Some Very Basic Rifle Caliber Questions

K

Klein Helmer

New member
Hello,

I am thinking about getting a rifle and now that I have (somewhat) narrowed down the platforms I am having to take a close look at the available calibers.

Would anyone be so kind as to run down some differences between the following cartridges as they pertain to cost, recoil, ballistics, etc?

.223

5.56x45

5.45x39

7.62x39

7.62x51

7.62x54

.308

Also, if anyone would like to weigh in on my original thread, that would be greatly appreciated as well.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=543435

Thank you, everyone.
 
Here's my best shot

.223- low recoil, flat shooting moderate power. 'Varmint round'

5.56x45- see .223, it's essentially the same round, but the 5.56x45 is the military designation. Uses different methods of measuring pressure, the neck/throat is slightly longer because of the long-ish military bullets. Fairly interchangeable with .223 with MOST guns. The only problem you may run into is on 'true' .223 rem rifles, may have too short a throat, which MAY jam some bullets into the lands before firing, which can increase pressure. Most weapons you're OK, even manufactures that only stamp '.223' on their rifles have recommended that 5.56x45 is okay to shoot. This isn't true for ALL guns, so it wouldn't hurt to test by chambering a long round and looking for signs of rifling touching the bullet.
5.45x39 -see .223/5.56 Essentially the Russian variant. It uses the same case as the 7.62x39, necked down to .221 caliber (.223/5.56 is .224 cal) CHEAP, CHEAP, CHEAP ammo. Noted to be more accurate than the 7.62x39 with less recoil.

7.62x39- .311 caliber moderate powered rifle round. Considered more powerful than .223/5.45x39 but uses a heavier bullet at lower velocity, doesn't shoot as flat. Very Cheap ammo. medium/moderate recoil.

7.62x51- see .308 same round, military designation, COMPLETELY interchangeable. (May be able to get cheap-ish surplus ammo)

7.62x54- Russian equivalent to the .308 similar ballistics in a rimmed case. Uses .311-.312 cal bullets. Cheap to buy and shoot.

.308 - .308 caliber, fairly flat shooting, high powered round. Pretty much the 'standard' rifle caliber now. Moderate/high recoil, but lots of power to go along with it. Also potentially one of the most accurate rounds in the list.

Most rifle ammo you can expect to pay $1 per round if you don't reload. The only exceptions are the 5.45x39, 7.62x39, 7.62x54R and if you're lucky surplus 5.56x45 and .7.62NATO (IE .308 Winchester)
 
Last edited:
.223- low recoil, flat shooting moderate power. 'Varmint round'
Click to expand...

I would take minor exception with this description. On the scale of center-fire rifle power, the .223 is very much closer to the bottom than the middle. I would classify it as "moderate" only if you include rimfire rounds. "Flat shooting" is about the same. It's closer to the bottom of the center-fire trajectory list than the top, particularly compared to other popular varmint rounds. A .22-250 or .243 easily beats it out to 500 yards.
 
One quick correction to JD0X0's post
The 5.45X39 Russian round is not a necked down 7.62X39.
The case head is much smaller. In fact the only measurement that is the same between the 2 cases is the length of the loaded round.

But it is a fast flat and accurate little round. About the least expensive center fire rifle round you can get these days.
 
A) Where do you live?

B) Generally, avoid military chamberings if you can. Stick with sporting chamberings with a wide variety of factory ammo choices for hunting. Unless it's a 100% dedicate SHTF-WROL rifle. Or if you must, .308 win, which is both a military chambering AND not-a-military-chambering, if you will.

C) But you have to give us all potential *purposes* or uses or missions of the rifle, in order of importance. Single use? Multi-use? Triple-use? More? Truly an "all-purpose", is in "this is the only rifle I'll probably ever get"?

If more than one use, which ones, and in what proportions / what % of the time. E.g. 70% hunter, 20% STHF-WROL, and 10% fun range gun. Or 100% STHF-WROL. Or what?

D) You've probably left out the best "just-one" chambering going, for a semi-auto, and that's the 6.8 SPC II. It's everything the 7.62x39 should have been and more. After that, a LOT can be said for a 556x45 with a 7 or 8 twist, in an 18 or 20" bbl.
 
