Right to carry on company property in FLA.

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StarfuryZeta

New member
I work in the great state of Florida. As a part of the company handbook, it states that any weapon can not be brought onto company property. Property is defined specifically as the building, grounds, parking areas, company vehicles, and employee vehicles.

I noticed the lawsuit dealing with the AOL guys getting spotted with weapons on company property. Florida statutes dealing with concealed carry define illegal places to carry as:

any place of nuisance as defined in s. 823.05
any police, sheriff, or highway patrol station
any detention facility, prison, or jail; any courthouse
any courtroom*
any polling place
any meeting of the governing body of a county, public school district, municipality, or special district
any meeting of the Legislature or a committee thereof
any school, college, or professional athletic event not related to firearms
any school administration building
any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption*
any elementary or secondary school facility
any area technical center
any college or university facility*
inside the passenger terminal and sterile area of any airport*
any place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law

Okay, work may be a nuisance, but not as defined by law. =)

So, does anyone know what my right to carry (in my vehicle) with a concealed carry permit is in regards to work and their policies? If I get challenged, would I have any legal recourse?

Thanks!
 
I asked this question of my HR Director. Our company has a policy that forbids carrying "weapons" on company property or in company vehicles. "Weapon" is left up to the interpretation of management; a gun would certainly qualify but there is no clear line on knives, for instance, how big they can be and so on. Many employees, including myself, carry some sort of cutting tool (not a weapon -- I use a liner-lock folder for opening boxes :) ).

The way it shakes out is that carrying such weapons may not be illegal, but it can be (and at my company, is) a firing offense. You won't go to jail for having your permitted CCW at work, but you might go to the unemployment line. The company has the right to make and enforce such a policy, so long as it is applied equally to all. This is an "employment at will" state, which means they can let you go for any reason that does not violate specific employment protections like Title VII.

Yeah, it bites, but there it is.
 
Agreed

Lots of what you might consider your "constitutional rights" do not apply at work. Speech for example. Harrassment laws have morphed from real outright discrimination or unwanted advances, to simple talk, even overheard conversations. I know of someone who was fired for saying he was glad GWB would get all the "f@gs" out of the government. What he said was dumb, racist, rude, and indefensible. I wouldn't have said it nor do I defend his actions. In addition though, to the moral problem of saying something like that at work, the job said it created a hostile environment for the homosexual who overheard it.

My point is, anything that might make someone uncomfortable or threatened, whether that be your religious, sexual, or racial, or 2nd Amendment views might be fair game for the PC police.
 
Alas, that is what I was afraid of. Its a pain to have to run back to the house to pick up my stuff to go to the range when its closer to work. *sigh*

Thanks for the replies.
 
" . . . company property. Property is defined specifically as the building, grounds, parking areas, company vehicles, and employee vehicles."

Great. So your car, which has title and insurance under your name, is considered company property? Are you also considered 'company property?' Sounds like fodder for a Dilbert cartoon . . .

--Denise
--------

Train your children right: homeschool!!
 
I ignore the "company policy". They don't assign me a guard so therefore, they have no interest in me. As for my car, you can fight that in court. If your car is "company property" while it's in the lot, then anything that happens to it, on the property, has to be covered by their insurance policy. I have to look out for number one, and that is me, myself. The "company" won't pay my bills (extended) if I get killed or mugged on their property. Their insurance will only pay a small amount (to get the relatives off their backs). I'm sorry to say, but just because I'm forced to work to pay taxes and support others (welfare), this doesn't give any one or anything control over my life. If they fire me, then so be it. When your killed on their property, they have great lawyers that will screw your family out of any settlement or lawsuit. They may "give" a couple of thousand and act as if they are "sorry" in court but they really don't care about you. You are there for one reason and one reason only, to gain profits for the board/CEO. Nothing else, nothing more. For every employee shot or killed, there are hundreds more out there waiting for your job; and they know it. It's up to you to decide. The anti's want "pocket rockets"; easy concealed weapons; to be banned. But this gives you the advantage between life and death. Sure, not every person will "go off the deep end" and go on a shooting spree, but because we are human and have a mind of our own, you never know. Does the "company" really care about you.. not in the least. They have their guards, and the mindset that they can own a gun for protection but their "lowly" employees may not. They make sure they can survive, and still make millions, and they know that "giving" a few thousand (or hundred thousand) will shut up the "opposing" forces. They don't care, they will just carry the cost to the customers, which will gladly pay for the product. There is a big difference between a "local" fighting for the last $30 dollars in his/her wallet and a "company" settling for a few thousand. The company can write this lost off on their tax returns, while the "local" is out his/her money which will never be returned. They can afford insurance and give away large sums, while the local cannot do so. Under federal law, they get their money back... but we can't.

USP45usp
 
I ignore that rule daily. Heck, I would use it to protect the boss not kill him.
Now the rent-a-cop that is armed, there is a good reason to be armed yourself. :D

Mikey
 
A quite large company close to me contracts with a security company. My frequent visits afford me to see the security company's vehicles: The usual SUV with yellow lights atop and some official sounding name on the doors.

Knowing these guards to be unarmerd, I always wonder what it's all about. Should a "Massachusets Mucko" show up, these good folks in the SUV's would be no more effective in halting Mucko than the janitor, who is "armed" with no more than they are: a cell phone.

The folks in the black SUV's are good people. Nothing against them at all. But really...what's the point if they have absolutely no more ability to stop Mucko than the receptionist?

I liken it to when I fly. I've always wanted to inquire of the "Flight Attendent": Can you pilot this plane? When the reply is "well, no", I'd have to say, then you are a waitress/waiter.

Regards
 
I was not going to mention the option of ignoring company policy, because I AM NOT A LAWYER AND THIS IS NOT TO BE TAKEN AS LEGAL ADVICE. If you choose to ignore you do it at your own risk. You have to decide how likely it is that the company will search your car, locker, desk, whatever. Companies don't like to do this because they can get into privacy and harassment issues, but I have seen it done when something has been stolen on premises. Some companies will also walk drug-sniffing dogs through their parking lots.

You also have to decide how they will interpret what they find. A hunting rifle, locked in a car trunk with the bolt out and a trigger lock, will be seen as less threatening than a loaded handgun under your shop coat or suit jacket. If you are found to have a weapon on premises, you may still have a chance of convincing management that you had no evil intent. Don't count on it though. "Zero tolerance" (the buzzword for "we're too stupid to consider circumstances so we just shaft everybody") is known to exist in company policies.
 
StarfuryZeta, if you are just concerned with range gear, just leave it in your trunk and DON'T transfer it to another vehicle on the company property. That is what happened at AOL. By the way, you might consider not driving your vehicle onto company property since vehicles have been shown to be weapons. Okay, that is a little far fetched. If you do carry on the company property, remember that you do so knowing you may lose your job, but feel safer. Be VERY DISCRETE. I would also avoid talking to fellow employees about guns, going to the range, etc. just to make sure you don't tip your hand. Remember that concealed carry is just that, concealed. Not only should it be concealed, but confidential as well.
 
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