gun, but I don't know exactly what I want yet.

I've been doing a lot of reading on the www and looking around some at the local shops in my spare time, but thought I'd ask for suggestions.

some info to help YOU help ME: I'll be using it almost exclusively for target shooting (although a hunting trip is not out of the question), and I have my Beretta 92G for home defense. Also, my price ceiling is around $1000 for the rifle, scope, and immediate accessories (cleaning kit/case/etc). I'm not looking for a professional set-up (yet!), but something to learn "The Art of the Rifle" with. ;)

I'm thinking perhaps something in .270 or .243 calibers, or perhaps even .308. Something that is fun to shoot and accurate over long distances, yet won't beat me to death.


Thanks for any suggestions!
rvb
 
RVB...as in another thread, I am going to suggest a bolt-action rifle in .25-06 Reminton. It's flat shooting, very accurate, powerful enough for deer, not too big for varmints, won't beat you to death with recoil, and ammo is common enough. The .25-06 is the "do-everything" caliber if there ever was one!

I would suggest something like a Ruger M-77 MkII or a Remington 700. Don't scrimp on the scope or mounts. Rugers come with a very strong and aesthetically appealing set of rings, and are usually quite accurate. And, there is no more accurate out-of-the-box production rifle than the Remington 700.

If you buy another make (other than Ruger), try to use the Leupold Dual-Dovetail mounting system. It won't fail! And, I highly recommend a Leopold scope, something like the 3-9X, 4-12X, 2.5-8X, 3.5-10X, or 4.5-14X.
 
The .243 is a nice round too. It will take deer, shoots flat, perfect for varminting, ammo is readily available and recoil is very easy to deal with. Can't say much about the .25-06 because I don't own one, but I'm sure it's everything RiverRider says it is. But I do own a .243 and it will do everything the .25-06 will IMHO.

kgs.
 
RVB, my Remington 700 in .308 was MOA accurate out of the box (with 180 gr loads). And it was the cheapest one they make, the 700 ADL with synthetic stock. Paid about $425 for it. I paid another $150 or so for Simmons scope & mount.

So you should be able to do a lot better than that for $1,000.

Or get a basic rig like mine, and buy an SKS or a .22 for fun!

BTW, the reason I got .308 was so I could shoot inexpensive surplus ammo. FWIW, the "80's British" from http://www.cheaperthandirt.com is the most accurate surplus I've found so far (out of 3 tried).
 
Given the recent flap about Remington 700s and liability lawsuits (and I own one), I think I would recommend the "Riflman's Rifle", a Winchester Model 70 in .270 Winchester. The other calibers mentioned are all good, and I own most, but I believe the versatility of the .270 would serve you well as a "first" rifle.
 
Well, my choice would be to go for the .308 Win. For a rifle, one of the Classic Model 70s should do well for you. If the Classic is too rich for your blood, get one of the push feed versions. The .308 is an extremely versital round, and the ability to get inexpensive surplus ammo for practice sure doesn't hurt. The .3408 is an accurate round as well.
Paul B.
 
.308 would be my choice. For one thing, it is very accurate, for another, you can buy cheap surplus ammo. It is very popular with target shooters, and the .30 cal holes are not too hard to see a 300 yards with a scope.

The .243 is also popular with target shooters, but I see it as a bit more specialized. It should have somewhat lower recoil, but it will also eat the bore out a bit quicker when using hot loads with heavy bullets.

The .270 requires a long action, and it is inherently less accurate due to its longer powder column.

So I'd go with .308. But you won't be going wrong with any of the others, or a lot of other cartridges like 7mm-08, 280 Rem, .30-06, etc.

As far as rifles, I'd look at the Winchester 70, Remington 700, and Ruger 77, the Savage 110, etc. Remington is very accurate, so that's what you want if you plan to shot off of a bench. If you want to shoot prone, etc, any rifle mentioned above and a lot of others will probably due with a heavy free-floating barrel and a synthetic stock.
 
thanks, now for more Q's

I appreciate the feedback, especially on caliber. It sounds like .308 has the majority support. Obviously we are not talking about the kick of a .22, but is it safe so assume it's also not the kick of a 12 gauge shotgun? Don't get me wrong, I don't mind some kick, but I don't want to have to take a bottle of aspirin before a range session. I've fired the Ruger 10/22, and, well, I thought it slightly boring. No more exciting than a BB gun from a stance.

I've been eyeing the Model 70. So I'm glad to hear suggestions on it, but I don't see options for it in .308. I will also check out the Ruger.

About the Remington 700, are the safety problems as bad as reported? Just this afternoon I saw a story on CNN about them. A 9yr old boy was killed when one discharged while the safety was taken off (obviously, however, the rule of being sure of what the firearm was covering was not followed, but I would still consider that to be an issue). The story was a push for a recal on the Rem 700. (The family was very vocal that they were NOT for more gun control, just a recall of the 700.)

And a last question, would it be fair to say the Winchester Model 70 is as accurate as the Remington, or the other way around? Comparred to the Ruger models mentioned in posts above?