308 is the universal cartridge in the bunch. Cheap ammo available at every store that carries ammo, precise shooting with good long range, lots of specialized hunting bullets, capable of taking everything in the lower 48, nearly every manufacturer has chambered a rifle for it.
Only disadvantage is full recoil, if you plan on plinking a 100 rounds in a set you probably want a 223. But a 223 is a questionable hunting round on anything but light eastern dear, and illegal on elk etc in many states.
 
calibers

Calibers. You have listed seven cartridges.....three that are essentially .22 caliber and four that are, essentially, .30 caliber.
The pros and cons are subject for lengthy discussion - though the posts so far are right on.
I, too, had always thought that the 5.45X39 cartridge was a necked down 7.62X39.....I see now that they are not parent and child....learned something I did.
Pete
 
Of the choices, 7.62x39 in an AK or SKS or the .308 in anything. I know you're wanting the AR but I just don't see the hype. But if an AR it must be, and a rifle cartridge, why not a .243? Much better for hunting than a .223 and its basically a .308 knecked down. The .308 is a good round but I own a .243 Savage 110 and it does a good job. The AR-10 is available in .243 and I would think it would use the same magazines as the .308 version. But as I did on your other thread, I'm again suggesting a single shot for your first rifle.
 
If had to go through life with only two rifle calibers, a 223 and 308 would kill anything I wanted from Black Bear to predators and any deer species out there. Both calibers are easy to find in either premium or economical bullets. Both can be easily reloaded if you want. Buy em both and call it a day.

FYI, I did kill a large doe this year with my 223 loaded with a premium Barnes 55gr TSX bullet and had a total pass through with a shoulder shot. Worked great.....BUT.... It certainly doesnt have the knock down power of the larger 270,308,06 calibers. The 223 is good deer caliber if you are in open terrain and are very selective with your shots. My son will probably start out with my 223 for deer when the time comes. No recoil, not very loud and accurate as heck.
My 223 is really my predator rifle but it can do it all if it has to.
 
Last edited:
.223--relatively cheap, US round. Shoots fairly flat. Projectiles available in a wide variety of weights and designs (varmint, medium-game, plinking, match shooting, anti-personnel, etc).

5.56x45--ALMOST the same as .223rem. US/NATO standard. Be careful if you get a very tight tolerance .223rem. It may not be compatible. (Most AR-15s will shoot either.) Same comments as .223rem.

5.45x39--Soviet design similar to .223rem. Shoots fairly flat. CHEAP. Less variety in projectiles than .223rem.

7.62x39--Soviet design. Cheap. Available in a decently wide variety of loadings. Slower bullet means more drop at range.

7.62x51--US/NATO standard round, available in a very wide range of loadings. Useful for medium/long range target shooting, medium/large game, anti-personnel, etc. More expensive than the previous cartridges, in most loadings.

7.62x54R-CHEAP, Russo-Soviet round. Similar ballistics to 7.62x51/.308win. Not quite as many available loadings as .308win.

.308--see 7.62x51.


All would make fine plinking choices, but .308 would be the most expensive.
 
If American Chose between a 223 or 308

I would choose both but if I had to choose between a 308 and 223 I would chose the 308 as it is much more versatile. Dead is dead and overkill is to be argued about by gun nuts. Winchester sells 7.62 ammo for less than $17 and 223 for around $10. Soft points are cheaper in the 308 go figure. The 308 is much better for hunting deer and larger game.
 
I'm going to jump with an assumption that the OP has enquired as to
recommended choices for a first rifle.

With that in mind I would offer that the 223 is a great round for doing
a lot of things -- up to and including Eastern hunting/whitetail
where legal. It is very light recoil, relatively cheaply available,
and chambered in just about every action ever designed in the last 125 years,

The 308 is its universally-available bigger brother in all those respects
(uncluding bigger ammo price), but comes with significantly increased
recoil as the pricetag for mid-range elk-killing power.

Splitting the difference in all those factors as a first rifle/cartridge,
but one that retains a lifetime of utility from ground squirrels to mule deer,
is the 243 Winchester.

If I were to have only two rifles in a lifetime, the first would be the
243Win and the second would be the 375 H&H.

But I'd start with the 243
 
Last edited:
get a 6.5-55 swedish mauser or a .260 if you handload
get a 7mm-08 if you like factory ammo

will kill any big game in north america inside of 200 yards and any deer at 300 yards.unless your shooting out to long ranges or hunting dangerous game like brown bear you dont need anything else.

for longer shots or dangerous game get a 30-378 weatherby.2 guns every hunting sitiuation
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top