Steel Dogs?

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odessastraight

New member
I'm thinking that the local steel challenge matches might be good training for using your CCW against the threat of feral or otherwise "loose" dogs. I don't know if it comes up with most of you, but I've been threatned many more times by dogs than by BGs.

Steel matches are a "stand, draw, and gun five steel targets (including one stop plate) as fast as you can. Some of the better local shooters can do this in about 2 seconds. Duffers, like me, even when shooting our revolvers, can hit all 5 in about 3 seconds.

Were those steel plates placed low to the ground they would even be better training for "dog defence". Of course it would mean you'd leave your race gun at home and use your CCW. Sounds like fun to me...and good training, too.
 
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For local IDPA matches we often have the targets on their sides and close to the groud to simulate dogs (some have gotten ears and tails attached as well)

dog.JPG
 
Now, I've seen some dogs that aren't so cute, but THAT dog, above, takes the cake. The tongue is a nice touch. Congratulations to the match director.
 
had two bull mastiffs come into my garage one night as i was casting bullets.. scared the s--t out me!! had the spousal unit load my gun and call the cops..... they found a weaker target in a small pup tied out down the streeet so they took off .... i was standing in my driveway with my s&w in my hand when the sherriff showed up... i said if they come back i'm takin em out!! he asked you afraid of em?? i said yes i was... he said take em out........ i am sure those fed 158 gr jsps would have been enough to screw up their whole day!!


LIFE IS SHORT............
 
Now, I've seen some dogs that aren't so cute, but THAT dog, above, takes the cake. The tongue is a nice touch. Congratulations to the match director.
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Thanks. They are actually fangs, but I may add a wet sock next time around. :D

The fun thing about wild dog stages is that you can ask the shooter to engage targets that are farther out as they may be the closest threat to a hostage. A little different that always engaging targets that are closest to the shooter.

dogs.JPG
 
The "hostage" above somehow reminds me of an exotic dancer I once knew (maybe it's those handprints on her). Wow! Now it's a whole pack of those ugly dogs needing to be shot...

As Match Director what would you think about letting the ones who carry mouse guns shoot that "Dog" stage of fire. I think it would be interesting to see how they would do with their chosen CCWs in IDPA.

JJ, good luck with those real BDs. Did they end up hurting the puppy?
 
At our matches I have no problems letting mouse guns shoot for non score. I also let the light rifles (AR's and AK's) shoot the stages when the match is over.

Technically, they don't shoot as part of the IDPA match, but I will post the scores if they wish. Most people don't care. They just want to try alternate weapons and I think that's great.
 
You seem like a tolerant match director with a good measure of common sense who runs very interesting matches.

I'll say, straight out, that I'd never consider CCW with a mouse gun. I'm amazed that there are seemingly intelligent folks who DO carry them. I've really become currious as to why and I'm wondering if maybe the people carrying mouse guns just don't fully realize their lack of effectiveness...not only in power, but in "hitability" and ease of operation, too. I'm thinking that the folks who carry them would benifit from shooting a course of fire with their chosen mouse gun,...more than just sticking up an FBI target just off the muzzle, popping off a few rounds, and making the determination that they are good enough.

What's your impression of mouse guns used in your scenarios? I would expect the very small .22s and .25s would fare worse than the larger .380s. I'm not counting the smaller snubby revolvers, in .38 or heavier cal, or the mini-autos in 9mm or heavier cal. as "mouse guns, but am interested in your impressions of them, too.
 
I don't think caliber matters that much in terms of hitting targets. Most guns are plenty accurate enough for the ranges used in IDPA scenarios. The problem tends to be more in the smaller sight radius and poor sights on the smaller guns....and since they are usually "back up" type guns, I suspect people don't practice as much as they should with them.

I'm not a big fan of the really small .22's and .25's (I would be if they were more reliable), but I've seen some great .380's and .32's that have had excellent results.

Like all tools, the mouse gun has a role. It's not what you would want to bring to a gun fight, but might save you if you were boxed in. They are easily concealed, relatively cheap and can be stashed nearby without any special gear. They are a good tool for defending yourself against an attacker that doesn't have a firearm (a more common scenario for women who suffer sexual assault). A right choice for people with weak or damaged wrists, or who are severley recoil sensitive (not everyone can afford the rounds and time to overcome that) More intimidating that pepper spray or a stun gun and with more punch.

