Shooting light

M

Major Dave (retired)

New member
By Texas regulation, legal shooting times for deer is 30 minutes before sunrise, until 30 minutes after sunset.

But my recent experience indicates it is too dark to see a deer that early/late.

For my 72 year old eyes, I can not identify a deer more like 15 minutes before/after sun rise/set.

That's with my unaided eyesight, i.e., not looking through a scope or binos. My optics do add about 5 minutes to my shooting light.

Is it just that my old eyes are dim? What is your experience with early/late light conditions?
 
It depends on a lot of factors. Is it raining or clear? Are you in cover such as trees or in the open. In BC they actually allow you to shoot up to an hour after sunset. Last year my buddy shot a huge moose 45 minutes after sunset, but it was silhouetted against the afterglow of the setting sun. Otherwise we would not have seen it at all. Up to a certain point a larger objective lens on your scope will help, but for most of us older guys, anything over about 40mm shows little improvement. The eyes are not as flexible as they once were.
 
Unless it's early in the season, i'm usually out of the stand before 30 minutes past sundown. It's too dark, but my hunting land has thick canopy, so the light cuts out early.
 
My experience is similar and my Leupold gives me an added 10 minutes before and after. I have choices where I sit as well. If in the woods, it's the darkest. If I sit and observe an open field covered with snow, a deer surely stands out much better. I imagine Texas may not have cut down corn fields with snow cover like northern Midwest states have. There are other threads using a term "light gathering" optics. And some argue pro's & cons over the term. I clearly see a big difference when I observe a tree in the dark woods without then with my Leupold 2-7x set on lowest power. Let's assume Texas allows 30 mins before and after. That equals +60 mins. I see unaided about 15 before and after giving me +30mins. Then with the Leupold, that adds another +10 mins each way for a total of +50 mins. So if I were in Texas, using the Leupold, I'd have at least 50 of the 60 minutes, even though not all of it.
 
Yeah, the regulation is generous for a lot of typical conditions, but gives you probably the max possible/reasonable time for identifying and shooting under ideal circumstances...such as you facing east during a setting sun, cloudless day or maybe with just enough clouds to reflect light downwards from the setting sun, looking at a big, dark deer at close range in a homogenous, light colored field of something thing like shin high winter rye.

That doesn't happen at my place either.
 
Is it just that my old eyes are dim? What is your experience with early/late light conditions?
Click to expand...

As far as light conditions and how long or how little. I would say allot depends on the terrain your hunting in. In brush or heavy woods or on the ground no doubt it gets darker sooner. If your up high in a stand you get the benefit of more time (suns horizon (or skyline.) Than there's the matter of snow. Snow is a great reflector of sun light and moon light. Speaking of snow.
[No camera's at this time.] Here's a little story for you old timers who think their eyes are dimming with age. Mine aren't. I'm 13-lustrum's plus 3.

A few years back I had a huge deer coming into my Stand area late at night over & over. {I think he was chasing doe's is one reason} My Stand. It overlooks a small overgrown hay field. wow!! what a hoof print He left. Over a 5 day span not once did I ever see him. Before daylight to pure darkness my 270 was purposely kept quite. I don't know why? But honestly I was actually bothered by that deer's behavior. I gave passes to does fawns spikes even a 6-point like a drunken sailor that season hoping to get a crack at that monster. One day a storm passed thru the area and it snowed about 3-4" I'd say. During that night the sky cleared and a full moon appeared. By 2 AM it was so bright out I was awaken by the light shinning thru the window next to my bed. For the he|| of it I decided to get dressed and went and sat in my enclosed stand and watched below. Sure enough that Buck made his Grand appearance that night around 3:30. Ate some and bedded down right in front of my Stand. {Talk about a deers insult to this Stand hunter} I could have hit him in the head with a bean blower He was that close. Around 4:30 AM I had to leave. Mother Nature whispering in my ear. {I'm sure your y'all have had that happen.} I never got the chance to harvest that deer. I kinda think my neighbor did. How or (what time of day?) I won't speculate, that's his business. BTW he was at (least) a 12 or 14 pointer. What a trophy. But I just couldn't close the deal on him. So you old gents. If you think your {deer eyes} are dimming try what I did once. (if you have snow) If you see those silhouette's at night I hardly think those old peepers are dimming and are just fine for the next 20-25 yr at the very least._;)
 
I have a couple different stands up. Just depends on where I am sitting. On the field I can see (under clear conditions) past legal shooting light and earlier then shooting light. When I am in the woods...no way I can see a deer that late/early. I am usually packing up my stuff and climbing out of my stand with 5-10 minutes of "Legal" light left.

