security systems

H

hkg3

New member
How many of you have security systems in your houses? My wife and I just met with a security consultant last night. We’re going to have a system installed in two weeks. No fees for installation, except for the upgrades we wanted (super LOUD alarm and a few extra windows secured) only $30.00 a month.

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Gun control started the Revolutionary War!..."itcta alea est"
 
hk, Good idea,I've thought about it several times and I used to be in the business. Whose system did you get? Did you go with fire also? Good luck on your purchase it sure won't hurt ;)

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We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
The company's name is Millennium Security Services, they're nation wide. They will also setup a new systen for free when we move, even to another state (don't need anything else holding us down in the Great State of Kalifornia). Fire is offered, but we didn't get that...yet.

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Gun control started the Revolutionary War!..."itcta alea est"
 
I have a security system. It's partitioned off seperately for the house and my gun room.
Besides the noise, it pages me with a code if any zones are violated, and if someone is in the house I can follow the path they are going on. I chose this option rather than paying the monthly monitoring fee. When my pager goes off, I can decide to call the police, fire dept etc. I am also in the business. Don't let them pull the "it costs extra to have your fire system monitored" scam. They pay the same for monitoring no matter what devices you have monitored. Once you get used to your system, you will feel lost if it ever goes down. I really like the one I have. It should get you a discount on your home insurance also.

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Good shootin to ya
Plateshooter

[This message has been edited by plateshooter (edited September 06, 2000).]
 
Yes, completely homemade. I got tips from a retired installer on what works best.

I have a sign out front from a national alarm company so that takes care of the casual intruder.

The doors and windows are not wired. Reason? Simple. Contact switches are a pain and are not as flexible to use. Every stinking room has a motion/IR detector instead. The detectors are aimed at points of possible entry and choke points inside the house. Anything bigger than a housecat will set off the alarm. If you can get into the house without setting off the motion detectors by opening a door or coming through a window, you'll have to belly crawl everywhere, and again, not move any interior doors either!

The alarm sound is a klaxon like they would use in a noisy machine shop/foundry-type environment, aimed out an attic vent. Oh, yes, the entire system is battery back-up. Use one of the power supply units from an emergency exit lighting system. Kill the power to the house and it still works just fine -- for days!

The alarm sends a signal to an auto-dialler (also battery operated) that simultaneously calls by hard-wire phone line and a cell phone connection. Cut the phone line, and the cell phone connection still goes through. I'm not going to say who gets notified. Let's just say that more than one number gets called.

Good luck getting to the alarm master controls to shut it off. It'd take you several minutes to get to even if you knew where it was! Too bad you've only got 30 seconds.

My control panel to arm the system is KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid). You know those wireless keypads for garage door openers? There you go! They work great for alarms too! One code to arm, another to disarm. Also, no wires to be cut!

Doors and windows? The three entry doors to the house are steel, with steel frames. All have 1" deadbolts. All have anti-kick plates in the stress areas. Even the garage door has a deadbolt! The sliding patio door has a deadman stick, so do the sliding windows. The doublehung windows were more of a problem, but a drill and a hardened pin took care of those as well. Drill a 1/4" hole through the one frame and into but not through the other in the corners. Now take a 1/4" steel rod and place it in the hole. Windows are now locked together. If you need a little ventilation but still want security, do the same thing in the side frames where they overlap when the window is open a couple of inches. Same pin fits here as well. You can slide the whole thing up and down to adjust if you want top or bottom or both open a crack. You can't do that when you have contact switches!

Now, people ask me if I'm paranoid or something. Waddya think? ;)

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Remember, just because you are not paranoid doesn't mean they are not out to get you!
 
Hmmm.

I'm torn about whether or not to open my mouth...

Okay. The folks here are not ignrance-is-bliss types, and I'm also sure this will not come as a shock...

I'm a LEO, and while average response times surely will vary from area to area, I gotta say that security systems are in *most* cases a psychological aid to the homeowner and a psychological deterent to the burglar. That is, if the burglar/robber REALLY wanted to get in and do some damage/grab some loot, he could probably do it and be in the next zip code before the first cop got on scene.

