Riots - What to do?

C

CSOs ROCK

New member
Okay, got another one for you all...

Suppose that during one of these rolling black outs that we Californians have to look out for, you are protecting your business. Obviously at this point, law enforcement will not be able to respond quickly (if at all). Not to offend anyone but I've lost a little faith in the LAPD. I myself am not one of those anti-establishment, stock up guns like crazy and wait for nuclear holocaust types, in fact I am currently in the hiring process with a non-LA agency.

Getting back to the point. Let's say that during one of these blackouts a riot does indeed spark. You are bunkered down in your business and a group of opportunistic SOBs run through your door. Do you shoot first? Or do you give a warning?

Please keep in mind the legal action that may incur after the fact (after all, this IS LA). Law enforcement officers and anyone making a career in the judicial system PLEASE reply.

I just want to know what my options are if I decide to go to LA and help out my dad.
Thanks guys and gals.
 
Hey buddy ol' pal,

As far as I know, you can't shoot someone for stealing from you. You're asking for jail time if you do. Only time you can shoot is when they're attacking you or someone else. In short, if the doo-doo hits the fan, draw down on them and warn them. That should be enough to deter the average sane individual. If they come at you, shoot. If they just take your stuff, you're SOL.
 
I'd warn before I'd shoot. Unless it's clear that the trespassers intend to do you bodily harm, it helps to justify the "fear" for your safety and safety of others.
 
"It's better to be judged by twelve than carried by six."

(By the way, most of southern Cal, including LA and Dago, aren't slated for the blackouts, per newspaper articles. PG&E and CalEd service areas are.)

Anyway, whether you warn or not, claim you did. And your father will back you up. Well, won't he?

"He had a pistol!"
"Sir, we didn't find any pistol."
"Well, it looked like he did; he had *something" and acted like it was a gun--and I was scared for my LIFE!"
And nothing else without your lawyer. Nothing.

Art
 
What I absorbed from the last riots...

There was a famous picture of a Korean (?) standing in front of his business holding a shotgun. Nobody bugged him. I don't hink he did anything illegal, just holding a legal weapon in plain view. If he did, he got away with it. Nobody looted his place.

I would make my armament as visible as possible for deterrent value. If things get worse from there, its what Art said. Likely there would be many of them, one of you, and fear for your life would be genuine.
 
DaveR
That's actually a good point, I hadn't thought of just making the threat an obvious one.

Do you think maybe the show of force might encourage one though? Somebody attempting to snipe you, maybe?
 
Frankly,

Most of these "rioters" aren't hard core. They are just punks that want a free pair of Nike's. Show a bit of force and theywill go away.

During the Wrodney King thing, most of the looters wern't even black.
 
To add to my earlier post, my thoughts are:

1) Make the other guy's place (or the other guy) a better target than your place (or you). A show of force does that.

2) You want to stay legal where possible.

3) Riot participants are generally opportunists. They're looking for the quick fix. They're not out to get you.
 
Why do you need to be at your place of business ?

Why do your doors need to be open ?

If you are selling/providing an essential service and feel a need (busines or moral) need to be open for business, how about a piece of plywood over your window, or propped against the building that says in large spray painted letters - "looters will be shot" ?
 
During the last LA riots, stores that were closed were looted just as badly as those that were open. If anything more so because of the lack of protection.
 
Good point raised by RazorsEdge about the looters not being predominantly black. At least in San Francisco you could have called it a "rainbow coalition" as they were everything under the sun.
 
While good can be replaced and lives can't, for many store owners who suffered during the riots, their stores represented their whole livelihoods. Keep in mind that it makes perfectly good sense to stay away and be safe, but these store owners realized that as quickly as the riots came and went, so too could their livelihoods. They only had to hold out for a short time, a matter of a few days. In some cases, the stores represented their life's work and all their value and income. In some cases, store owners were living in apartments above or in the back of the stores they were protecting, so in essence, they were not just protecting stores, but their homes. Losing everything makes it hard to replace what is lost, especially when insurance usually specifies that riots and acts of war are not included in the coverage. Of course, to even try to replace good, one must be alive.

I find it ironic that so many people on this list claim that they are willing to die to keep their guns, yet also say that material goods can be replaced. What one values as being important often differs from those suffering at the hands of others and those watching it on TV.
 
Uh... I see that there are still some myths floating around about the LA riots. Here are some facts:

First of all, the "famous" picture notwithstanding, many (estimates vary from 1,000 to 10,000) Korean-American owned businesses were looted and/or burned, in most cases, by African-American looters. At some of the stores, the Korean-American shopkeepers (sometimes an entire family of them) attempted to defend the stores with firearms, but were overpowered or forced to retreat and abandon the premises. Only a handful of Korean-American owned businesses successfully repelled looters and prevented harm to their businesses.

Secondly, we have no firm idea on what ethnic group, if any, constituted the majority of the looters (there are some estimates, which are educated guesses at best). Among those who were ARRESTED by police for looting and related offenses, African-Americans did NOT constitute a majority (they did account for a significant plurality of the total, however). African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans together constituted a great majority among those who were arrested.

No one has a reliable figure on how many (among those who were arrested AND those who avoided arrest) were violent looters and arsonists as opposed to less-violent, opportunistic looters/hanger-ons. One of the main reasons for the lack of a reliable figure is that there was virtually no police presence in many areas during the most violent period of the riots. Police only began arresting "looters" in any serious numbers when order was more-or-less restored, not during the most violent period.

We can, however, say with a certainty that the initial riots were instigated among predominantly African-American population of the affected areas. Likewise, we also know for a fact that Korean-Americans and Korean-American owned businesses were major targets for African-American looters.

I don't list these things to make judgements, but to provide some real facts, rather than myths and hearsays that have plagued the debate on the riots.

Now, having said that, I will say that IF it were up to me, I would NOT risk my life (or that of any of my family member) to defend a store from a large group of looters. It just isn't "a hill I am willing to die on." It would be a different story if it were my home OR if I could organize other shopkeepers with me.

Now, let the arrows fly (at me)!

Skorzeny
 
Greetings everyone! I'm an avid member or Glocktalk and noticed the URL for this site. I am glad I checked it out. As far as rioting goes my personal opinion is if the police are unavailable to protect you and your property as in a state of "martial law" you have an obligation to yourself and your family to protect your well being. In PA one may use deadly force to stop an intrusion into someone's home or place of business. I would let them enter and make swiss cheese out of them quickly, making extra sure they were found inside my home or establishment. Then call the police and at their leisure let them come pick up the bodies. Also one must understand that rioting can not occur with only one person. If large groups of individuals are swarming onto your property then you can only sumise in fear for your life that they are there to do you bodily harm. Theres quite a disparity of force counting them against just you.
The bottom line is you do what is reasonable to survive!

Peace!

G-man
 
Hey, Karsten, come on and tell us how you REALLY feel! :D

I love Nevada. You can use lethal force to stop ANY felony in progress. And B and E is definitely a felony....

Considering the doors to the home/business/whatever would be locked, they'd have to break it down (or smash a window) to get in. If that happens, they are fair game.

Exactly the way it should be....
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top