Short-barreled .45ACP ammo?
- Thread starter BB
- Start date
I use Federal Personal Defense in my Kimber Ultra Carry. The lot I tested about 2 months ago ran about 890 fps from my 3" barrel. The recoil is modest and is standard pressure load. I also heard good things about Remington Golden Saber 185gr in standard pressure. I'm not too sure of running a lot of +P ammo in these little light weight pistols.
Shawn Dodson
Moderator
We've tested various cartridges with a Glock 30. Test results can be viewed at http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs31.htm
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/s/ Shawn Dodson
Firearms Tactical Institute
http://www.firearmstactical.com
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/s/ Shawn Dodson
Firearms Tactical Institute
http://www.firearmstactical.com
I like the 185-200 grain ammo best. Look at Hornady 185 and 200 +P. Also have a look at ProLoad 185 +P.
You're going to need as much velocity as possible if you're going to be lobbing a .45 ACP bullet from a short barrel. Like you mentioned, Corbon might be the way to go also.
Forgot to ask:
You said it would be a .45ACP Snub? You sure about that? I usually think of a snub as a REVOLVER with a barrel less than 3inches. Has this gun been cut or something?
Ben
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Almost Online IM: BenK911
ICQ # 53788523
"Gun Control Is Being Able To Hit Your Target" http://ben.gunsnet.net
[This message has been edited by Ben (edited September 22, 2000).]
You're going to need as much velocity as possible if you're going to be lobbing a .45 ACP bullet from a short barrel. Like you mentioned, Corbon might be the way to go also.
Forgot to ask:
You said it would be a .45ACP Snub? You sure about that? I usually think of a snub as a REVOLVER with a barrel less than 3inches. Has this gun been cut or something?
Ben
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Almost Online IM: BenK911
ICQ # 53788523
"Gun Control Is Being Able To Hit Your Target" http://ben.gunsnet.net
[This message has been edited by Ben (edited September 22, 2000).]
BrokenArrow
New member
If ya are a believer, Evan Marshal says the best from short barrels so far is the 185 Golden Saber at 90% one shot stops, with the 230 Hydra-Shok at 89%. Both around 96% overall, a little better from 5 inch barrels.
For comparison, the 9mm 124 +P GS is 88% from over 4 inch, and 84% from under 4 inch, the 40SW 165 GS 95% overall. IIRC that is.
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[This message has been edited by BrokenArrow (edited September 22, 2000).]
For comparison, the 9mm 124 +P GS is 88% from over 4 inch, and 84% from under 4 inch, the 40SW 165 GS 95% overall. IIRC that is.
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[This message has been edited by BrokenArrow (edited September 22, 2000).]
When comparing revolver barrel lengths to pistol barrel lengths, shouldn't we either subtract the chamber length from the pistol or add the cylinder length to the revolver? Granted that the cylinder gap contributes to some loss of power in the revolver, but doesn't the cycling of an action also bleed off some energy (though likely too late to matter)?
Thus my 4 1/4" Ruger P90 barrel is 3 1/4" from muzzle to bullet - the same as a 3" barrel on a revolver.
[This message has been edited by Solitar (edited September 22, 2000).]
Thus my 4 1/4" Ruger P90 barrel is 3 1/4" from muzzle to bullet - the same as a 3" barrel on a revolver.
[This message has been edited by Solitar (edited September 22, 2000).]
In my compact .45's I use Corbon.
I did not used to be a fan of their ammo, but in tests I have seen, their ammo loses the least velocity out of a short barrel. It must be the fast powder they use.
In my Glock 30, the Corbon 230gr load only loses 33 fps when compared to a full sized gun. That gives me a 230gr bullet that moves out of my compact Glock at over 900 fps. Not bad!
For some reason, it has been found NOT true that lighter bullets retain velocity better out of short barrels. In fact, most often, the heavier bullets hold their velocity better, possibly because they are in the barrel longer due to how slow they are moving?
None the less, there are not a ton of tests on this kind of thing, but over at the Calibers website someone chronographed loads out of the Glock 21 and the Glock 30, and Corbon ammo held the velocity the best in all bullet weights, losing very little velocity from the short barrel. The 200gr Corbon moves at a little under 1050fps out of the Glock 30. That is another good choice, but I like the heavier 230gr bullet, and it loses less velocity from the short barrel.
Also, because Corbon is known to use softer bullets as well as fast powder, I am confident that it has the highest chance of expanding, even from a short barrel.
I did not used to be a fan of their ammo, but in tests I have seen, their ammo loses the least velocity out of a short barrel. It must be the fast powder they use.
In my Glock 30, the Corbon 230gr load only loses 33 fps when compared to a full sized gun. That gives me a 230gr bullet that moves out of my compact Glock at over 900 fps. Not bad!
For some reason, it has been found NOT true that lighter bullets retain velocity better out of short barrels. In fact, most often, the heavier bullets hold their velocity better, possibly because they are in the barrel longer due to how slow they are moving?