My agency's response times are in the double-digits...thats minutes. And thats from the time WE get the alarm...the monitoring people have probably had it for 2-3 minutes at least before passing it on to us. On a busy day a 40 minute response time is not unusual. 10 to 15 minutes is considered acceptable.

If I had the spare cash, sure I'd have a security system- it can't hurt. But with those facts in mind, I'd seriously consider other defensive options as well :(

Mike

PS and no- never caught anyone breaking in on a burglar alarm run...though I was on duty once when it happened. Suddenly EVERYONE was taking alarm runs seriously again. ;)

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"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein
 
Heh. I like Cougar's alarm.

Audibles are good. Many times I HAVE gone on alarm runs where entry was attempted and ended when the audible tripped.

Mike

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"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hkg3:
How many of you have security systems in your houses? My wife and I just met with a security consultant last night. We’re going to have a system installed in two weeks. No fees for installation, except for the upgrades we wanted (super LOUD alarm and a few extra windows secured) only $30.00 a month.
[/quote]
IMHO what you have is an "alarm system" not a "security system".

Alarms are kinda like laws, they do nothing to stop a crime...though they might do something to assist in punishing a goblin.

The only times an alarm can even in theory do you any good is if your asleep or away. If your asleep and the alarm wakes you up and you have enough physical security [ie hardened perimeter such as solid doors, secure windows, etc] to give you time to react then you can do something.
 
Prior to opening Geared-Up!com, I worked for a major Home Security company as a sales representative. I enjoyed the job, I believe in the product... and I know there are alot of 'scams' out there.

Beware of completely "wireless" systems. They are faulty, quirky and cheap. I know because I sold them and used them.

Hard wire/wireless hybrid systems work just fine. We have our windows "wireless", and guarded double. This allows us to keep the windows open 12" and still be armed.

If you invest in a system, even a "free" one, seriously consider the monitored smoke detector. It is worth the $100-$150 the alarm company charges. Obviously, it works like your battery operated smoke detector, BUT nobody hears that one while you are out. I invested in the unit after I watched my neighbors house burn down. They were home... and frantically trying to get all their stuff out. The wife was standing outside with the cell phone and couldn't "unfreeze" enough to dial the FD. We had to call for her, and by the time the FD got the call, and go to the house (about 1.5 minutes after we called)... the house was gone.

If anybody has any questions on what to avoid (IE: must have's that sales people talk you into), feel free to e-mail me.

I do agree that the major benefit to a home security system is psychological, statistics show that if the burglar has a choice between a house with a system, and a house without... they'll chose the house without. Between the alarm, and the dogs, I sleep better at night.

Also, the sign in front of your house helps, but signs are stolen all the time. An "educated" intruder knows that signs + window stickers = a MONITORED alarm. One additional point... an INDOOR siren is much more effective than an external. The external ones do nothing but annoy the neighbors (who almost always ignore them). The internal ones really annoy the intruder, and increase his/her panic level.

Hope this helps.

Geri Weaver
Geared-Up!com
www.geared-up.com
Don't Forget the Dash!
Tactical & Outdoor Gear for Less
 
Geared Up! I advise friends and such [when they ask for my help] that the stickers and such for simulated alarm system with perimeter hardening, and motion sensor lights to cover approaches. Plus possibly making widows and other likely entry points seem more exposed will do more than most alarm systems would [alarm system alone that is]. Does that seem off base?

I do think that fire/smoke/CO detectors are very worthwhile. And that if people are going to the expense of a alarm system for the house they should have smoke detectors in the garage, furnace area, and kitchen. In addition to the normal sleeping area.

Also in my experiance working security fire departments have MUCH faster response time than cops. I would think most goblins would take off at the sound of sirens approaching wihtout waiting to see if it was LEO.
 
Glamdring:

It is a security system. The $30.00 a month is a monitoring fee. If the alarm is tripped, the 150db klaxon type alarm sounds and the police are called.
 
Glamdring:

Yes, that makes absolute sense. When I was a consultant, I spent a great deal of time walking around the outside of the customer's house and showing them where the weak points were.

"Privacy" fences are also good for intruder privacy. Easy access windows and "obvious" children's rooms are another great entry. I advised cusotmers to make it impossible to distinguish between parents & childrens rooms to the outside world (superman curtains are a dead giveaway).

