Single action do I REALLY want to change?

Z

ZVP

New member
A few days ago a buddy ane I had a good discussion on owning the guns we like. I was considering getting a Glock for home protection and he being a D/A revolver fan suggested a model 10 but he really couldn't understand why I wanted anything but a Single Action.
See ever since we met, he's always known me to be a huge Single Action fan and the primary type of gun I shoot Be it C&B or mainly Cartrige.
He asked why do I want to change what my hand naturally does?
He's right I'd need to learn a new skill when I already feel at home with the Single Action my hands naturally go to the 2 hand CAS style speed cocking hold and I don't have trouble ejecting and reloading with some little speed. I can rap a cylinderfull fairly accuratelly and with a reasonable amount of speed...
So why should I really change anything other than caliber ( I'd been thinking about switching from a .357 Vaquero to a .45 Long Colt Vaquero or Blackhawk with a 4 5/8" bbl)? If I am fairly proficent with what I have had and used all these years, why try and change?
The reason for the caliber change is reloading. The .45 pretty much dumps itself out due to the weight of the case heads and hitting a big .45 hole with a reload is easier the older I get. The .357Magnum is more than sufficent for anti-personel uses! It's just these old fumble fingers. The .45 Colt is also a proven stopper even with standard velocity loads.
Recoil is not an issue as I don't feel the .45 out recoils the .357 Magnum!
MY origonal thoughts were that today you might face multiple foes or go up against someone who had 15-19 shots and that could go wrong fast! The Glock has a minimal caliber (9mm) but a lot of shots, the Rugers held six but I can hit with em! I could work more on my reloads and maybe get faster but having only 2 encounters in 62 years, chances are I wouldn't need to change much now... I don't plan to be involved in a gang shootout or to fend off more than 6 Zombies so just maybe Jason was right, stick to my Single Actions. If you hit 2-4 of a group it usually takes the fight out of them.
This is a hard one to decide (I'm serious about this) because If I go with the Glock, I have no 9mm anything and would need to ammo-up and get leather etc. If I go .45 the gun costs the same and I need to also ammo-up for the 45 but I already have some leather.
At least untill I decide this dilemmia, I have my .357 Vaquero which works just fine, I am proficent with, and I have enough ammo for a small barrage...
My BP revolvers are for fun and relaxation but In a real pinch you could count on one if you had to, just forget about reloading. Best to have 2 guns. They aren't really in this decision but I do know their capibilities!
Opnions please?
ZVP
 
MY original thoughts were that today you might face multiple foes or go up against someone who had 15-19 shots and that could go wrong fast!
Click to expand...

'Die Hard' was a movie. Even if you face more than one bad guy, when you draw a gun they'll likely run, when you shoot one of'm they'll for sure run.
I've been in 6 shootings at work and never fired more than 4 rounds in any one of'm.
Having said that, if you go up against Army Special Forces, Navy Seals or a Swat Team they'll kill you no matter what gun you have.

34 years as an Officer/Deputy and I often carry a Colt SAA while off duty.
 
The 45 LC is an excellent round and all.

I ran single action revolvers in IPSC just for fun, they are slower than double action revolvers, and they are way slower to reload.

Look, use what you want and feel comfortable with.
 
Everybody wants a black pistol or rifle now-a-days.
However, the only thing that matters is that you have something that you can figure out how to use when it's 3am and you are NOT awake yet.

You need to study incident reports, even those NRA articles, to get an idea of what makes a difference "when the balloon goes up." You'd be surprised at what people have defended their home and property with.

But, on the coolness factor, an 870 pump just ain't got it like a Glock.
But it does have that great "attitude adjuster" sound thing! :)

OJW
 
Sometimes, when you pull the trigger on your Glock it doesn't go bang. When that happens, you have to unjam it - it won't go bang again until you do. However, when you pull the trigger on a wheel gun and it doesn't go bang, you just pull the trigger again - it goes to the next opportunity and if there's a loaded cartridge there, it goes bang.
 
