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F

FUD

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I think guns are horrible and should NOT be anywhere near children. Not only because of the danger of injury, but also because of the message it is teaching a child - that things need to be resolved by force. That's why the world is such a mess. People forget to respect each other and resolve things by talking it out.

Remember even if only one child a year gets hurt - this child could be YOURS.[/quote]According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and the National School Safety Center in 1997 (the latest year that I could find complete numbers for), 7.3 children died in motor vehicle related deaths while 0.39 children deaths were attributed to firearms. This would strongly imply that cars are even more horrible than guns since they cause more than 18 times as many deaths and our children should not be anywhere around them either.

Now, how do I comment on the other points that she makes? Any help will be appreciated.

Share what you know, learn what you don't -- FUD
fud-nra.gif
 
Here is a sight that should help you get info.www.gunsandcrime.org/
Here is one that list crime stats.www.crime.org/
Check it out


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SGTAR15

[This message has been edited by sgtar15 (edited June 14, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>...but also because of the message it is teaching a child - that things need to be resolved by force.[/quote]

I'm curious as to where this person is coming from. When she says "resolved by force," does she mean disagreements, as in gang fights? Or does she consider self defense to be an avoidable act of force?


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>People forget to respect each other and resolve things by talking it out.
[/quote]
Again, where is she coming from here? Does she mean that people should discuss disagreements instead of dueling? Or that we should try to talk attackers out of hurting us? If it's the latter, forget it. She's whacked. The human race has been violent since it began and no amount of singing happy-shiny Barney songs is going to change that.

If, on the other hand, she's rational and just concerned about her child's safety, I'd find out other stats, such as:
how many children are abducted by strangers everyday and never seen again?
How many teenage girls are raped and killed everyday?
"This child could be YOURS."
If you're there, what are you going to do to stop it?
 
Well, let me see, uh, that stupid bliss ninny woman doesn't want to see "things resolved by force," but wants the police and military to ransack every home, apt. condo, office, shack, shed, silo, boat, car, plane, building, warehouse, etc., etc., etc., etc., in America, and murder millions of us gunowning "vermin" in order to take our firearms.

In the Orwellian doublespeak of the Marxists and their brainwashed toadies, "force" is not "force", just so long as it's used to "do good things" and "save the children." Like they did in the Branch Davidian Church in Waco. J.B.
 
This is a fairly typical emotional response to guns by an overly emotional person.

Ask him/her if we can resolve everything by talking it out why are so many people in prison. Unfortunately in this world there are a great many people that have bad intentions and only understand force (look at Kosovo). As much as we would like to make the world a completely "safe place" (if anyone really knows what this means), we can't and I don't think we ever will.

People don't "forget" to talk things out. Many people are just plain unwilling to talk things out. Would words have worked in central park the other day? What are you going to say "you know assault is against the law and you could get in trouble." I am sure that would have worked on those guys in central park the other day.

I also disagree with the statement "that things need to be resolved by force". What a bunch of bull. Just because a person is prepared to defend self, family and country does not mean that they are going to resolve all issues with voilence. This is akin to saying all gun owners are goin to resolve all arguements at the point of the gun. I would argue that gun owners are some of the most peaceful and rational people in the country. Kids are smart and they should and can be taught the difference between defense and violence.

"Remember even if only one child a year gets hurt - this child could be YOURS." My child and family could also be in the estimated several hundred thousand to 3 million people that are protected by the defensive use of firearms every year. The numbers on this are not clear because many incidents are never reported.

Hope this helps.

Rusty
 
Remember, if only one child per year is saved from harm by an armed barent...wouldn't you prefer that child to be yours?
 
Thanks to everyone that responded. I've editted some of your comments to include with my own when I answered her back but maybe it's not even worth arguing facts with this woman and just let her think that she's won. See her follow-up reply: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>...What happens to us in our lives is created by the way we feel or think - that becomes part of our live's plan. If we think positive and loving thoughts, and if we are at peace within ourselves, then good things will happen. By having complete trust in God, then there is no need to fear ...[/quote]

[This message has been edited by FUD (edited June 14, 2000).]
 