None the less, there are not a ton of tests on this kind of thing, but over at the Calibers website someone chronographed loads out of the Glock 21 and the Glock 30, and Corbon ammo held the velocity the best in all bullet weights, losing very little velocity from the short barrel. The 200gr Corbon moves at a little under 1050fps out of the Glock 30. That is another good choice, but I like the heavier 230gr bullet, and it loses less velocity from the short barrel.
Also, because Corbon is known to use softer bullets as well as fast powder, I am confident that it has the highest chance of expanding, even from a short barrel.
BrokenArrow
New member
Fed 230 HS did 805 fps from a friend's S&W 4506 (5 inch).
Did 750 fps from my G30, and 800 from my G21.
The 185 GS did 980 from G21, 935 from G30.
YMMV from lot of ammo to lot of ammo?
Remember a test in Combat Handguns of CB 45 ammo. The only round that expanded from a Commander barrel after 4 layers of denim was the 185 +P. The 230 +p did not. Again, YMMV.
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Did 750 fps from my G30, and 800 from my G21.
The 185 GS did 980 from G21, 935 from G30.
YMMV from lot of ammo to lot of ammo?
Remember a test in Combat Handguns of CB 45 ammo. The only round that expanded from a Commander barrel after 4 layers of denim was the 185 +P. The 230 +p did not. Again, YMMV.
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jdthaddeus
New member
Thanks for the info, BrokenArrow. I have not seen gelatin tests for the Corbon. I would love to see it, as I think it would perform well from a short barreled gun.
Corbon says that their 200gr bullet should expand and penetrate to 12 inches, if that helps at all. And my own water bottle tests from my Glock 30 showed the 200gr Corbon bullet expanding violently, and fragmenting into almost nothing ( I could not find any large pieces of the bullet left), while penetrating three water jugs and blowing the bottles up like nothing I have seen. Once again, this is from the Glock 30. Since water is a very violent medium I expect that other mediums would not cause the bullet to fragment like that.
FYI, other bullets from my Glock 27 would not even expand in the water jugs, so it is a pretty decent test to see if a bullet will expand from a specific gun.
All rounds from the Glock 30 expanded, the Corbon expanding most violently and fragmenting, which, once again, I expect would not happen in a different medium like gelatin or flesh.
I do like to see the "four layers of denim" tests, but I also think they are a bit extreme. I doubt I will ever shoot someone with four layers of denim on, but even in the worst case, I still have a .45 caliber bullet. That makes me feel good.
Corbon says that their 200gr bullet should expand and penetrate to 12 inches, if that helps at all. And my own water bottle tests from my Glock 30 showed the 200gr Corbon bullet expanding violently, and fragmenting into almost nothing ( I could not find any large pieces of the bullet left), while penetrating three water jugs and blowing the bottles up like nothing I have seen. Once again, this is from the Glock 30. Since water is a very violent medium I expect that other mediums would not cause the bullet to fragment like that.
FYI, other bullets from my Glock 27 would not even expand in the water jugs, so it is a pretty decent test to see if a bullet will expand from a specific gun.
All rounds from the Glock 30 expanded, the Corbon expanding most violently and fragmenting, which, once again, I expect would not happen in a different medium like gelatin or flesh.
I do like to see the "four layers of denim" tests, but I also think they are a bit extreme. I doubt I will ever shoot someone with four layers of denim on, but even in the worst case, I still have a .45 caliber bullet. That makes me feel good.
Quantum Singularity
New member
Federal Hydra Shok personal defense 165 grain load is a good bet. Modest recoil and still its a non +P round.
Current issue of American Handgunner magazine has an article by Charles Petty about 230g bullets in short barreled 45s.
His conclusion is that it doesn't matter much what barrel length you have, as modern designed 230g JHPs expand reasonably from all of them.
This flies in the face of most of the opinions and advice I've seen here and on Glock Talk but it goes along with my own observations and chronographing.
Dave T
His conclusion is that it doesn't matter much what barrel length you have, as modern designed 230g JHPs expand reasonably from all of them.
This flies in the face of most of the opinions and advice I've seen here and on Glock Talk but it goes along with my own observations and chronographing.
Dave T
Shawn Dodson
Moderator
230gr JHPs usually expand in bare gelatin, but they usually fail to expand when heavy clothing is encountered.
I haven't seen Petty's article, but my guess is he performed testing in bare gelatin only.
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/s/ Shawn Dodson
Firearms Tactical Institute
http://www.firearmstactical.com
I haven't seen Petty's article, but my guess is he performed testing in bare gelatin only.
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/s/ Shawn Dodson
Firearms Tactical Institute
http://www.firearmstactical.com
In the short barrels, I prefer the more exotic loads, like Magsafe swat, RBCD, and Aguilla. With normal chamber pressures, these loads produce excellent results out of short barrels. Using a Kimber ultra carry (3") these rounds (magsafe and RBCD)penetrated a windshield and produced a wound channel of 10-11" @ 2.5-3" in diameter in denim covered wet newspaper. Over penetration was not an issue with these rounds. The rounds dumped all their energy into the medium. The Aguilla was very impressive also, producing a more conventional wound channel. A bullet that produced excellent results was the gold dot fired at +p pressure through a 4" barrel. Almost as impressive as the the frangibles. Wished we could have tried the gold dot out of the Kimber.