savage 110 338 lapua meets the terminator

stagpanther

New member
Although I buy lots of firearms and build lots of AR's I make a point of generally never spending over a thousand dollars for anything--be it the rifle, or optics to outfit it.

However, I've been so impressed with my recent savage 110 in 338 lapua I decided to blow the biggest wad I ever have on anything thing--in fact 3 times as much as I have ever spent on any optic (including a nightforce I have). Here is the infamous IOR Valdada terminator that I fell for hook line and sinker.

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After reading many times that Schott glass (not to be confused with liquor receptacles of the same name though shares a characteristic or two with them) is the ultimate glass known to the shooting world--I had to have one.


I'm not an experienced long range shooter--so I may simply not know how to properly use it yet (but at over 3K paid I intend to find out)--but here are my first impressions. Built like a tank--yes (weighs over 3 lbs I think). turrets are nice, big and easy to use--yes. tracking--don't know yet--but I sure hope it does well.

Now about that 40mm tube and the extreme range of magnification. Even on the tiborsaurus's and other glowing reviews I found online, the users mentioned they rarely saw a need to use any magnification level beyond 30 or 32 x without really elaborating why. I can't say for sure what their reasoning is--but in my case I would say once you dial up into the over 32x stratosphere it becomes almost impossible to keep the center point of the reticle still--at least I couldn't do it. Some people are under the impression the large diameter tube and objective enhances the light transmission capability--it does not--and the target picture will noticeably dim in light conditions such as early morning or later afternoon--noticeably more so than any other scope I've used; though to be fair up until the maximum magnification scope I've ever used is 24x. The battery housing and controls for illuminating the center reddot seems huge compared to the one and only component it actually illuminates--that being the center target dot itself. I suppose there must be fancy parts used to keep the size down--which I'm guessing is something like .25 MOA.

As inconvenient as all that is--I could still live with it given how outstanding the sight picture is in bright light--except there is one damning characteristic that I just can't seem to get past--and that is once the ambient light starts dimming from the equivalent of mid-day total sunshine brightness--the rear ocular lens starts reflecting a ghost image of my eye looking into the scope--which of course confuses the sight picture. I still hold out hope that there is a simple explanation for why this is happening and is a matter of easy adjustment--if not, it goes back in the box, out the door and hopefully for a refund.


Anywho, after mounting and level checking (and installing a send-it digital level--which thankfully does work as advertised) I tested 5 cartridges of the 230 eldx loads I developed as my first go at 338 lapua hand-loads and seem to shoot fairly well.

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After 4 shots this is the group I had going and things were looking good--I was about to take the 5th shot when the giant magnified image of a turkey walked right into my sight picture and stood right in front of my target looking straight at me. He wouldn't budge--nor would all his buddies. I had to go yell at them and start throwing rocks at them to finally get them to bug out. My theory is the animals around here are aware of my hunting prowess--which is why game comes out all the time while I'm shooting.;)

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When I finally loaded the 5th cartridge and took the shot--click!--but nothing happened. try a few more times, but same results, primer wouldn't go off, a Winchester large rifle magnum primer.
 

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Sounds like an amazing scope and a sweet set up, nice shooting. I also like to keep my builds under $1k each with optics like you. I think the most I ever spent on a scope was $600ish.
 
Don’t ever look through a Hensoldt 3.5-26x56... At $7k, they are ludicrously priced but if you want the best...
I admit I simply idon't have enough experience to justify buying something beyond a "simple" Nightforce. Are you familiar with why an ocular lens would become reflective in lower light conditions? I can't seem to find any information anywhere that would explain this phenomenon.
 
Stagpanther,I've got an IOR Recon on one of my rifles and have absolutely loved it. I've never had any ocular reflection issues with mine.
Tracking has been excellent on mine out to a mile,but that's what one expects on top tier optics. I have a few other top tier optics,and the IOR doesn't give up anything to them.
 
Do you use lens caps?
Do they create a “cave” on the ocular lens?

I’ve never experienced a reflection in the ocular lens but it could be the coating on the lens. Get a good lens pen to clean it maybe?
 
Thanks for that guys--as far as lens caps are concerned I've just used the bikini caps that came with it. I also thought about the possibility of some kind of film adhering to the lens--I've only lightly brushed the glass with a touch of alcohol--then tried Nikon cleaning fluid but neither seems to have worked, though I haven't really rubbed it down vigorously--kinda nervous about that being something like "Tiffany" grade glass. ;)
 
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Stag, I would start with a good cleaning like with Zeiss lens cleaning wipes or similar then reproduce it and note where the light source is coming from, general direction, elevation over the scope, etc.