The thing it comes down to at that point....Legal...yes...smart/safe...NOPE. Just because it is "legal" shooting light doesn't mean it is safe to shoot. All depends on the moon and how clear the skies are. No deer/animal is worth someone getting hurt. You might be able to see that deer 50 yards away, but can you see the hunter 100/150/200 yards away?
 
Let me make one more observation to muddy up the water. I'm used to hunting in FL. Right now, I'm up in Mississippi until after Thanksgiving. What came as a shock to me here was how much faster it went from daylight to full dark here than it does in FL. Down there, the sun will go down (legal sunset) and I've still got a while before it gets too dark to see animals clearly. Up here, it is almost like someone flipped a light switch. I'm guessing it has something to do with the angle the sun is hitting the earth here as opposed to further south.
 
And I am a lot farther north. We have a chart with correction minutes defined on a map so a hunter can jot down the precise legal times if needed. I don't need them too much. I seem to be inside the margin a little each way. I open a bit later and quit a bit sooner. My buddy has a scope even better than mine and stays out and begins at the full times.
 
It depends on environmental conditions, moon light and terrain.

I've been on the edge of a field 2 hours before sunrise, during a full moon and with snow on the ground, I could have easily shot 100 yards.

I've been in dense evergreen woods, with no snow and no moon with heavy cloud cover and I couldn't see to shoot 20 yards BEFORE sunset.

Optics make a big difference too. Many times, I've seen a deer that I could identify as a deer but nothing more about it, yet through the scope I could see it clearly.

Age doesn't help. I've noticed over the last couple years (I'm only 38) that my vision gets "grainy" as it gets close to dark.

In any case, under the right conditions, 30 minutes before and after is about right. Common sense safety dictates the moment. If it's legal and you can see, shoot it. If it's legal and you can't see, don't shoot it.
 
Makes me think of this morning about first light. The just past full moon was still up. I had two deer less than a hundred and fifty yards out bedded in an open field. I easily had the light and the safe backdrop to make the shot, but since I am out of buck tags I couldn't satisfy myself for sure that they were does. I let them go. My eyes aren't what they were once. A few hours later I did get a fat doe.

I quit hunting late years ago. There is just too much chance of making a good shot and losing a deer that would have been easy to find with a little time and light.
 
I agree about evening hunts in favor of morning with upcoming daylight to handle whatever takes place. A couple seasons ago my buddy failed to find a shot buck. It ran in an unexpected direction. We readily found the remains some days later. Even using the tracking light was no help. We spent too much time searching in the dark where it didn't go.
 
I take eye supplements to increase my visual clarity, plus protection against degenerative eye disease, which includes: Lutein, Zeaxanthin and Bilberry.
It takes around 15 minutes for your eyes to get accustomed to the dark.
 
One of my younger brothers(10yrs. my jr.) has come here to shotgun and bp deer hunt for the last 14yrs. He hunts extremely hard, has sit in pouring rain, cold sleeting or snowing weather for days on end from daylight to dark. He has shot his share of deer and a few decent bucks but just cannot get into that trophy, wall hanger range.
Will get back to brother in a sec....

About 9-10yrs ago, my eye's really went south quickly. Long range objects started getting a bit blurry and dusk , dawn vision got really bad so I went to the Dr. and he put me in glasses. Problem with the daytime blurriness was solved. Not so much with the dawn, dusk issue's.:rolleyes:
Could see deer silhouettes fine, just couldn't see my site's clear enough for a clean kill shot. I finally inst'd scopes. on the bp inline's and hi viz rifle site's on the Rem1100.

