The following contains several articles/letters about a "gun activity called "Shoot, Don't Shoot," where students point and shoot real guns loaded with blank cartridges at a television screen showing gunplay situations involving criminals and police.
It teaches children what police are faced with, said Centerville police officer Dwight Christensen, who teaches the course at Centerville Junior High, and the activity is done in a controlled environment where police provide the weapons. It is meant to teach children that they, too, are responsible for their actions, he says." - Deseret News
My question for my friends here on TFL:
· Do any of you have any familiarity with the course?
· My children don't watch tv. We are perhaps more sensitive to violence and gruesomeness than most Americans. If the video shows people sneaking around in the dark, I think we're fine. If it shows a LEO coming upon someone being raped, the video would not be appropriate for our family. If you have familiarity with this video, could you elaborate on its contents, please?
· If homeschoolers wished to gather together and request the Centerville PD to present the course to our group, would we even have a hope of them saying yes?
· Do you have any learned suggestions regarding getting/having this course presented to a group of homeschoolers?
· At this time, I don't know how many homeschoolers we could gather at any given date. Might we need a guaranteed minimum attendance before the PD would consent to work with us? I've never done this sort of thing before with a government entity. I don't even live in that city.
I wanted to get ya'll's input before bothering the Centerville PD with my dumb questions. Thanks in advance.
--Denise
---------------
The following article appeared in the Deseret News on Wednesday, Aug. 9. Utah Gun Owners Alliance's response follows. If you'd like to send a letter yourself, email it to letters@desnews.com.
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,185008520,00.html?
Wednesday, August 09, 2000
7th-graders firing guns in class
Some Davis officials alarmed at police-supervised activity
By Elyse Hayes and Jennifer Toomer-Cook
Deseret News staff writers
CENTERVILLE - Davis County school officials say they will look into a seventh-grade course that has students handling guns under a police officer's supervision.
Many administrators said they were unaware of the gun activity called "Shoot, Don't Shoot," where students point and shoot real guns loaded with blank cartridges at a television screen showing gunplay situations involving criminals and police.
It teaches children what police are faced with, said Centerville police officer Dwight Christensen, who teaches the course at Centerville Junior High, and the activity is done in a controlled environment where police provide the weapons. It is meant to teach children that they, too, are responsible for their actions, he says.
The interactive videotape of gunplay situations was played for the City Council and mayor last week at the request of Councilwoman Nancy Smith, who says none of the school board members or members of the school district she has talked to were aware of the content of the lesson.
A number of school officials say they are shocked.
Davis Education Association President Kathleen Leatham says having children handle guns in school is "wildly inappropriate" and "makes me sick to my stomach."
"And if I were a student in that class, I would refuse to participate."
The content of the lesson came as a surprise to school board members as well.
"This is not something I've ever seen," said Barbara Smith, president of the Davis Board of Education. She declined further comment because she has not seen the program or the tape and was not aware it existed. But, she says, she plans to look into it.
The federal Safe Schools Act bars students from carrying any weapon or pretend weapon to school, and Utah schools typically expel students who violate the act. Law enforcement officers are exempt.
Yet there is a provision in state law that allows school principals to give permission for a person to have a gun at school, said Carol Lear, school law specialist and attorney for the State Office of Education. She believes the spirit of the law was to allow for Revolutionary War demonstrations and the like.
"It's not illegal . . . presuming that the resource officers are asking the principals" for permission, Lear said of student gun handling.
But perhaps cops aren't always asking for permission.
Until just recently, Centerville Junior High principal Jane Muna apparently had no idea guns had been used in teaching the course in previous years. No one has ever asked her permission.
At first, she said, she understood the gun portion of the program was to have students discuss what they had seen on the screen, not actively participate in it.
Christensen taught the gun lesson in Centerville Junior High in the spring and fall of 1999, and he said it was taught by another officer before he took over the course. He does have kids handle real guns but only those who bring parental permission slips.
"We're very upfront about what is going on," he said.
The parental permission letter, sent out by Centerville Police Department, reads that the course will include material that "may be upsetting" and includes "video simulation used in police training . . . The student will be handling a revolver and will simulate with the video life and death situations."