Mouse guns are like the "donut tire" in your trunk. It can get the job done, but don't ask too much from it. A full size spare is better, but takes up too much room and can be too heavy for some to manipulate.

That being said, I was backed around the trunk of my car one night by a would be mugger, but the motion of putting my hand on my Kimber Compact stopped him cold. I never had to actually draw, but I do know that I wished I had a bigger gun at that moment.....like my shotgun or AR. When you feel threatened in that manner, you want to bring everything you've got and that's the reason I usually carry a .40 or .45.
 
Compairing Doughnuts to Mouseguns?

Thank you for your insight...very creditable considering your match director status. I will, however respectfully disagree with your "doughnut analogy. To drive a newer car a "doughnut" spare is an absolute requirement. That's standard equipment now. There is absolutely NO requirement for anyone to carry a mousegun. It's a choice based on comfort and convienence...Trading a measure of security for a smaller, lighter and less effective CCW. I think those folks who carry mouseguns have just decided that a threat on their lives is just so remote of a possibility that they are willing to compromise fight stopping effectiveness for more comfort. I contend that anyplace you can carry a concealed mousegun you can also carry at least a .357 J frame. I want comfort, too, but my comfort comes in the relization that my CCW/ammo is an effective fight stopper... not in some flyweight, plastic .32 or .380.

I know some folks with rather severe disabilities who still manage to carry more effective weapons than mouseguns. I don't see any reason for women to be relegated to mouseguns either.
 
To drive a newer car a "doughnut" spare is an absolute requirement.
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No....it's just standard equipment. Many, many people have no idea how to change a tire and, therefore, its wasted space. You can only use a tool that you are comfortable with. I never regulated them to women, I merely stated that women face a scenario that would more commonly be appropriately addressed by a mouse gun versus pepper spray. With 1 in 4 women being a victim of assault in their lives to a larger opponent, they need something to even things up.

My girlfriend has difficulty using my 6lb lightweight AR. For home defense she prefers the Steyr M40 because she's more effective with it. Not the best tool, but the best tool for her.
 
well odessa, they just kinda mauled it around between them for a little bit before i yelled and the little dogs owner came out and they ran off... the guy said "she's all wet" i told him what i saw and he was none too pleased..... so they mauled her some is all didn't break any skin!
 
OK, Lycanthrope, I think I'm starting to understand a difference in basic thoughts about choices. It didn't even enter my mind that anyone would choose a mousegun as being "better" than pepper spray. To me, self defence against threats of death or grave injury only involves a firearm. My only choice relates as to just how much gun I can conceal. If anyone would make an L frame sized snubby S&W, fixed sights in .44 Mag. then that would probably be my CCW.

Were I to advise a smaller woman in the area of self defence it would be to become proficient with the most effective handgun she can manage and carry it always and to lose the pepper spray. Should she only feel comfortable with a mousegun I'd advise her to go unarmed, buy the best Nikes she can afford, and work on her wind sprints.

JJB2, you probably saved that pup's life. Well, you've gone on record with both the Sheriff and your neighbor about the trouble with those two BDs. Were it me and they came around again causing trouble, I'd line them up with the safest backstop I could find and stop their raids upon the neighborhood once and for all. ...Well, I might try to talk to the BDs owner, first.
 
oddessa i found out where the dogs came from and made a visit to their owner the next day..... i told her if those dogs come back to my house i'm takin them out.... she said you can't kill my dogs... i calmly repied .. yes i can... then she said you're threatening me. i said nope.. i'm just telling ya what's going to happen if they come back to my place they'll be laying in a pile...... then her black boyfriend came to the door and said if you have a problem with our dogs you go to the cops don't come here... said i've done that ... now i'm telling ya.... never saw those dogs again:cool: ............ as far as leos and me shooting stuff goes i've been shooting possums out my garbage for years... i use shot shells an #2 shot from my model 27 on them....... about the second time i shot a garbage attacking possum the town cop showed up as i was hosing the blood off my patio... he just said are shooting down here ?? i said ya i shot a possum do you want to see it?? he simply said nope i hate possums! life is good in a small town sometimes!!
 
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