I don't shoot anything DA, not even a DA revolver. Cocking a hammer just comes naturally. I guess it ought to after doing it for 34 years.:D I bought a Glock once. Hated that long creepy trigger pull.
 
Oh, and since your into CAS you likely have a good shotgun. If I have a 'bump' in the night I take my Spartan SXS to have a look see. I might stick a SAA in my belt but probably not.
 
Well I picked the GLOCK because of it's reliability reports and the magazine (Sticks are a fast reload). Yes it does posess all the semi-auto woes and you need to train yourself to deal with it. I mean train for that 3AM Jam, not just during a daylight range session! I totally wore out my .45 ACP semi Auto and am familliar with most of the requirements of operation of a semi-auto. I'd have to brush-up but I do have some muscle memories!
Still, I feel the best with a Single Action Revolver! Something just natural with operating one for me. Of all my possibilities, it's my favorite. Definatelly a 3AM, half asleep, gun for me!
I appreciate the replies spoken with experience and treasure the facts from those who know! Thankyou.
I view the gun as a tool. Properly maintained and adjusted, it will do the job it's ment for. No 1/2 way excuses, you must maintain tour equipment!
I have approached this topic from many angles and the answer always comes out the same.
Thanks folks for your inputs as they reenforce my conclusions, I think for me, "Old Reliable" is the way to go!
The .45 Colt caliber is likely the best one for me as it does the job every time! As I said I have a .357 Mag Vaquero to use untill I save-up and buy the .45. I don't feel undergunned with the .357 untill I get the new one...
ZVP
 
ZVP wrote:
MY origonal thoughts were that today you might face multiple foes or go up against someone who had 15-19 shots and that could go wrong fast!
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter if you go up against someone who has 15 to 19 cartridges because all you need to do is hit them with one. So how many shots they have really isn't a factor as long as you can hit them with just one of yours quickly before they hit you. It's like the shoot outs I've read about that Wild Bill Hickok was in where his foes were shooting a lot of shots wildly at him and he just calmly and carefully took aim and hit them with his first shot.

ZVP wrote:
The Glock has a minimal caliber (9mm) but a lot of shots
Click to expand...

If I were you I'd stay away from the plastic glock that has had more accidental discharges than any other semi-automatic handgun in history. We all remember that video of the DEA agent who was "the only one qualified in this room to operate the glock "foty""....bang, shot himself right in the leg. Not trying to start a discussion on the safety or non safety of glocks, that is subjective and open to argument, but what isn't open to argument is how many accidental discharges have happened with glocks. So just giving my opinion here and not wanting to argue with anyone. I just personally don't care for a plastic gun nor one that has had as many accidental discharges as the glock. For myself, I like my semi-auto to be a single action 1911 and have an exposed hammer that I can SEE is cocked or not.

As I said earlier, it is more important that you fire your first shots accurately than having a huge magazine capacity. However; you mention the 9mm as being a "minimal" caliber but that it has lots of shots. So if you want lots more shots, instead of getting a plastic 9mm in what you feel has "minimal" knock down power, get yourself a steel or even better, a stainless steel Para Ordnance 12, 13 or 14 round mag in .45 acp that has an exposed hammer that you can SEE is cocked, is the old tried and proven 1911 with a grip thickness that is only 1/8 inch wider than a standard single stack 1911, (the grip panels are made thinner so the grip is actually only 1/8th inch wider than a single stack) that can knock a man clean down with one shot, and has three built in safeties (grip safety, hammer on half cock notch, and thumb safety) and that you can SAFELY carry chambered with the hammer fully cocked with the thumb safety applied ("cocked and locked") because it is impossible for it to go off unless you first thumb the safety off and then depress the grip safety.