Muna says she has never seen the parental permission slip and that it doesn't matter if parents have given their permission for their children to handle guns - she has not given permission for guns to be handled in her school.
"In my estimation, putting a gun in a student's hand would not be appropriate," she said.
But the gun lesson isn't meant to be fun, Christensen says, and he says he teaches children that if they are in a home where others are playing with guns, they should leave.
"Guns are in most households in the United States," he said. "I would much rather have a child touch a gun with me in control."
Rep. Bill Wright, R-Elberta, who sponsored a bill in the last Legislature that would require mandatory yearlong expulsion for children bringing guns to school, believes the lesson is justified.
"I think the key thing is supervision," Wright said, adding many hunter safety courses are taught at schools in rural areas.
Leatham, like other local presidents of the 19,000-member Utah Education Association teachers union, battled to put the guns-in-schools question to voters in November. The citizens initiative petition, led by the Safe To Learn - Safe to Worship Coalition of churches, parents and teachers, failed to garner enough votes.
Leatham, a sixth-grade teacher, says she supports the program but not the gun-handling lesson, which she has never seen as part of the curriculum. She says the lesson will not result in learning because the fascination will turn immediately to the firearm. "It's going to be fun and games for them," she said.
It is unclear whether any other junior high schools in Davis County are currently teaching the "Shoot, Don't Shoot" activity using real guns. Smith says it is her understanding that some of the schools tried it and dropped it or altered the gun lesson in some way. But, she points out, many principals, like Muna, may be unaware that the activity is going on in their classrooms. Only the principals of Centerville and Central Davis junior high schools were reached or responded to phone messages from the Deseret News, and
neither knew details about the course and what was being taught.
Muna says now that she is aware of the content of the lesson she will review it and will look at the merits of the activity before making any decision for the coming school year.
Councilwoman Smith says the video and the handling of guns is inappropriate for junior high students.
"When will a seventh-grader ever have a gun in his possession? . . . It's just not a real situation," she said. Smith told the Deseret News she believes now that she was on the City Council and not just an "angry mom" she might be able to see action taken on the issue. She first became aware of the program two years ago when her son was attending Centerville Junior High and was invited to participate in the course.
Christensen told the council last week he would be willing to drop the gun activity part of the lesson if the school board deems it inappropriate. He is scheduled to teach the course, including the gun lesson, at Centerville Junior High this fall.
Peggy Hill, director of student assistance programs for Davis School District, says some administrators have been aware of the gun lesson. It makes kids aware of the situations that police officers are often placed in.
But, she says, the district will be looking over the lessons to re-evaluate what is going on in the classroom.
"I think our plan is to revisit those lessons, especially since we say we don't allow guns in schools," she said.
E-MAIL: ehayes@desnews.com ; jtcook@desnews.com
Once again the anti-gun educrats are hysterical. Apparently the same people who think it makes perfect sense to teach birth control as part of "abstinence education" because "someday the students will get married", think it's "sickening" to teach proper firearms handling to students, even though firearms ownership is legal for adults. It's also "wildly inappropriate" to teach students to make critical decisions rationally. Apparently not one of them can tell the difference between a juvenile delinquent bringing weapons to school and a police officer teaching safe handling and use.
When it comes to guns, these "professional educators" advocate ignorance. They think the best way to ensure safety is to portray guns as "forbidden fruit", and to ensure that students stay absolutely ignorant of firearms safety and facts. They're wrong - and unfortunately for our children, they're likely to be "dead" wrong.
What might a 13 year old be doing with a firearm? He might be target shooting with his parents. He might encounter a firearm at a friend or relative's home. A classmate or friend might bring one to school, or a park, or a mall. He might even need to defend himself against an armed intruder at home or even at school. Knowledge of firearms will increase the student's chances of survival should the unthinkable occur.
Apparently political correctness and the socialist agenda of the all-powerful UEA are more important than the lives and safety of our children. Apparently it's better for children to die than to learn that gun use can be safe - and fun!
Obviously the best solution is to teach your children safe firearms use and handling yourself. But not all parents have the skills to do this; many don't know these lifesaving skills themselves. While it's not government's job to teach our children firearms safety, it should at least not stand in the way of responsible parents and law enforcement officers who choose to do so.
