Speaking of Steyr selling guns to Iran....

Eh I don't see any problem even if Iran was involved with the weapon transfer.

Afterall, who hired Saddam when he was 23 years old in 1959? The CIA http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/10/205859.shtml (Other sources suggest as early as when he was 18).

Not only was he an asset, Donald Rumsfeld and others made sure he had plenty of weapons. So if our politicians here in the US Critisized Iran for doing this, they'd be pretty hypocritical, since we've armed, funded, and trained many more dictators and warlords / regimes (Operation Gladio, etc).

Also it may have been possible that these rifles were shipped to Iran and somehow sold to private non-government affiliated civilians, who then turned around and sold them or smuggled them into Iraq. All these stories about "made in iran" bombs and firearms don't necessairly prove a direct link (See 2003 Iraq WMD Claims).

Just my .02
 
jstep said:
All these stories about "made in iran" bombs and firearms don't necessairly prove a direct link (See 2003 Iraq WMD Claims).
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+1. It certainly doesn't breed an atmosphere of trust or help the general Western opinion of Iran, but it's still not proof and no Iranian offical has been "caught red-handed".

However, I'm not sure my opinion would be the same if an Iranian made bomb exploded next to my car on the way to work this morning, so I understand the outrage and why it's such a serious debate right now.
 
The worlds number one small arms exporter this past year was The United States.

Do you think they all ended up in the hands of good guys?
 
F-14

so Steyr sells rifles to Iran, we still sell them spare parts for their F-14 Tomcats (which we sold them about 10+ years ago). so "Show Me The Axis of Evil Money"!!!! :rolleyes:
 
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I realize that everybody (including the USA) is supplying weapons to everybody else... depending upon who they're sleeping with at the time. What I think sucks and was hoping is not true is that the Steyr rifles had already made it into enemy hands and was killing US troops.
 
Some real facts....

The F-14's were sold to Iran prior to the fall of the Shah, in the late 1970's.

The US Gov. has to give permission for any parts for those aircraft, for any sale of the parts to be legal. If Iran got any parts for the F-14, there were middle-men breaking a whole bunch of laws.

Bart Noir
 
When Saddam was OUR bastard we sold him the basis of his bio-warfare program from the ATTC (American Type Culture Collection) among whose major stockholders were Bush and Baker. It seems hypocritical to damn Steyr for selling Iran some rifles when we sold Saddam the scion stock of a strategic germ warfare development program. Besides, if the Iranians can come up with the technology to make nuclear weapons, would it be beyond their abiity to make some rifles? The U.S. Fedgov is overcome with hubris if it thinks it can tell every company in every country in world with whom they can do business. I despise and fear the Iranian govt and Islamofascism, but what in the Hell gives the the Fedgov the idea they run the world? I pack a
Steyr and love it. P*ss on the govt.
 
If Iran got any parts for the F-14, there were middle-men breaking a whole bunch of laws.

If I need a background check to buy a .22 pistol, then why do Grumman Aircraft Engineering Corporation, parts accententlly fall into the hands of the Iranian airforce. Doesnt the good ol boys of the governement or CIA track this? answer..........

In January 2007, it was announced by the US Department of Defense that sales of parts for F-14s would be suspended due to concerns that they could end up in Iran. It announced that the decision was taken "given the current situation in Iran"

Wow, it took over four years for the US Department of Defense to finally "suspend" sales of F-14 parts to one of the "axis of evil", countries. so i really dont believe they were middle men, making deals in back alleys, to sell spare F-14 parts for cash. my point is if i could walk into my local gun shop and buy a brand new Styre AUG, i would. would i care if they sell weapons to Iran, not really (maybe a tiny bit) because up until JANUARY 2007, USA did too. :barf: if we (i mean government), really cared about our brave troops (including my cousin in the navy, yes i really do have a cousin in the US navy), then they would have stopped selling F-14 and parts, immedatly after the fall of the Shah. not wait until '07. unfortunately, those Iranian F-14s will kill many of our boys, this is a sad but true fact (F-14s are no push overs). another thing that really sucs is that i like the F-14 tomcat, i even have a little die-cast model of one, and yes i do like the movie Topgun (shut up, I know you do too). :o
 
http://www.playfuls.com/news_10_13968-ROUNDUP-Austrian-Rifles-Used-In-Iraq-Reports-Say.html

Reports of US soldiers confiscating around 100 Austrian-made sniper rifles in Iraq have not yet been confirmed by Austrian officials.

Spokespersons for both the interior and foreign ministries and the manufacturer stressed that they had not yet received any official information on whether the weapons really originated in Austria.

Astrid Harz of the Foreign Ministry said the Austrian government's approval of the deal in late 2004 "had been legal and correct based on the Austrian legal regulations."

Iran's security forces said that the guns would be used to fight drug-trafficking in its border regions. Rudolf Gollia, a spokesman for the Austrian Interior Ministry stressed that the end-use certificate had been double-checked with Iranian ministries.

"If a certificate is confirmed by the authorities you have to trust it ... or ban weapons production and exports completely," Gollia said.

A total of 100 HS50 Steyr-Mannlicher rifles were discovered during raids in Baghdad, the British Daily Telegraph reported Tuesday quoting US military sources. The guns come from a batch of 800 of the 50-calibre rifles sold by Steyr-Mannlicher to the Iranian security forces in 2005. A representative of Steyr-Mannlicher said the matter would be investigated.

At the time, the sale was condemned by the United States and Britain for fears the guns could be smuggled into Iraq and used by insurgents there. The United States imposed a one-year embargo on the Austrian weapons manufacturer after the sale.