For any of you who invite a security sales rep into your home: if they don't walk around your entire house, inside and out... show them the door. They are there to sell, not to protect. As a sales rep, I had a 100% ratio. I took the time to educate the customer on what they could do regardless of installing "my" security system. By the time I got to the "the system and installation are free, and you pay for only monitoring and any upgrades you may feel you need" they were running for their checkbook.

Then again, I can't sell a product I don't believe in. I'm just not a good actress.

Geri Weaver
Geared-Up!com
www.geared-up.com
Don't Forget the Dash!
Tactical & Outdoor Gear for Less
 
Just a thought but anything wireless has to broadcast a signal. Any signal that is broadcast can be intercepted and usually with greater ease than tapping into a hard line.

If your wireless keypads are transmitting an arm/disarm command, then you need to consider exactly how far they are transmitting the command.

The bonus is that the number of people who have both the technical ability to make use of intercepted signals AND the desire to abuse that ability is pretty low - especially when compared to the risk/reward of the average home.
 
How do people feel about the X10-based devices that are available? With this system it seems possible to put sensors and response systems in place with any level of security you see fit.

I currently have a perimeter system set up so that I know if anyone even comes NEAR one of my doors. If nothing else, it's funny when I answer the door BEFORE my guests even get there.

I'm thinking of adding units to it: auto-dialer, video cameras (perhaps even connected to the 'Net), driveway sensors, battery backup.

There are plenty of places online that offer products including: www.x10.com (great to deal with. many people who man the lines have done security system installations) www.smarthome.com (lousy customer service)
 
A general rule of thumb, anything that makes your house difficult or impossible to even approach without detection is the best security you can have. My dogs serve that purpose in a bunch of ways, but:
- Lights that come on when somebody approaches
- Video camera in clear view
- Signs that indicate "you are being watched"
- "Noisy" gravel on your walkway and under windows
- "Difficult" (prickly, painful, noisey) bushes under your windows
- All entries in clear view of the neighbors

all of these things deter. Also, if any of y'all have an electric garage door opener AND have the manual override inside the garage (chain with a handle on the end within several feet of the door), it is advisable to REMOVE the handle from the chain/rope. Reason: If you press on the very top of 'most' garage doors, you can create a gap enough to reach in with a device (coat hanger, and the like) that can snatch the handle and open the door. There have been burglaries that start with a van/truck backing into a driveway (after watching the owners leave) and standing on the bumper (nobody can see) grabbing manual override, raising the door, backing in, closing the door, and taking their sweet time cleaning house.

Even worse than that was a electric garage door customer who was surprised by an intruder who was waiting for her. This was an elderly lady who was severely beaten and raped. We designed a system with a motion detector, etc, in the garage, and a garage door senser. I've even armed outdoor hot tub houses (because of teens in the neighborhood who would use it late at night).

On another note, I once had a customer who wanted to arm his upstairs windows and bedroom doors. Completely unusual and pretty unnessary... he explained that more than he wanted to keep somebody from breaking in, he wanted to keep his teenagers from getting out!


I enjoyed that job.

Geri Weaver
Geared-Up!com
www.geared-up.com
Don't Forget the Dash!
Tactical & Outdoor Gear for Less
 
G3 you dont need no alarm system just a pit trap in the hallway with sound proof walls. For fire just have auto sprinklers and a halon system installed, we all know if you can afford that hk you're rich :)
 
Start with a good front door that the home invaders will have a small amount of trouble breaking down with their 25auto. :D
http://www.overly.com/doorco/products/bls/bls-high-range.html

deadly.GIF
 
I move too often and have to rent so I never had the option of an alarm system.
However, I really think the money would be better spent on improving the security of your house and on local alarms (motion detectors).
The fire option would be good. However, all I really want from a system is for it to alert me if I'm home so I can defend myself.
If I'm not there then niether system will make a difference they will smash and grab anyway.


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He who dares wins.
NRA Life Memeber
 
Ohen, that's the same thing that I wanted for right now. I have a wireless motion sensor system set up. No wiring, and I can take it on vacation if I want.

Check those two links that I posted above... then hide the credit card.
 
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