The following letter was sent to the Deseret News:
I commend the law enforcement officers and students who participate in the "Shoot, Don't Shoot" program, and urge Davis County officials to continue the program. While I'm unfamiliar with the specifics of the program, the concept is sound.
Given the current hysteria about guns and school shootings, and the prominent role firearms play in TV, movies and video games, it is understandable that our young people are fascinated by firearms, all the more so when misguided adults turn firearms into "forbidden fruit".
While firearms related deaths have declined dramatically in recent years, this fascination can lead youths to handle firearms without proper training and adult supervision. This, in turn, can lead to tragic accidents.
Law enforcement officers are able to teach students about the safe handling of firearms, and the dangers of carelessness and misuse. And they are in a unique position to educate students about the awesome responsibility involved in the decision to use potentially lethal force to stop a crime.
A Department of Justice study shows that juveniles who are taught about firearms by a responsible adult have a 0% incidence of violent criminal behavior. Rather than a "public health menace", such instruction appears to "immunize" young people against firearms misuse.
Our students learn many adult skills in school to prepare them for the responsibilities of adulthood, skills such as parenting, financial management, and voting. Why not responsible firearms handling and decision making?
Officer Christensen is correct. Perhaps the most important lesson we can teach our children is that "they... are responsible for their actions".
Sarah Thompson, M.D.
Executive Director, Utah Gun Owners Alliance
Sandy, UT
Please write to the Deseret News (I expect it will hit other papers today, so check your local paper). And if you live in Davis County, please write to the Davis County Board of Education too!
UTGOA is written and distributed by, Utah Gun Owners Alliance, www.utgoa.org, and Sarah Thompson, M.D. All information contained in these alerts is the responsibility of the author, unless otherwise attributed.
Permission is granted for distribution of these alerts so long as no changes are made, UTGOA is clearly credited, and this message is left intact.
To subscribe to the UTGOA list, send a blank email to utgoa-subscribe at egroups.com or use the form on our web site, http://www.utgoa.org. For more information, see http://www.egroups.com/group/UTGOA.
Archives of the UTGOA alerts can be found at: http://www.egroups.com/messages/UTGOA
[This message has been edited by sbryce (edited August 10, 2000).]
It teaches children what police are faced with, said Centerville police officer Dwight Christensen, who teaches the course at Centerville Junior High, and the activity is done in a controlled environment where police provide the weapons. It is meant to teach children that they, too, are responsible for their actions, he says." - Deseret News
My question for my friends here on TFL:
· Do any of you have any familiarity with the course?
· My children don't watch tv. We are perhaps more sensitive to violence and gruesomeness than most Americans. If the video shows people sneaking around in the dark, I think we're fine. If it shows a LEO coming upon someone being raped, the video would not be appropriate for our family. If you have familiarity with this video, could you elaborate on its contents, please?
· If homeschoolers wished to gather together and request the Centerville PD to present the course to our group, would we even have a hope of them saying yes?
· Do you have any learned suggestions regarding getting/having this course presented to a group of homeschoolers?
· At this time, I don't know how many homeschoolers we could gather at any given date. Might we need a guaranteed minimum attendance before the PD would consent to work with us? I've never done this sort of thing before with a government entity. I don't even live in that city.
I wanted to get ya'll's input before bothering the Centerville PD with my dumb questions. Thanks in advance.
--Denise
---------------
The following article appeared in the Deseret News on Wednesday, Aug. 9. Utah Gun Owners Alliance's response follows. If you'd like to send a letter yourself, email it to letters@desnews.com.
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,185008520,00.html?
Wednesday, August 09, 2000
7th-graders firing guns in class
Some Davis officials alarmed at police-supervised activity
By Elyse Hayes and Jennifer Toomer-Cook
Deseret News staff writers
CENTERVILLE - Davis County school officials say they will look into a seventh-grade course that has students handling guns under a police officer's supervision.
Many administrators said they were unaware of the gun activity called "Shoot, Don't Shoot," where students point and shoot real guns loaded with blank cartridges at a television screen showing gunplay situations involving criminals and police.
It teaches children what police are faced with, said Centerville police officer Dwight Christensen, who teaches the course at Centerville Junior High, and the activity is done in a controlled environment where police provide the weapons. It is meant to teach children that they, too, are responsible for their actions, he says.