FUD,

(hoo boy, this got long on me) Having guns around children does not send the message that things need to be resolved by force. Having guns around children sends instead the message that all possible means of conflict resolution may be employed and that the lowest level of force (evasion and/or verbal skills) is always the most desirable course of action. Put this question to her: If she were being carjacked, would she try to talk her way out? Of course! But if that failed then would she try to escape? If talking and evasion were to fail, would she stoop to using (gasp) force? Kicking, biting, scratching, etc to get away? I think she would do as little as possible...ie, if talking worked, no need for evasion. If evasion worked, no need for fighting. Having a gun does not teach that force is always necessary, having a gun teaches that you are willing to use as much force as is necessary. Aside from that, all children, even those without guns in their home should be taught firearms safety. All of 'em. Every single one that walks in my door gets the Eddie Eagle basics. (don't ever touch a gun, leave the area, notify an adult) This instruction alone could lower the number of firearms accidents the press love to hype. Beyond Eddie Eagle, guns should be demystified so that children do not think they are "glamorous". I started taking my kids to the range when they were way little. My boy loves shooting, my girl doesn't :( BUT they both know the firearms safety rules and guns are not some mystery to them. Any time they wanted to handle a gun, I let them. Took the gun(s) out of the closet, you might say. I made sure it was "safe" and this gave me yet another opportunity to go over the rules with them. Then they could fondle, manipulate and touch to their heart's content. They were always supervised so that I could ensure they were not breaking one of the safety rules.

My kids are both teenage drivers now. I am more terrified to give them the car keys than I ever was about having guns in the house. Why? Because despite the media hype over guns, more kids die in automobile wrecks than by guns. Plain and simple. People don't fear cars because everyone has one and/or they understand how a car operates. Most will never consider the fact that they are in control of a 2000-3000 lb (or more) missle that at almost any speed is deadly to its occupants or bystanders. You can bet mine know this fact. I have hauled them around to see the effects of wrecks. The mangled hulls of cars at junkyards can speak volumes. Is she prepared to eliminate cars from her life because if even one kid gets hurt by a car this year, it could be hers?

How about backyard swimming pools? Does she have one, or her neighbors? Sometimes I think there are more pools than there are people in FL. Is she going to get rid of all the pools because it would prevent needless drownings? The list of things could go on and on. Would she make the whole world safe so that she would never have to worry about her kid's safety? She needs to learn that you teach your kid common sense safety rules, then you keep going over those rules and pray like crazy that the kid paid attention. The best gift you can give your kids is independence; a mother is not someone to lean on, she is someone to make leaning unnecessary.

-sarah
 
Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition.
Re: the statement "...the message it is teaching a child..." - BS, inanimate objects don't teach.
I think that a child should be shown the destructive power of a gun and taught to use and respect it. Only by literally knowing the force unleashed by a gun can a child be taught the necessity to avoid using it except as an absolute last resort. The main idea being that the child must be taught right and wrong by the parents. John
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>By having complete trust in God, then there is no need to fear ...[/quote]
Then why is she a'feard o' guns fer? :confused:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>If we think positive and loving thoughts, and if we are at peace within ourselves, then good things will happen.[/quote]
Obviously, this lady has been very lucky and has lead a charmed life, and thinks it's all her own doing.


I think I was right...she's whacked.
 
Sounds like she just wants us all to sit around and sing Kumbya. Don't waiste your time arguing with her. Go to the range with your friends instead.
 
sarah, I used the swimming pool stats (drowning in pools kills four times as many kids as guns) and some other stuff that people have mentioned. That's when I got the "everything is beautiful" reply from her. I think I'm gonna head over to the gunstore and see what needs a new home.
 
