shotshells for .38.357

R

reteach

New member
I tried a search on this this but didn't have any luck.
I intend to take up fly fishing, which usually involves walking along streams with brushy banks that could very well hide snakes. I plan to carry a 3-inch Ruger SP101 with one or two rounds of snake shot, followed by some hollow points.
I've been reading about CCI's Big 4 shotshell, trying to find some good reviews.

Does anyone here have experience with these rounds?

Bonus points for ideas in general from anyone who has experience flyfishing and carrying a handgun.
 
I have used them before, they worked good. I never used one in defence but they worked fine in test firing and patterned good for the distance I shot them at from my 4" smith or ruger.
 
i relaod and have made my own using the Speer shot capsule - they work adequately. I look at it this way - if your are on top of a snake and need to use them, you're close enough. If you are so you can back away from the snake - why is there a need to shoot the snake?

I now make my own 38/357 shot shells depending on the revolver (i.e. 38 or 357. I drop the powder charge insert an aluminum gas check and use a smaller and longer seating die stem to push to the depth I want, insert shot and cap with another aluminum gas check at the cartridge mouth. If a person wants to, they can take a artist brush and dip in glue and wipe it around the inside of the case mouth with the aluminum gas check seated just below the case mouth.
 
Thanks for the replies.

Smee78 - At what distance did you shoot them?

Lunger - That's the kind of thing I was looking for. Pretty impressive pattern out of the short barrel.

Bedbugbilly - I agree about not shooting a snake if it's not necessary. They serve a good purpose in their place and I'd rather leave them alone. It's like any defensive carry - I don't want to ever even draw my gun, much less shoot it, except in practice. Much rather retreat than shoot. But I do want to be able to defend myself if I can't retreat.
 
357 ... about 4 gr 700x with two discs cut out of thin cardboard over top. Slight tamp with dowel. Fill with 90 grains of shot (about 1/8 in from top of case). One more cardboard disc on top. Heavy Crimp and then drip wax over top. Decent snake shot.
 
I use them a lot in Florida, they're very effective out to 10 yards on rattlesnakes out of a 4 " barrel and 3 yds out of a snubby. I currently carry the .45 and 9mm when coyote hunting.

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I used to make my own shot shells for my 357. I used the backing paper from peal-n-stick shipping labels to make the shot cups. Cut strips that are as wide as the length of the case from the mouth to the top of the rim. I rolled the strip around a dowel and folded the top closed and held the seam with masking tape. I filled the cup with 150 grains of #9 shot. I used a circular card of the same paper, cut using a slightly flared case as a cutter, put the wad over 5 grains of HP-38 / 231 and put the case over the filled cup. I lightly crimped the cup in place. In my 4 and 6 inch revolver I got about 1" of diameter for every foot of distance with a very even shot dispersion. At ten feet it could kill a large snake and that was what I was after. I now have a 45/410 derringer that I carry for snakes. The 410 loads are more effective and have a bit more range. My 357 is kept loaded with real bullets for larger targets.
 
Since you are going to take up fly fishing here is what I know. I have been fly fishing since I was about 17 years old. You will find out you spend a lot of time in the water because its hard to fish a fly rod from a brushy shore. So you wade a lot. I have fished were water moccasins were swimming around me. They never bothered me. But I didn't like it. Once on the bank a small one crawled over the toe of my wader. I moved.

I have seen snakes on the bank while fishing but most were gone before I would have had a chance to get out a gun and shoot it. I like snakes and don't like to kill them if I don't have to.

Since you will be in the water make sure your gun is carried high so it doesn't get wet. And if using chest waders don't put a belt over them. If you fall the belt will make your feet float and your head go down and it will drown you.

You can make your own shot capsules or just buy them. For no more than you will need I would just buy a box of the Speer loads. They should last a lifetime of fishing.
 
And if using chest waders don't put a belt over them. If you fall the belt will make your feet float and your head go down and it will drown you.
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Agree with most of what you say. A little off topic ,but wearing a belt over chest waders is recommended. I know from personal experience it will not make your feet float .

Here is a good article on the subject.
http://www.flyfisherman.com/wading-safety/the-big-swim/

Again apologies for straying off topic.
 
Definitely test fire them.

I've tried the .22 version in two guns. A JC Higgins 9 shot revolver and a 39a.
The revolver was a can't miss on soda cans. The 39a, I was attempting to make plinking fun for a can't hit the board side of the barn guy. He still couldn't hit a soda can...

So I took a try. Even when I closed in 5', I still missed a shot.

Guessing it has to do with the mirco groove rifling of the 39a. But those things go anywhere other than where aimed.