The interactive videotape of gunplay situations was played for the City Council and mayor last week at the request of Councilwoman Nancy Smith, who says none of the school board members or members of the school district she has talked to were aware of the content of the lesson.
A number of school officials say they are shocked.
Davis Education Association President Kathleen Leatham says having children handle guns in school is "wildly inappropriate" and "makes me sick to my stomach."
"And if I were a student in that class, I would refuse to participate."
The content of the lesson came as a surprise to school board members as well.
"This is not something I've ever seen," said Barbara Smith, president of the Davis Board of Education. She declined further comment because she has not seen the program or the tape and was not aware it existed. But, she says, she plans to look into it.
The federal Safe Schools Act bars students from carrying any weapon or pretend weapon to school, and Utah schools typically expel students who violate the act. Law enforcement officers are exempt.
Yet there is a provision in state law that allows school principals to give permission for a person to have a gun at school, said Carol Lear, school law specialist and attorney for the State Office of Education. She believes the spirit of the law was to allow for Revolutionary War demonstrations and the like.
"It's not illegal . . . presuming that the resource officers are asking the principals" for permission, Lear said of student gun handling.
But perhaps cops aren't always asking for permission.
Until just recently, Centerville Junior High principal Jane Muna apparently had no idea guns had been used in teaching the course in previous years. No one has ever asked her permission.
At first, she said, she understood the gun portion of the program was to have students discuss what they had seen on the screen, not actively participate in it.
Christensen taught the gun lesson in Centerville Junior High in the spring and fall of 1999, and he said it was taught by another officer before he took over the course. He does have kids handle real guns but only those who bring parental permission slips.
"We're very upfront about what is going on," he said.
The parental permission letter, sent out by Centerville Police Department, reads that the course will include material that "may be upsetting" and includes "video simulation used in police training . . . The student will be handling a revolver and will simulate with the video life and death situations."
Muna says she has never seen the parental permission slip and that it doesn't matter if parents have given their permission for their children to handle guns - she has not given permission for guns to be handled in her school.
"In my estimation, putting a gun in a student's hand would not be appropriate," she said.
But the gun lesson isn't meant to be fun, Christensen says, and he says he teaches children that if they are in a home where others are playing with guns, they should leave.
"Guns are in most households in the United States," he said. "I would much rather have a child touch a gun with me in control."
Rep. Bill Wright, R-Elberta, who sponsored a bill in the last Legislature that would require mandatory yearlong expulsion for children bringing guns to school, believes the lesson is justified.
"I think the key thing is supervision," Wright said, adding many hunter safety courses are taught at schools in rural areas.
Leatham, like other local presidents of the 19,000-member Utah Education Association teachers union, battled to put the guns-in-schools question to voters in November. The citizens initiative petition, led by the Safe To Learn - Safe to Worship Coalition of churches, parents and teachers, failed to garner enough votes.
Leatham, a sixth-grade teacher, says she supports the program but not the gun-handling lesson, which she has never seen as part of the curriculum. She says the lesson will not result in learning because the fascination will turn immediately to the firearm. "It's going to be fun and games for them," she said.
It is unclear whether any other junior high schools in Davis County are currently teaching the "Shoot, Don't Shoot" activity using real guns. Smith says it is her understanding that some of the schools tried it and dropped it or altered the gun lesson in some way. But, she points out, many principals, like Muna, may be unaware that the activity is going on in their classrooms. Only the principals of Centerville and Central Davis junior high schools were reached or responded to phone messages from the Deseret News, and
neither knew details about the course and what was being taught.
Muna says now that she is aware of the content of the lesson she will review it and will look at the merits of the activity before making any decision for the coming school year.
Councilwoman Smith says the video and the handling of guns is inappropriate for junior high students.
"When will a seventh-grader ever have a gun in his possession? . . . It's just not a real situation," she said. Smith told the Deseret News she believes now that she was on the City Council and not just an "angry mom" she might be able to see action taken on the issue. She first became aware of the program two years ago when her son was attending Centerville Junior High and was invited to participate in the course.