Lot's of people are "queasy" about carrying a handgun with the hammer cocked. But it is perfectly safe to do with a 1911 and you can thumb off that safety in a nano second and your holding it will depress the grip safety which mean you have to overcome TWO safeties before it can fire even with the hammer fully cocked over a loaded round. It really is about the safest semi-auto system and once one gets past the initial reluctance to carry with the hammer cocked and realizes that it simply cannot fire without first thumbing the safety off and depressing the grip safety, it becomes intuitive and very fast. Even faster than cocking a single action revolver because your 1911 hammer is already cocked and your thumb safety can be thumbed off in a nano second. Actually it is faster than a double action automatic because you don't have to do a long squeeze to cock the hammer since it is already cocked and you don't have to get used to one type of squeeze for the first double action shot and then another type of squeeze for the single action follow up shots. Just one type of squeeze period. I can't say enough good about it.

So if I were you if you must have a semi-auto, I would go with the Para Ordnance and probably with the single action 45-14 model that has a 14 shot .45 acp mag and with one in the chamber that gives you 15 shots. Or you can get the 12 or 13 shot smaller more easily concealable versions. My cousin has the .45 acp 12 shot small easily concealable Para Ordnance and it is sweet. Lots of shots and plenty of knockdown power in a small package that won't easily accidentally discharge on you like glocks are famous for doing. You can snag a 1911 trigger with a tree twig, or your finger or anything and even with the hammer fully cocked over a loaded chamber, unless the thumb safety is off AND the grip safety depressed, it will not accidentally discharge. If that DEA agent and many others had been using a 1911 instead of a glock, there wouldn't have been as many accidental discharges. Of course there's no accounting for people's ignorance or stupidity, but you know what I mean generally speaking.

ZVP wrote:
the Rugers held six but I can hit with em!
Click to expand...

If you can hit with the single action Rugers really well, then I refer you to the first paragraph of my post again. If you can hit well with your first revolver shot, then you may not need a semi-auto.



.
 
Last edited:
I prefer single actiion and live by Wyatt Earps advice, "take your time in a hurry" when it comes to shooting!! As was mentioned previously, it doesn't matter how may rounds you have, as long as you can hit what you're aiming at with the 1st one!!
 
I would not use a SA for home defense if I had a choice. If I had to hold someone at gunpoint I do not what to have to cock the hammer, or have a light trigger pull. Once the guy gives if, if you shoot him, you go to jail. Even if it was by "accident".

A da revolver is fine. You can cock if you need to, and a heavy pull for safety.

In all candor, home defense is best left to the long arm. A carbine or shotgun would serve you much better.

I have crap vison, I have no problems reloading the 38. Not always a money saver though. Just like the 9mm, it is often just as expensive to reload for it as to buy it. I am green with envy of they fellas who can reload 50 round for $4. best I can do is $11. (I see no point in spend money on casting equipment, buying alloy and sizing and lubing equipment to "save" money on bullets. But if you have it, why not.)

Glock says not to feed them reloads. I did once, gun jammed up tight. Never did it again. YMMV
 
coach gun, then the carbine. A handgun would not be my first choice unless it is strapped to my hip at the time!
 
I'm halfway towards solving the reload speed issue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZAGpJr5RsU

Next step: magazine feeding, via spring-loaded foot-long brass tubes plugging into a hole just left of the hammer. Once the cylinder is dry it'll start pulling from the mag, with empties being auto-ejected. There's cosmetic cleanup to be done but once I have mag feeding I can ditch the ejector rod and run the gas line in it's place, seriously improving the looks.
 
"Sometimes, when you pull the trigger on your Glock it doesn't go bang. When that happens, you have to unjam it - it won't go bang again until you do. However, when you pull the trigger on a wheel gun and it doesn't go bang, you just pull the trigger again - it goes to the next opportunity and if there's a loaded cartridge there, it goes bang."


This argument simply doesn't hold water anymore. If it were true that semi auto pistls were so unreliable I don't think we'd see very many law enforcement agencies using them. As it is, virtually every agency in the US uses semi auto pistols. It may be that a Glock doesn't have the beautiful machine work found on a SAA, but if I had to choose, I wouldn't hesitate to pick the ugly injection molded plastic framed Glock.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top