Franz Holzschuh, Steyr-Mannlicher's new owner, said he had no evidence that the rifles in question were produced by his company. So far, there had been none of the official inquiries common in such cases, he told the Austrian Press Agency.

Apart from that, the patent for the rifle expired a few years ago, so it could just as well be a copy.

Green Party MP Peter Pilz, an outspoken critic of the deal in 2005, said his initial concerns had been confirmed and said that "first grade terrorst weapons" were delivered to terrorist sympathizers in Iran.

The members of Schuessel's cabinet were responsible for the deal, he charged.

According to The Daily Telegraph, British officials now see their initial fears that the weapons could end up in the wrong hands confirmed.

The 12-kilogramme Steyr-Mannlicher HS50 is a large-calibre precision gun which can be easily assembled and disassembled, the manufacturer said. It can pierce body armour or armoured troop transporters from a distance of up to 1,500 metres.

Each gun costs around 15,000 euros (19,500 dollars).

In 2005 and 2006, no exports to Iran were approved, as the geopolitical situation in Iran changed, the Austrian Interior Ministry said.

© 2007 DPA
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how free are News Agencies in the UK again?
they like arms manufactures right?
News Agencies in UK ever post anything to support going to war with Iraq?

wonder if Steyrs new owner knew what he bought himself into. Steyr just got sold very recently.

Iran and china were working on a joint venture to make a 50BMG never read if they got it to work.
Steyr rifle would be good one to try and copy good luck with recreating the good barrel though.

at one time in the British Empire had a horrible time with her colonies when Seperatist Terrorist rose up with the aid of french clothing and weaponry.

be damning evidence for Iran and possible catalyst for furthering the war into Iran.
 
Not only was he an asset, Donald Rumsfeld and others made sure he had plenty of weapons.
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US assistance to Saddam was pretty much exclusive to his war with Iran, which does not do much to support your claim he was our guy in Baghdad since 1959. But, hey, what good is the internet if you can't have paranoid fantasies and conspiracy theories?

A real look at the numbers would indicate that lots of people out-sold stuff to Iraq during the Iran-Iraq War, including several European nations (France comes to mind) and even Brazil . . .
 
The F-14's were sold to Iran prior to the fall of the Shah, in the late 1970's.
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Interesting note they also sold the Shah a nuclear reactor and helped him research nuclear weapons and blocked the Shah from being investigated for it, even if he was a nutjob dictator that made Saddam look like a nice guy and it wasn't until after the revolution that Iran decided to abandon work on nuclear weapons and the reactor as they believed it would create a dependency on the US. Of course the people on the Ford administration board who approved all this include the likes of a certain Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney, Paul Wolfowitz and Henry Kissinger.

Funny how things have changed.
 
Backing up some of these stories

How about some factual info backing up some of these stories. Not that I don't believe some of them, but just spewing out these things as if they were facts really means nothing.


lg_mouth
 
Selling arms to Iran and Iraq simultaneously was a play to keep the power balance from sliding one way or another in the war. I don't know if it helped or not but that was about the result.

As someone said before, the planes were sold to the Shah who was our "friend" at the time. Since his overthrow by Islamic fundamentalists (shockingly, for a long period of time the Middle East was ruled largely by moderates... Oil was around 2 dollars a barrel) Iran has been keeping up their fleet of F-14s, but not very well. I think without our spare parts, I read they were machining their own and cannibalizing.

Guess where they went when they couldn't get US fighters anymore... France...

The case could be made that the rogue nation in this case is France. The more I find out about its government, the more I think it should be turned into a colony of the newly founded Iraqi government... Move all the good Iraqis to France and leave the insurgents clutching sand.

And now on the subject of Iran, France is saying that countries that desire weapons of mass destruction risk a nuclear attack. This coming from the government that sold a nuclear reactor to Iraq and fighter jets to the Ayatollah, and declined to join NATO during the cold war.

I wish those rioters would break into the capital and string the pigs up.
 
Anyone else think the government should sale these confiscated .50 cal rifles to us civilians? It would help to fund the troop buildup. :D
 
Glock to sell Iran 30,000 pistols
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D8NB1K880.htm

Iran is licensed by HK to produce several guns.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Current_Equipment_of_the_Iranian_Army#Small_arms

Small arms
Khaybar KH2002 an Iranian designed 5.56x45 mm bullpup rifle
SPG-9
Zoaf Pistol 9 mm
Sig P-226 Pistol
AKM Cal. 7.62x39 mm (supplemented by limited numbers of AK-47 and Type 56 rifles), main service rifle alongside the G3A6
Heckler & Koch G3A6 Cal. 7.62x51 mm (licenced production)[3], main service rifle alongside the AKM
Heckler & Koch MG3 Cal. 7.62x51 mm (licenced production) [4]
Tondar Sub-Machine Gun 9x19 mm (MP5 manufactured under licence)
PKM
Dragunov Sniper Rifle
Steyr HS .50
M-16 A2
RPG-7 [5]
Gas masks
Bullet Proof Vests (used by specialized units, not yet standard issue)
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before jumping onto the attack Iran bandwagon consider this
recently Russia has threatened to back out of the Arms treaty that ended the cold war over US anti missile defense in Europe, Russia also has a hand on gas and oil pipeline to northern Europe and has shut it down periodically. China has a huge mega billion deal with Iran for Oil. think Americans are spoiled by oil and power enough to induce lies for imperlist venture to keep the American Empire going wait till you see what China will do to make sure the Oil flows.

Ala Dan said:
I currently don't own (nor do I expect too own in the future) any Steyr firearms~!
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how are you set for Glocks,Sig and HK's?
 
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