Christensen told the council last week he would be willing to drop the gun activity part of the lesson if the school board deems it inappropriate. He is scheduled to teach the course, including the gun lesson, at Centerville Junior High this fall.
Peggy Hill, director of student assistance programs for Davis School District, says some administrators have been aware of the gun lesson. It makes kids aware of the situations that police officers are often placed in.
But, she says, the district will be looking over the lessons to re-evaluate what is going on in the classroom.
"I think our plan is to revisit those lessons, especially since we say we don't allow guns in schools," she said.
E-MAIL: ehayes@desnews.com ; jtcook@desnews.com
Once again the anti-gun educrats are hysterical. Apparently the same people who think it makes perfect sense to teach birth control as part of "abstinence education" because "someday the students will get married", think it's "sickening" to teach proper firearms handling to students, even though firearms ownership is legal for adults. It's also "wildly inappropriate" to teach students to make critical decisions rationally. Apparently not one of them can tell the difference between a juvenile delinquent bringing weapons to school and a police officer teaching safe handling and use.
When it comes to guns, these "professional educators" advocate ignorance. They think the best way to ensure safety is to portray guns as "forbidden fruit", and to ensure that students stay absolutely ignorant of firearms safety and facts. They're wrong - and unfortunately for our children, they're likely to be "dead" wrong.
What might a 13 year old be doing with a firearm? He might be target shooting with his parents. He might encounter a firearm at a friend or relative's home. A classmate or friend might bring one to school, or a park, or a mall. He might even need to defend himself against an armed intruder at home or even at school. Knowledge of firearms will increase the student's chances of survival should the unthinkable occur.
Apparently political correctness and the socialist agenda of the all-powerful UEA are more important than the lives and safety of our children. Apparently it's better for children to die than to learn that gun use can be safe - and fun!
Obviously the best solution is to teach your children safe firearms use and handling yourself. But not all parents have the skills to do this; many don't know these lifesaving skills themselves. While it's not government's job to teach our children firearms safety, it should at least not stand in the way of responsible parents and law enforcement officers who choose to do so.
The following letter was sent to the Deseret News:
I commend the law enforcement officers and students who participate in the "Shoot, Don't Shoot" program, and urge Davis County officials to continue the program. While I'm unfamiliar with the specifics of the program, the concept is sound.
Given the current hysteria about guns and school shootings, and the prominent role firearms play in TV, movies and video games, it is understandable that our young people are fascinated by firearms, all the more so when misguided adults turn firearms into "forbidden fruit".
While firearms related deaths have declined dramatically in recent years, this fascination can lead youths to handle firearms without proper training and adult supervision. This, in turn, can lead to tragic accidents.
Law enforcement officers are able to teach students about the safe handling of firearms, and the dangers of carelessness and misuse. And they are in a unique position to educate students about the awesome responsibility involved in the decision to use potentially lethal force to stop a crime.
A Department of Justice study shows that juveniles who are taught about firearms by a responsible adult have a 0% incidence of violent criminal behavior. Rather than a "public health menace", such instruction appears to "immunize" young people against firearms misuse.
Our students learn many adult skills in school to prepare them for the responsibilities of adulthood, skills such as parenting, financial management, and voting. Why not responsible firearms handling and decision making?
Officer Christensen is correct. Perhaps the most important lesson we can teach our children is that "they... are responsible for their actions".
Sarah Thompson, M.D.
Executive Director, Utah Gun Owners Alliance
Sandy, UT
Please write to the Deseret News (I expect it will hit other papers today, so check your local paper). And if you live in Davis County, please write to the Davis County Board of Education too!
UTGOA is written and distributed by, Utah Gun Owners Alliance, www.utgoa.org, and Sarah Thompson, M.D. All information contained in these alerts is the responsibility of the author, unless otherwise attributed.
Permission is granted for distribution of these alerts so long as no changes are made, UTGOA is clearly credited, and this message is left intact.
To subscribe to the UTGOA list, send a blank email to utgoa-subscribe at egroups.com or use the form on our web site, http://www.utgoa.org. For more information, see http://www.egroups.com/group/UTGOA.
Archives of the UTGOA alerts can be found at: http://www.egroups.com/messages/UTGOA
[This message has been edited by sbryce (edited August 10, 2000).]
).