Then move around to see if that changes anything. If the light source is at your 6, and just above the trees when this happens for example, rotate 90 degress and see if it makes a difference. Then repeat moving to 180 degrees etc.

I'm like you and typically only spend MY money on optics in the less than $1000 category. I have looked through and used just about all the big budget brands but for my uses the best optic to my eyes, for my money, was the Burris Veracity FFP in 5-20x.

IF I had the expendable income, I would have a Hensoldt, no doubt or several. But, I don't and likely never will.

I've never experienced what you describe with any of my Leupold, Vortex, Burris, or even the cheap Barska I used when I first got into rifle and didn't know anything about optics.

My Tikka 6.5 creedmoor with the Burris on it and a target showing it's typical accurracy at 100 yards. This is with factory Hornady 140gr ammo.

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Stag, I would start with a good cleaning like with Zeiss lens cleaning wipes or similar then reproduce it and note where the light source is coming from, general direction, elevation over the scope, etc.

Then move around to see if that changes anything. If the light source is at your 6, and just above the trees when this happens for example, rotate 90 degress and see if it makes a difference. Then repeat moving to 180 degrees etc.

I'm like you and typically only spend MY money on optics in the less than $1000 category. I have looked through and used just about all the big budget brands but for my uses the best optic to my eyes, for my money, was the Burris Veracity FFP in 5-20x.

IF I had the expendable income, I would have a Hensoldt, no doubt or several. But, I don't and likely never will.

I've never experienced what you describe with any of my Leupold, Vortex, Burris, or even the cheap Barska I used when I first got into rifle and didn't know anything about optics.
I also posted at the sniper's hide looking for some help--I was asked if the reflection happens across all magnifications--which it does, as well as all focus and parallax settings. it also happens regardless of what angle I look at the ocular. The suggestion was made that the AR coating may not have been applied--could be. I finally decided to send it back to midway--it's not the end of the world having to put the Nightforce SHV back on that I had been using.;) I'll take close look at the Burris XTR 3 when it comes out.
 
I have the Nighforce 32X max. That seems to be plenty out to 800 -1000 yards.

Remember, the closer the target the worse it is so the high mag is for way out.

I think at 100 I run mine about 20 x.

It also has issues in dimmer and not bright cloudy light. I can manage, but the dot (also did the dot) fades around and quite variable until light settles to a steady brightness. I do like it.

Oddly, my favorite is a Cabella Alaska 3-24 I got for $150 I think it was. Its a great scope out to 300 yards. Line is not too thin and it has the elevation hatches.

Good light gathering.
 
Jeez these pics are huge.. How do I resize them?

Photo editor might.

Another way is to stash it on the computer, then use the send it to someone in EMAIAL. That will pop up with a screen to set the pixel size. That shrinks it down to the upload editor size.

Or you can change you camera setting down to 800 x 640 (guess) and it will be smaller.
 
The terminator is on it's way back to midway--it was terminated, so to speak. I will do more research for a replacement. In the meantime, I'll start some loads for 300 gr hybrids, which has interesting dimensions--here's one along side a 5.56 penetrator.

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Looks long and slippery for sure!
Sorry the IOR did t work out.
While I love my Burris and endorse it regularly, have you looked at
Elcan
Kahles
Leica
Leupold (some great glass and warranty here)
Schmidt & Bender
Steiner
Swarovski
Tangent Theta
US Optics
Vortex (razor hd line)
Zeiss
 
I have been studying up and looked at many on that list--I've narrowed down my performance parameters to 32x max mag and 1/8th MOA with a minimum of 60 MOA elevation turret--preferably more.
 
To increase your choices, if you don’t have one already, you may look into getting a 20moa canted scope base for your rifle. That will give you an extra 20moa of UP adjustment for longer range shooting. So a scope with only 40moa of adjustment will then have 60moa.
 
To increase your choices, if you don’t have one already, you may look into getting a 20moa canted scope base for your rifle. That will give you an extra 20moa of UP adjustment for longer range shooting. So a scope with only 40moa of adjustment will then have 60moa.
20 MOA cant rail comes standard with the savage 338 LM rifle. Although I don't need it now--the 338 LM can use more than 100 MOA to reach out to the distances it's capable of from what I've read.
 
The Nightforce SHV will do plenty fine for any range I'm likely to find in the east. I did a quick zero with 6 cartridges yesterday after taking the terminator off and putting the SHV back on--would have made a dandy group if I didn't pull the 2 fliers.:D

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