Rifle caliber for a new hunter

H

HAMMER1DOWN

New member
Hi everyone.......
I have a friend that is getting into hunting and she is looking for a caliber that'll take down an elk easily up to 500+ yards that won't knock her around like a ragdoll. So I gave her some ideas like the .308, .270, 30-06, and 7mm mag which is a little on the heavier side for her but she said that she won't shoot it all the time so I just threw out the 7mm. Any input would be awesome.
Thanks again
Bones...
 
for elk at that range, u will probably need at least a 300 or 338. If the budget isnt too tight, get a browning with the boss system, and use the headsets that are noise cancelling. My 7mm (although not all) kicks pretty hard. When i use the muzzle break, it kicks like a 243.

Or try and make closer shots and use a smaller caliber
 
Let's see:
- new hunter
- wants gun capable of killing elk at 500+ yds
- doesn't want much recoil
- won't be shooting the gun much (NOT practicing to improve her beginner skills).

Does not add up to a winning combination. Suggest some discussion, education, or reality check. IMO a beginning hunter has no business even trying to shoot an elk at 500+ yds. IMO a prudent experienced hunter would pass up a 500+ yd shot also.
 
that'll take down an elk easily up to 500+ yards that won't knock her around like a ragdoll
Click to expand...
:confused:

Not sure I'd trust the energy of a non-mag at 500+ for an efficient kill for a beginner. The Remington website has a good ballistics comparison calculator you can run some hypotheticals on.

I chose the .270 140gr Core-Lokt Ultra, the .308 165gr Scirocco Bonded, and the 7mm Rem Mag 160gr Core-Lokt Ultra.

At 500 yards (the max there was data for), the .270 only retains 975 ft/#s, the .308 has 1239 ft/#s, and the 7MM Mag has 1315 ft/#s. With a 200yd zero, at 500 yards, the .270 is 46" low, the .308 49". and the 7MM Mag is 42".

If you want something with enough energy to effectively kill at those ranges, you need to be able to stand the recoil.
 
Decide how long a shot she wants to make after you see how well she can shoot from a likely hunting position. A 270 or 280 with heavier premium bullets would be my choice. I'm sure there are women who can shoot 7 MM and 300 Mags, but I doubt they started with them.
 
A 500+ yard shot on Elk..... with light recoil yet?? Ya gotta be kidding..... How 'bout a truck mounted Browning M2.
 
The ideas of the OP just don't fit reality. Beginning shooters should avoid long shots like the very plague. They lack the skill to judge the distance accurately enough to avoid a wounding shot. Once beyond even 300 yards, trajectory and wind are major factors in a clean, ethical hit.

A cartridge using a bullet of approximately 130 to 180 grains in weight, with a muzzle velocity around 2,500 to 2,800 feet per second, will work just fine on elk. In general, the recoil will definitely be noticeable but is rarely anywhere near objectionable.

The primary issue for a rifle is that it fits the user's own body dimensions, particularly the length of pull from the butt to the trigger.

Scope? Any reasonable quality, and from fixed 4X on to a variable such as a 3x9x40. Scope rings and mounts? They pretty much all work okay.

A beginning shooter benefits dramatically from lots of trigger time with a bolt-action .22 rimfire. This has been discussed at length in the Art of the Rifle forum.
 
Now, if she changes a few parameters - distance is 200 yards; she WILL be practicing - A LOT, from a variety of shooting positions - well then anything decent in 6.5 through .30 will do the job.

But a new hunter looking for 500+ yard shots who doesn't practice is bad form all around and not realistic
 
Any input would be awesome.
Click to expand...

Ok, some input and thoughts.

A new shooter and/or hunter needs to practice....a lot; even for distances a lot closer than 500 yards, she needs to practice...a lot.

If a person needs to ask on the internet, "Which cartridge is best for...at 500 yards...", they haven't shot enough ammo yet to make that kind of shot consistently and reliably. They're more likely to miss, or worse yet, wound the animal and lose it, and then get a bad feeling towards hunting in general.

Someone who can make that shot won't have to ask which cartridge to use. They'll have already shot their chosen cartridge enough to know what it's capable of, and will have already killed several animals at lesser distances to prove it to themselves.

Shooting big animals at long distances isn't a game to be combined with "low recoil". There are rifles capable of "easily killing eld at 500+ yards", but they do tend to kick. New hunters shooting rifles with heavy recoil at long distances that they haven't practiced much is a really bad combination.

But, you do have some options.

Get her a rifle capable of what she wants, and then take her out to shoot it...a lot. When she has learned to manage the recoil and can hit a 9" paper plate at 500 yards consistently and reliably, then she's ready to take shots at that range...if she can judge the distance accurately or uses a rangefinder for the purpose.

or, get her a gun she can shoot easier, and then take her out to practice...a lot. When she can consistently and reliably hit a 9" paper plate at 300 yards, then she's ready to shoot elk out to 300 yards.

Maybe start her out on coyotes. If she can hit a coyote at 300 yards, she won't have any problem hitting an elk at that range.

Daryl
 
I have shot at high power comps at 1000 meters with a .223 and for my long range hunting rifle I chose a 300 win mag. I have made shots over 400+ on deer and coyotes, I was simply asking for advice on what calibers would be more suited for a beginner who would like to be able to take shots at 500 or more yards without beating her up. I own a 7x57 and she liked that but in my experience it just drops to fast with the handloads I have for it to be trusted at 500+ yard shots. Msaybe some of you on this site have shot that distance with the mauser I just don't trust myself that far with that cartridge. That is why I bought the .300 win mag. so I didn't have to worry about the longer ranges and I have spent countless days behind the trigger and there has been so many rounds down the tubes of all my rifles.

So this post was just to get more info for myself as for my friend. There is no need to make judgements on my skill when I ask a question as on my OP.
 
For that range your going to need a pretty big caliber. So a muzzel brake will come into play if recoil is a issue. A 500 yard shot is very long, it takes alot of practice, and being very, confident in what you are doing. Not saying she cant do it or learn it more power to her if she does, but it is going to take lots, and lots of shooting, and like the prior post said a much bigger caliber is going to be needed, with a good scope.
 
If she hasn't done much shooting a 22lr is a good starting platform.

As to the original question, something will have to give. The best compromise I see is limit the range to about half the original distance and use a cartridge similar to the 6.5x55. That should be close to a MPBR of +/-3" out to at least 250 yards. For elk she might get away with a +/-4". If she can handle a little more recoil the 270 is hard to beat.
 
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