That worked for me at the expense of a lot of ribbing from my brothers. I'd hear things like " hey, you want one of us to go to your stand with ya this evening and shoot that big monster since you can't see him" or " we can go with ya and hold a flashlight over your shoulder so you can see your sites :rolleyes:

Okay, back to the one brother I started talking about that has never shot a trophy.

He hunts with a stock sited Rem. 1100 identical to mine. About 5-6yrs ago, he went out before daylight and posted up about 40yds. from a big ravine where we knew deer were crossing. Right at daylight he heard a deer coming up out of the ravine. As the deer crested the top of the ravine, brother could see the silhouette of this deer with a massive white rack. He shouldered his shotgun and guess what, couldn't see site's.
He said he looked away and back at the site's several time to no avail. Just couldn't see them. He held on the buck with the shotgun hoping to see the sites and watched as the buck walked 40yds out, broadside, along the ravine till he went out of sight.
Brother was so PO'd.

He should have never told me this. When he left that evening, knowing he would be back @ 0400, I took the receipt for my Rem 1100 Hi-Viz sites, along with a small flashlight and hung them on his stand tree. With a note that said:

"Attention Mr. Deerhunter,

Until you get these Hi-Viz sites on your gun like your older , much wiser brother put on his, just hold this flashlight on your sites so you can see them.

signed,
Mr. Trophy Buck

;)

That weekend we put TruGlos on his.
 
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Late Evening

You guys that stay out until the last minute have an advantage over me as I have seen first hand tonight. I was sitting in a tree line watching the intersection of woods and a cut down corn field. I decided it's late enough, return to the truck, unload, case the shotgun, glance back and see a big white fluffy tail hopping out of the woods into the cornfield. Exactly where I had been sitting and watching. I unzip the shotgun, load one round and go back to the same spot I just left. Of course there was nothing to be seen again. I had the chance for a good shot and blew it by quitting about 5 to 10 minutes early.
 
A litle more info, since you asked..

No snow or open fields in my hunting area. Mostly tall (60 to 80 feet) pines and/or oak trees, with considerable underbrush. Seems to be dim at ground level, with bright sun in the tree tops, then makes the transition from day to night pretty quickly.

Glad to see so many comments on this thread. Thanks, guys.

Oh, and I use a Leupold Vari X III, 1.75-6X32 on my .243, and the newest Leupold VX-3, 2.5-8X36 on my 7X57.
 
In a nutshell I find pretty much the same.

Under good conditions I could see well enough to take a shot 30 min prior to sunrise. On a cloudy, overcast morning, or in heavily wooded areas it would be several minutes later before I'd feel good about a shot.

For me sunset is as late as I want to shoot in the evening except in near perfect conditions. In fact in some states sunset is the last legal time to shoot. If I take a shot in the early AM it is only going to get lighter, and I have all day to find game. Shooting right at sunset only gives me 15-20 minutes of very poor light, then complete dark. It makes it more difficult to find any game I've shot.
 
On the high plains of Wyoming, I can see well enough to clearly identify an antelope (including cheek patches), as much as 45 minutes before sunrise. Two(?) years ago, I even popped a doe just two minutes into legal shooting hours - 28 minutes before sunrise - and didn't realize it until I looked at the time, because we had been up and moving for 15 minutes already.
But, in the very same location, I'm out of light about 5 min after sunset.

In elk/deer territory, in the mountains, there's enough light to identify the target about 15 minutes before sunrise. At the end of the day, I'm usually done 10-20 minutes before sunset - with legal shooting hours ending 30 minutes after sunset.

My good scopes and binoculars can extend that shooting time, but I choose not to do so. I just don't like the idea of hunting with optical 'enhancement'. If I can't see it clearly with my own eyes... I'm done.

I'm sure the disparity between sunrise and sunset, for me, is due to eye strain from scanning everything all day. Someone could probably make a reasonable argument blaming other factors, though...
 
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