Ya, wrong caliber, but just make sure you always test fire any gun and ammo before depending on them. Weird stuff can happen and you can end up worse than defenseless, and dead.
 
I use the standard CCI shotshells with #9 shot instead of the "big 4" loads. They have always worked well and give better pattern density.
 
ratshooter and lunger - I don't plan to wear waders. Had a job once that required a lot of wading. A co-worker wore chest waders, fell down, and his waders filled with water. He came close to drowning. We managed to cut the straps and pull him out of the waders. I can wade without waders.

I'm thinking that I'll use a belt pouch to carry the Ruger. I'll waterproof the pouch and I can shift it higher if I need to.

Thanks for the replies.
 
Shoulder holster might be the thing for you..........

I still have some of the CCI-Speer plastic shot capsules you handloaded. Filled with 9s, they were effective to about 6-8 feet.......
 
I use them a lot in Florida, they're very effective out to 10 yards on rattlesnakes
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Got any pictures of your patterns? I'd be interested in the details of the loads too. If you meant 10 feet, I agree, and too, I've found virtually no difference in performance comparing when comparing 3" vs. 4" barrels.

I've made my own and shot them a lot here on our farm but beyond 10 feet, the patterns are far too open to be sure of a stopping shot. I've used with #12 shot as well as #9 shot and neither gives the density necessary. For snakes, I'd recommend stepping aside or getting a big stick as either will be effective and the latter can be wielded from about the same distance as shot loads. Rod

I used to make my own shot shells for my 357. I used the backing paper from peal-n-stick shipping labels to make the shot cups. Cut strips that are as wide as the length of the case from the mouth to the top of the rim. I rolled the strip around a dowel and folded the top closed and held the seam with masking tape. I filled the cup with 150 grains of #9 shot. I used a circular card of the same paper, cut using a slightly flared case as a cutter, put the wad over 5 grains of HP-38 / 231 and put the case over the filled cup. I lightly crimped the cup in place. In my 4 and 6 inch revolver I got about 1" of diameter for every foot of distance with a very even shot dispersion. At ten feet it could kill a large snake and that was what I was after.
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Interesting post ShooterPRS...I've never tried that technique...making a shot cup...a bit of a PITA but if it works, what the heck...Rod
 
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I bought the Speer shot capsules to load for my .45 Colt, for this purpose. I used the recommended powder charge that came with the capsules, and I believe it's too hot. With #12 shot, it will cover a paper grocery bag with holes from a distance of around 6 feet. I think a lighter powder charge wouldn't blow the pattern quite as much, but have not made time to test & verify it. So if ya go this route, try some charges below their recommended ones.

I used to use the Speer ready-made shotshells in my .45 auto, and found them satisfactory. I could lean over the edge of the tractor and shoot voles scurrying through the stubble while drilling double crop beans.
 
The problem I had with the Speer shot cups was that often the shot would stay in the capsule. That is why I started making my own paper shot cups. Velocity does make a difference in the groups so driving them faster than 1100 fps is not advised.
 
possum, if you back the powder charge off too far, the capsules don't break apart when fired from some firearms. As such, the shot charge is not released, and all you have for a projectile is the tumbling capsule.

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I spent a few years messing with shot capsules, as well as home-made extended-length/extra-payload shot shells in revolvers, while trying to get a revolver load that met the legal requirements for small game and upland game in Utah. (1/2 oz minimum, #9 shot at smallest.)

If you just want to pop some rats or snakes on occasion, at close range, the CCI factory stuff is okay -- not great, but okay. And I do believe that the shot capsules help keep the pattern a bit tighter than loose shot in home-brew shells.

I would choose the #9 shot version over #4, but that's just my preference.
 
I have loaded 100 rounds of 32 caliber shot loads in 32 mag brass for my buddy. He lives in Weatherford Tx and seems to have an abundance of snakes. And he hates snakes and shoots them one and all.

The 32 loads I made use a Hornady .308 gas check over the powder and then the shot. We ordered some #12 and #10 shot from BPI several years ago and thats what we use. The #12 that is.

Loaded with gas checks instead of shot capsules it doesn't seem the shot pattern circles as bad. Anyway with the first box of 50 rounds he killed over 40 snakes and he does not get close neither. I am guessing the loose shot isn't spun out as much as the shot capsules.

He stated he shot a few snakes twice but it wasn't needed. They were all pretty much one shot kills. I would guess 357 cases and 44 mag cases would work even better. But the 32s worked well enough.
 
I was shooting the ground with in 10ft of me and the pattern looked good from the mud impression. I do perfer my 45colt shot shells due to the volume in them but thats a personal preference.
 
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