S&W 61 Escort / Sterling .22

S

simonrichter

New member
does anybody know whether there is a current production clone / offspring of one of these two guns respectively? (or any similar model)

im still looking for a (recently introduced) .22lr in the range of about 4.5" OAL, but all I found so far are older models out of the 60ies, 70ies and 80ies... Which is a bit curious, given that on the other hand there are 9mm on themarket that are as small as some 5+" OAL...
 
Sterling went out of business a long time ago. They were local where I live and work.

I had a stainless 22. It usually went bang, but if it misfired, it was a bitch to get the cartridge out because it was peened in.

David
 
Aside from the Taurus 22PLY, the next closest thing is the Beretta 21A Bobcat, although I've heard tell that the gun has been basically unavailable from distributors for a while now (which is a recurring issue with small-caliber Berettas).

Is a DA trigger and/or tip-up barrel a problem?
 
I have the 21a. Its a nice little gun. The tip up barrel means you do not have to rack the slide. My only objection is there is no extractor. In case of a misfire, its hard to get the loaded round out of the chamber. Its sort of peened in from the firing pin hit. Single action, double action, you can carry it loaded hammer down safety on or off. You could carry it "cocked and locked", but I would not.

As long as the ammo is good, no problems with the little beretta.

I also have a tomcat, same except in 32 auto. Same tip up barrel, no extractor.

David
 
I can think of a handful of used-gun options.

The S&W Models 2213 and 2214 are basically slightly-enlarged and updated versions of the Model 61, and the ones I've seen were very nicely built; however, they may be larger than what you're after, they're quite uncommon, and they're coveted by S&W collectors, which has driven resale prices pretty high. There's also a level of demand driven by the fact that the 422/622/22xx family is more easily adapted to suppressor use than almost any other older .22 pistol.

The .22LR Walther TPH is smaller than these guns, and likewise well-made, but the other issues are the same (rarity, collectibility, high price).

The Iver Johnson TP22 is a somewhat cheapened TPH clone, and they have a good reputation for functioning well if you get one that's not already broken, but they have a not-so-good reputation for so-so durability.

I believe that FIE offered a .22LR version of the Titan, but the .25's I've examined exhibited less-than-exemplary quality control, and I've not heard much good about them generally.
 
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We have at least one member here who has one and likes it.
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That would be Aarongraham. He will be along before you know to talk about his Taurus. He seems to really like it. He speaks so well of I would like to get one myself.

I had an Escort. It only had a 5 round mag. It was ok but I sold it and don't miss it. I had a sterling also. Wasn't much of a gun either.

The TP-22 is an excellent little gun. I had one years ago and it always worked and was surprisingly accurate. I missed it and bought another one a few months ago. I probably paid too much. It came in the box and had an extra mag with it.

The only problem with them is people who don't read the owners manual. If you take it apart you have to REMOVE the magazine first. The trigger guard pivots down to remove the slide. Part of the trigger guard pivots into the mag well. If the mag is in place you put a huge strain on the small pivot pin area on the frame and you can break this part. A new frame is the only way to repair it. But if you can read and follow instructions you shouldn't have any problems.

If you are looking for tiny also check out the beretta 950BS. Excellent little pocket guns that hold 9 rounds of 25 acp.
 
If recall correctly, the Taurus was originally a copy of the Beretta. I have one of the Taurus ones. Mine has never malfunctioned, but I have never found much use for it. I got a great deal on it LNIB and thought my daughter would enjoy shooting it. I was wrong: "Your Buckmark is good and Grandpa's Ruger is good, but this little thing has dinky sights and I can't hit anything with it and it sucks." So much for that.

I guess it would be good to carry around in your shirt pocket on a farm to plink or shoot rats with or something. I can shoot it okay. But I don't have rats or a farm, so it is pretty much a safe queen for now.
 
The S&W Escort is OK and mine has always worked with no problems. They took a hit when government contract testing to "prove" that cheap guns like the RG-10 were unreliable and blew up. To balance the tests, Escorts were included to show how well "quality" guns worked.

But best laid plans and all that... The cheap German guns digested dozens of proof loads with no problems, while the S&W's had blown off sideplates, bulged frames and broken breech blocks. The results were not really a reflection on S&W - few small auto pistols will stand up to repeated firing of proof loads.

But the damage was done, and the popularity of the Escort took a dive. IIRC, production continued for some years, but it eventually was discontinued.

P.S. If you have an Escort, and are tempted to detail strip it, I strongly suggest you resist temptation; it is a (rhymes with "stitch") to reassemble correctly.

Jim
 
The .22LR Walther TPH is smaller than these guns, and likewise well-made, but the other issues are the same (rarity, collectibility, high price).
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The TPH doesn't have the best reliability record. I have had three in the last 20 years (two stainless and one German alloy) and feeding reliability was about 85%.
 
Is this Taurus 22PLY close enough? We have at least one member here who has one and likes it
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add one, namely me myself :D The thing with the PT22PLY is that it is far from "as small as a pocket 22lr semiauto can be", compared to the models mentioned in this thread. It has a relatively bulky grip, which is a disadvantage in terms of size yet, ideed, a likewise advantage in terms of usability, since the grip feels nearly like a full size. AND, it is nearly 5" long, which is considerably more than said models.
I don't say I would trade it for one of those smaller, but outdated ones, I'm just curious whether there are any 22lr semiautos which are modernized AND sizewise optimized on the market...
 
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Fair enough Simon, lol. I thought the grip could pose an issue as it does look large, but figured the OAL being .3" longer then suggested would still put it close. But hey, you know more about it then I do anyway, you own one!
 
yes, the bulky grip of the Beretta / Taurus IS an issue when it comes to real deep concealability. It comes from the recoild spring being located not beneath or around the barrel, but rather in the grip, which is in turn necessary for the tip-up-barrel design.
 
I agree with Bill .My Beretta 950 and model 20 DA/SA both 25acp smaller and thinner than that Taurus . Much better pistols also. Even the 21 A has thinner grips
 
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