Well, not the LAST question, I'll have more questions in the next couple of months as I narrow my search. ;)

Thanks for the feedback,
and shoot safe,
rvb
 
RVB
I just picked up an awesome Win mod 70 in .308. Heavy varmint barrel. I think they call them something like Nightstalker with a Heavy SS Barrel. Save your money and buy quality and get what you want. I will tell you, my grandfather saved and I was just given his 50 plus year old Savage .300 lever gun. It is still a great shooter.
Go to http://www.gunfinder.net I think they have Winchester. There are a few Ruger M77 LE's at this site but they are in .223, one guy told me (not slamming Ruger) his gun would hold 2 inch MOA, I think he meant 2 inch groups at 100 yards. I bought my Winchester from a great great that says that is plain bad. Look for something with a heavy barrel. The other site is http://www.gunbroker.com

Karsten

buy the way, for not much more you can get into a Springfield M1A and from there you can go crazy. Crazy and broke but you would be having fun at 500 plus yard. Silly sport, short 4 to 10 rounds and walk a 1/4 of a mile to change a target. Then again, I could be hitting a little white ball as far as I could. Only then after catching up to it, hitting it again. Go figure that one out.
 
What ever you get make sure to get a HARRIS BIPOD for it

I'd recommend Ruger's new M77 MkII stainless Sporter (the one with the wood laminate stock, not the God awful black synthetic thing) in .308. Top it with a matte black Leupold Vari-X II 3-9x40 scope. It will come with stainless rings, send those back to Ruger, they'll exchange them for matte blue/black rings for free -- it looks better (I hate silver scopes on rifles). I've got this exact set up in .223 Rem, but the .308 is a much better caliber for a one-rifle-guy.

But honestly, any of the rifles recommended so far will serve you well. One little thing I highly, highly, highly urge to you buy is a HARRIS BIPOD. Accept no substitutes. Spend the $50 and get a good HARRIS BIPOD, it will make shooting the rifle off the bench and prone in the field a real pleasure. --- Kernel
 
Kernel,
I agree, the Harris bipod is a great deal and adds a lot of heft to any rifle. But tell me why the Ruger M77. I was told (again TOLD) the Ruger M77 LE was good for 2 MOA and that was from a guy that had 2 and was selling one. Just a question, no intended offence was meant. I have a Model 70 so I am Bias. And why all the chatter about those $300-400 dollar scope...here is where I get in trouble. I agree, no silver scope on a rifle but you can only see as good as you can see. The scope isn't going to improve your eye sight.
If you want to shoot 100-300 yards get a Simmons 3x9x40 and beat it up. If you want to shoot 300 plus yards get a 4x16x40 and reach out. I for one can only see and hear so well. Again, just my opinion and I did mean to offend anyone.

Karsten
 
RVB...before you leap, look around. Check out some ballistics tables. The .308 is a fine round, but I think it is a bit over-rated. Look at ballistic coefficients and muzzle velocities, and consider your intended purpose for the new rifle. Of course, there are other considerations, such as ammo availability and things like that, and maybe you like a particular rifle offered in only one caliber. But there's nothing wrong with checking around.
 
No matter what you buy, whether it is a .308, .223, 25-06. Reload you stuff. Cheap, you can get a Lee O press and everything for $65 I think. Once fired brass and get your bullets, powder and primers locally. Check http://www.midwayusa.com. Should you want a great load for .308 let me know. Well, the link doesn't work :-(

Karsten
 
If you really want a fine rifle you'll keep and cherish for the rest of your life, decide on a caliber and buy a Sako. Put a Nikon scope on it and you'd be hard pressed to find anything that will out shoot it.
Depending on how you want to use it, .308 or .223 would be the best choices since surplus and reloaded ammo is readily available and fairly inexpensive. You'll end up shooting a lot more and getting more enjoyment out of it if you go with a cartridge that doesn't cost a lot to shoot.
There are lots of choices of loads and bullet styles and weights available in these calibers which you will appreciate if you decide to start reloading.
My humble opinion.

Bottom Gun
 
Much of it depends upon the versitility of the firearm. If you want a do-everything gun, I'd suggest a Garand in .308. Or even spend a little more and do the M1A. Both are accurate and the spare parts and options available to both are endless. Same goes for the Remington 700. But it's a bolt action. If your into the .223, I'd suggest an AR-15. Same thing.

Another thing is sights. I recommend that you avoid scopes for the most part. Stay with a good set of iron sights. Once you've mastered the iron sights, a scope will become more of a hindrance that slows down your shooting. You'd be suprised that people actually shoot MOA out to 300 yards with iron sights. And many shoot MOA farther than that.

What ever you decide, make sure you use it. And that you feel comfortable with it. Have fun shopping.

Regards,
MP
 
An AR-15?

Naw... You want your first rifle to be something easy and reliable... The M-77 suggestion is a good one. Or a M1 Carbine would be great too... Anything but an AR!
 
Thanks, keep the advice coming!

All,
I am leaning very heavily towards a basic bolt action for my FIRST (but NOT last! :D) long-gun. Although I don't suppose a carbine such as the M1 would be out of the question, either. But I really think a bolt action is for me.

Ballistics tables: where can I find them? Remington has a decent setup on their page, but you can't compare multiple calibers next to each other. A pain to use.

Karsten: That's an absolute beauty of a Model 70 you have there. Thanks for sharing.

Thanks for ALL the advice, guys, I'm soakin' up every word.
 
hey, RVB don't get me wrong, others have had good advise as well. I thought I wanted a AR15 but I find the bullet is way to light to get out to 300 yds. For your 1st fifle we need one that you can bound, love and cherish.
What I am going to tell at you Is that you buy a heavy barrel in a bolt action. In time you will want a M1a JUST LIKE I do.
 
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