Star Trek gun questions

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Doug.38PR

Moderator
Yes, that's what I mean't to say. "Star Trek gun questions" not "phaser questions" so the questions are indeed gun related:)

1) I was watching a couple of episodes I had on tape last night (don't remember the title name of this one, but it was where they were on a planet where everything they thought of appeared and it was for the purpose of amusing them...it could also simulate their being killed too.). In this episode, Sulu finds a pistol under a rock. He starts shooting it for practice, Capt. Kirk runs up and Sulu identify's the gun as a "Police Special." Police Special? What exactly is that? I once heard a gunsmith refer to the Colt Official Police as a "Police Special" just in short like Detective Special. But the gun Sulu had was definately a Smith and Wesson. It was hard for me to ID it, but it looked a little like a 6 inch Model 10. Can anyone else ID this gun? And why did he call it a "Police Special"?

2) The next episode on the tape was an episode called, I think, Tommorrow Is Yesterday where the Enterprise goes back in time to 1960s earth. They have to sneak into a U.S. Airbase to get some tapes that recorded the enterprise as a UFO. They are caught by the Military Police (I think)...but the MPs were carrying 4 inch Smith & Wesson Model 10s? :confused: I thought the military carried 1911 A1s? I'm sure they did. Am I wrong? Of course it is Hollywood, but every other hollywood thing has the military using 1911s. Plus, I think Gene Roddenberry served in the Air Corp in WW2 and you would think he would know little details like that. Any ideas?
 
Being a long-time Star Trek aficionado, we should not rely on the script writers or prop masters as a reliable source of firearms knowledge!

Having said that, S&W began marketing a variety of revolvers under the Military and Police label starting in 1905. The most popular model, in .38 special caliber, became known as the Model 10 in 1957, when S&W started giving their handguns numerical designations rather than names. "Police Special" was a not uncommon nickname for the Model 10.

And many units of the American military carried revolvers rather than automatics. This is particularly true for security, law enforcement and the aviation communities in years past. I had a neighbor, who is now deceased, who was in the Air Force military police for twenty years, from the 50's to the 70's. He said that for most of that time, he was issued a variety of S&W, Colt and Ruger revolvers, all in .38 special caliber.

So I think in these particular two episodes, and perhaps just by happenstance, the firearms portrayed were done so accurately.
 
The branches of the military generally have a fair bit of independence about purchasing weapons. For instance while the Army and Marines both operate the M1 Abrams, they operate different variants. In WWII, the army had the Garand, but the marines were using the Johnson and the springfield at the beginning of the war. The Army and Marines both have different M-16 variants too.

The Air Force never had the same small arms footprint as the other services so often they went their own way. They were the first to issue AR variants in Vietnam. They were never really big on the 1911. Usually the USAF was issuing .38sp revolvers instead.

There's a few episodes of Stargate where SG1 ends up in the '60s. They get into shootout with some period Airforce guys. Those armed with pistols are shooting revolvers. It is weird, but period correct.
 
My friend was in the Air force during desert storm. When he was at the base on guard duty, he was issued a 38spl.
 
There's a few episodes of Stargate where SG1 ends up in the '60s. They get into shootout with some period Airforce guys. Those armed with pistols are shooting revolvers. It is weird, but period correct.
Click to expand...

I seem to remember an episode where they went to an alternate earth or some kind of earth type planet inhabited by normal looking humans and their weapons were equivalent to our 1940s era issue weapons. Looked like the regular soldiers were armed with M-1 Grandish type weapons and the officers were armed with revolver pistols while the Richard Dean Anderson and company were armed with our modern earth type weapons.
They were at war with some other country and the goverment of that world and the SG1 guys were trying to keep the stargate out of enemy hands or something like that.

I don't regularly watch that show, only when I am at a friends house in Austin who watches it all the time or when there is nothing else on. Don't know why I don't keep up with it, I liked the first movie, and the show does indeed look pretty good.
 
My dad was an Air Force SP (Security Police) in the 60's. He was issued a S&W Model 15 Combat Masterpiece with 4" barrel. For a long gun he was first issued an M-1 carbine then was switched over to the M16. When he was deployed to South Vietnam in 1965 he was issued a Winchester Model 1912 12 gauge riot gun. He carried the S&W Model 15 4" all the time, but during his last couple of months in Vietnam he was also issued a Model 15 snubbie and a shoulder holster. To this day he dosen't know why he was issued two handguns.

He carried the 4" M15 on his belt, the M15 snubbie in the shoulder holster, and the Winchester shotgun. That was his "combat load". His buddy also carried the Model 15, but carried the M3 Grease Gun SMG instead of a shotgun. All things considered they were very well armed. He was assigned to Bien Hoa Air Force Base just outside of Siagon. Believe it or not they saw some action. Infiltrators, mortar attacks, snipers etc. Hope this helped.
 
We used S&W Model 15s when I was Security Police in the AF from '72-'76. The Star Trek episode you're referring to where base security officers were shown with revolvers would have been correct.
Denis
 
Colt made a revolver called the Police Positive Special. It was essentially their old Police Positive beefed up to hand .38 Special ammunition.
 
Police Special

In the '60s I often heard the .38 called the "Police Special". I also remember picking up expended shells at our local outdoor firing range (really just an open area of desert pointed at a hillside) that were clearly labeled ".38 police special." The firing range was also used by the local cops.

So ... some ammunition company obviously actually labeled their ammo police special. Anybody here shooting back in those days?
 
As I have mentioned before in other threads, our arms room when I was in the army had .38 special Colt Detective Specials and even a couple of Colt Pocket automatics, though I don't know whether they were .32 or .380. That was a division headquarters company.

An army manual I have from the 1950's on small arms listed and illustrated a whole variety of revolvers, not all in .38 special either. I don't recall if it still had .45 ACP revolvers or not, however. Otherwise, they were either Colt or Smith & Wesson in just about all barrel lengths, all fixed sights. It listed an S&W M&P model in .38 S&W as ".38 regular," which always gives me a chuckle. The caliber was also listed parenthetically as .380/200 and .38 S&W.
I think there was also a listing of a .22 Hi-Standard pistol but now I must look it up.

I understand the military issue .38 special load as issued during the 1960's was a rather weak load.
 
A friend of mine got out of the air force in 1984. He said he used a model 10.
At that time, a lot of MPs I knew in the army had Smith .38s.
I think Ruger sold some to to the military too.
In the 50s and 60s the four or five inch .38 special revolver by Colt or Smith was generally referred to as a "police special" as in police issue .38 special. It was a euphemism that popped up a lot in court, and in crime novels. Many hollywood writers read crime novels and used that lingo for tv.
Dick special referred to any 2 inch .38, not just the Colt Detective Special.
 
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