Shotshells in a handgun - .410, .45acp

F

FirstFreedom

Moderator
I have questions - here's the deal - I have a hankerin to get a revolver that can double as a snake defense gun when in the sloughs/bayous/whathaveyou (just ran across a copperhead the other day while out hunting). I'm trying to decide between a .45 acp revolver, which of course can use the .45 acp shotshells - I think CCI makes some, and a .45 colt/.410 shotshell revolver.

My main question is, can ALL .45 colt revolvers also shoot .410 shotshells, or only SOME .45 colt revolvers can? I see some advertised as handling both, and I believe the cylinder is longer on them - I think the .410 bore shotshell is too long for a standard .45colt cylinder, right?

Second question: which round is going to be more effective against snake at close ranges, .45acp shotshells or .410 shotshells - I'm guessing .410. But, OTOH, the .45acp gun is a smaller more handy gun, so that's a big factor also, if the effective difference is negligible. I'd also just prefer a .45acp, because it can be used as a nice CCW gun using the same ammo as my .45 semis, so I'm leaning that way unless there's some real advantage to the .410 ballistics-wise.
 
Personally, I'd feel better prepared with a .22 semiauto (22/45) for poppin' snakes. The .410 would definitely pack a longer range punch than .45 ACP shotshells, though. Cylinder length is going to be the biggest factor in whether a .410 shell will fit in your .45LC or not. (American Derringer makes a double .410 or .45LC Derringer, but it's not particularly cheap.)
 
The .410 is much to long for a standard.45 Colt chamber. If you have to use factory loads (like the CCI shotshell) and a packable handgun then the .45acp revolver would be the best bet. If you handload then you can make your own shotshells with very little effort and then I would go with the .45 Colt.
 
As far as I know only thunder 5 and FMJ ducktown have ever made revolvers in .410, though I think I saw a Magnum research BFR chambered in .410 once in a magazine. .410ga is too long for a .45 colt chamber, though I hope some day some enterprising fool makes minishells in .410ga for just such a purpose. .45 colt shotshells exist, as do .44 spl. I have a bulldog .44 which I think would fit the exact idea you have, hollowpoints for defesne, shotshells for snakes. If you do want to get a .410 just for the neatness factor, might I suggest a FMJ DD double barreled derranger in .45/410. They cost less then a hundred bucks and are rugged if not pretty. Many people call them garbage, but they work. I personally like the longer barreled model, and i plan to get one so I can pretend i am "Mississippi" from Rio Bravo :p

n-lein.jpg

BTW this picture belongs to http://www.derringer.de/
Prices can be found at
http://www.kyimports.com/fmj.htm
 
CCI makes shotshells in 45Colt. One can make there own but it really is not worth the effort unless you need to taylor a load for a specific purpose. By the way I am in rattlesnake and cottonmouth territory on a regular basis. I have never had one even crawl in my direction let alone attempt an attack. Don't get me wrong I have no qualms killing one if it absolutlely needs killing or to eat. But over all they are very good for the environment. Around my parts if at all possible the snakes get a pass and the rats get the shotshell. And like QuickdrawLimpsalot stated American Derringer makes a model(very nice)that is perfect for your needs.
 
OK - yes, most snakes go the other way, but SOMETIMES cottonmouths can be agressive and actually come toward you and you're pretty helpless if you're knee-deep in water trying to get away. Now I like the idea of a .45 colt revolver (without the long cylinder for .410), since CCI makes a commercial shotshell for it - what I'll probably end up doing is keep my eyes peeled for either a .45 acp or .45 colt, whichever ones comes along in a better deal that tickles my fancy first. Thanks all.
 
If you take a primed sized case, fill it with a small charge of powder, place a Wonder Wad, intended to seal Cap and ball revolver charges over the powder, enough shot to leave enough space for another wonder wad and a few drops of wax to seal the top from water, and hold the wad in place better during recoil. Two wads would be advisable over the powder if the charge is warmish.
 
I've always wanted to do this with my 454 Casull.

Do you have any idea of what kind of a pattern will result from a handgun and at what range?

Wonder if a load could be made for close up quail?
 
It's my understanding that Speer says DON'T use their .45 ACP shotloads in a revolver. They're made for autos.
You're better off if you're looking for a snake gun revolver to go with any of the .22, .38/.357, .44 Mag, or .45 Colt revolvers.
Even the .22s will put a snake down quite well, I've done it.
Denis
 
I did a multiple gun Speer shotshell test in all available calibers at the time (before the .45 Colt came out) about seven years ago. Pattern size depends on number of pellets, rifling twist, distance, and velocity.
A faster twist gives you a larger spread because it spins the pattern quicker just out the barrel. A longer barrel, like a carbine, gives a wider spread because the shot charge comes out faster & spins faster. The longer the distance to the target, the more spin & the greater spread.
The spin out the barrel is what makes these shotshells a close range deal, unlike a smoothbore where the charge comes out in a non-rotating mass of individual pellets.
I tried guns from the little NAA one-inch .22 LR mini revolver through a long barreled Ruger .44 Mag to an older Browning .44 levergun.
Autos & revolvers.
The Colt Python & Detective Special were about the worst in spreading quickly of the handguns because of their rifling, the little NAA mini guns actually don't do bad at all.
Effective distances are about 5 to 20 feet. Better chances of good results out to 20 feet with the larger calibers because of more shot pellets per load. The snake I put down about 25 years ago was about ten feet away, done with a .22 LR shotshell through my Ruger Single-Six.
These are not really effective as hunting ammo, unless you can get your birds to hold still while you walk up on them. The rifled bores just cause too rapid dispersion of the shot column.
Denis
 
I think shotshells out of rifled handguns are good for about knife throwing distance. keep it within seven yards and you will at least wound a snake.
 
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