Setting Gun Owners Back...

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Exit_Wound said:
Just because you have the right to act like a moron doesn't mean you should, right?
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Oh, if only I had nickle for every time I've thought that . . . .

(I'll have to wait until later to watch the video, though.)
 
Saw this video in another post. I don't see how this could do us any good. The cop had more patience than I would have. Maybe it's a good thing I am not a cop.
 
I've seen the video before. Basically a couple of guys carrying a slung AR-15, while carrying a camera, and according to the first part of the video they said "...They are going out to exercise their rights with a rifle today.....and also to find professional, respectful and constitutional officers in the state of Oregon..." It was evidently after the shooting in Aurora Colorado, since it was mentioned in the video. Evidently by the officers comments they received several calls on them walking around in/around the sidewalk on what seems to be a fairly busy road.

So, going from their words at the start of the video, the intent was interaction with law enforcement on some level. Judging from their objection to showing I.D. they evidently objected to the contact with LE they sought after it happened. Some things boggle my mind....
 
I suspect the officer (and the other officers in the background) were well aware of this stupid "demonstration" before the conversation even began. The officer's performance was truly outstanding.
 
In my opinion stunts like this do more harm than good, especially giving the police officer a hard time like that. The law enforcement officer did an awesome job of not escalating the situation into an incident.
 
So, here's my question: wouldn't we rather officers use the time and resources they have to patrol and apprehend criminals, or would we rather have them waste them dealing with this attention-craving idiocy? Nobody's being educated, and all it's doing is driving traffic to the author's YouTube page. Heck, the guy's not even carrying the rifle correctly.

In the meantime, it's throwing a scare into people for no good reason. I'm reminded of a great recent quote from alumnus Tamara: there's a difference between just carrying a gun, and carrying a gun at people.

That said, we've had more than a few of these threads lately, and I'm worried that we're just treading over the same ground yet again.
 
I really hope that the increase in these posts just means they are being brought to the surface more, and not that there are more uncouth gun owners out there! Don't mean to harp on it though...

Ugh, it's really just an etiquette issue.

Thanks for commiserating
 
I always ask - what would you do if you saw this person walk into the mall?

What would you do if you saw this permission strolling into the movie theater? Into the Starbucks and they unslung the gun.

Let's say (and based on the significant research on false alarm errors based on ethnic categories) - that the open carry AR advocate was a person of an ethnic or racial group other than caucasian. Racial discussions are problematic and usually against our rules when folks start blathering about how they don't like this or that group.

But as I pointed out in an article I wrote for Pax in Concealed Carry, there's good evidence of more 'bad' shoots in simulation depending on group.

Recall the outrage when men of color carried rifles to demonstrate their 2nd Amendment rights in CA, years ago.

I can see this kind of behavior leading to a disaster.

The abstract statement that rights are rights, doesn't mean that there won't be some bad things.
 
Glenn E. Meyer said:
I always ask - what would you do if you saw this person walk into the mall?

What would you do if you saw this permission strolling into the movie theater? Into the Starbucks and they unslung the gun.
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My first thought wouldn't be "2A champion.". Depending on circumstances, it may be "active shooter."
 
Good cop.
Two stupid kids that think they are doing the gun community a service.
Common sense tells ya that anyone walking around with a AR is going to panic some people.
I will not get up on my soap box.
 
First let me say that I would be concerned seeing guys wandering the streets with AR's. Yes, they are dummies & their effect on 2nd amendment rights I would definitely deem as negative.

But the officer's response was quite interesting. Obviously, these "flaunting AR's because of their rights" activities have had an effect on LE officers. The officer was obviously cognizant of the law (perhaps refreshed recently) & had been coached on how to handle the situation. He got the info he needed & all was good & defused. I see that as a good thing. Remember all the other videos where even the slightest police resistance by a citizen turns them into "Bad Cop"?

Sometimes I get so sick of people forcing things in my face to make a point. But indeed it is usually a point taken, either good or bad. In this case, bad in the context of RTKABA, but good in coaching the police on who works for who & why.

JIMHO...
 
My assessment :

Three morons foolishly spending valuable tax dollars and resources with one very ,almost too affable of a cop.
 
How would it have changed if a passer byer called in and reported on 911 that these indivudals were aiming a rifle at people driving by ? I bet quite a bit different.
And they do have a right to open carry as well as here in Texas But the officer arived on scence should have pulled up and asked to see gun, got gun and ran numbers to see if stolen. If he doesnt want to hand oper firearm when officer asks to see it, suffer consequences. Same as a officer telling someone to pull over. Best thing to do is submit. Or suffer consequences.... stupid guys like this do more harm than good.
 
This is where I struggle with open carry... It would still be legal in some places if they were loaded, chambered and has a Tac vest full of ammo, right?

Now, where can they go? If they go in anywhere, they can be legally asked to leave.

This is where it gets sticky. If they are walking around patrol rifle style(horizontal), are they still legal.

Depending on their actions....do they have the same right to yell and scream as we all do? I can see them drawing fire from LEO or CCW.

That's why I don't like it.

If you, I, we want to carry the 45 Colt on the hip hiking, walking in the park, back to the Walmart, I'm totally thrilled with that. Carrying my AR, spare mags, one in the pipe, like I'm going for coffee in Kabul...is a no go for me. Somehow that has moved from defensive to offensive IMNSHO..

The the whole ID thing...urrrgh. I as much as the next guy don't want to play the where are you going, where have you been, any weapons, any drugs, have you ever done something illegal conversation, but I show them my ID, because frankly it is the state's id.....they just let me hold it so I can show it and move on...lessening my detainment. I would always decline a search, I instruct my kids to do the same. I would always say no to any other check. Good thing I've never been stopped for DUI check.

My point is, there is a line. I can't define it other than for myself. These guys are over my personal line.
 
^^^ I agree. It's a common request around here though. It seems to me a common thing with police and guns all over.

But on topic, I thought the cop kept his cool rather well. Again, not what I would expect of the police around here.
 
I open carry, not as frequently as I use to, due to cold weather and becoming a homebody for the winter.

That being said: I always provide identification for the police officers when asked. (I usually will not consent to a vehicle search.) After I have made the officer feel safe, we can talk about my constitutional rights and such.

I guess I am lucky, I live in rural Missouri and have contact with the sheriff and deputies both officially and un-officially. One of them walked down to the range at my house and asked what we were shooting. He called in to dispatch for his "Break" and proceeded to spend it with us, shooting.

Maybe it is the mindset of some people that all cops are bad and nothing good can ever come of the encounter. Peer pressure and the "No Snitch" thing is really prevalent in our cities and among some of our wanna be gangsters.

My mindset is that most police officers are decent people and do a crappy job with little to no respect. They have to follow policies they may or may not agree with and they are not lawyers. Why should I put them in a situation where neither one of us is going to come out ahead?

We have some current police officers on this forum and I am curious how you guys see people like this.
 
They have to follow policies they may or may not agree with and they are not lawyers.
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Some of them *do* know that the policy of blurring the lines between a detainment and a consentual conversation should get them in trouble but sometimes might not get them in trouble.
 
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