I think guns are horrible and should NOT be anywhere near children.
***That is opinion. They are like *******s, everybody has one and just because it comes out of your mouth doesn't mean that that it smells any better than what comes out of other common orifices. If you have some facts about why they are horrible and kept away from children I would love to hear them. Only use information from studies with complete bibliographies or govt documents so you 'facts' can be verifed.

Not only because of the danger of injury, but also because of the message it is teaching a child - that things need to be resolved by force.
***She is putting a human thought process to an inanimate object. GUNS do not teach anything. Role models, including parents and teacher, teach things. To say that guns 'teach' something is like saying that a bat teaches us how to hit a ball rather than a person. Multimedia is the only 'thing' that might 'teach' people and that content is controlled by humans.

That's why the world is such a mess. People forget to respect each other and resolve things by talking it out.
AGREE!! But that is not what she said in the previous sentence. To hear her explain it the guns got together and taught us to be mean to each other.

Remember even if only one child a year gets hurt - this child could be YOURS.
What about people saved? Also add the fact that about fewer than 400 children were accidentally killed by firearms last year in a population of 270,000,000 with 238,000,000 guns, that is an incredible safety record. In addition, there are millions of new guns entering the market every year yet the accidental death rate has been dropping steadily for over 60 years. If guns are the problem, how do you explain more guns in peoples hands resulting in fewer deaths?

...What happens to us in our lives is created by the way we feel or think - that becomes part of our live's plan.
***I think like a millionare. I can hardly wait. There are outside forces at work that she has no control over. If she doesn't believe it shoot her.

If we think positive and loving thoughts, and if we are at peace within ourselves, then good things will happen.
***Forward this idiot the story of the sexual assaults in NYC earlier this week and let her tell those women that the reason they were attacked was because they didn't have positive and loving thoughts.

By having complete trust in God, then there is no need to fear ...
***She is a Christian Scientist and must not believe in doctors if she has complete trust in God.
 
Nice question, best answer I've got:

Having guns teaches children that it is your right to possess tools of self-defense. Some things must be settled by force, a violent rape attempt for instance. A gun is simply the only form of self-defense, which puts the lighter, weaker victim on a level playing field with a brutal attacker.

The best way to serve your child's safety is to teach her gun safety and self defense. Facts show this, if you are interested in the truth.
 
This woman is so damned crazy that all I can say about her opinion is that it's crazier than hell.

She needs to get a life and move herself and her kid out of her parents' basement apartment.

The best argument for her is that she is impervious to reason; a lot of people are like her, and cannot be persuaded by anything but their feelings... and a good person well trained with a pistol is about as frightening to bad guys as anything.

Mallet headed, bored soccer mom housewives and their anorexic, bulemic, unidea'd moron daughters are one reason I moved to Japan.



[This message has been edited by Munro Williams (edited June 15, 2000).]
 
Originally posted by FUD:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I think guns are horrible and should NOT be anywhere near children. Not only because of the danger of injury, but also because of the message it is teaching a child - that things need to be resolved by force. That's why the world is such a mess. People forget to respect each other and resolve things by talking it out.[/quote]

How does your correspondent think that WWII should have been settled? Could Hitler have been reasoned with and would he have laid aside his plans for conquest by 'talking things out'? Would the tortured and murdered Jews have been better off if they had simply tried harder to respect him and his minions?

How does this loving mother plan to cope if her child is kidnapped, raped and murdered by some scumbag? Would she appeal to the force of the armed police? Or would she instead plan to reason with her child's attacker and hope that by showing him the proper respect he would repent of his evil deed and promise not to hurt any other defenseless babies?

Some things DO have to be settled by force ... or evil wins.

------------------
"In life, as in chess, forethought wins." -- Charles Buxton

[This message has been edited by pax (edited June 15, 2000).]
 
The quote that she gives insight to what we create and how that impacts our feelings and then goes on to speak about total trust in God~~Why do we need God if we can "create" the effects of emotion and how it applies to us? DAH! Did everybody else wake up this morning and become a god and have the ability to do things at the motion of our hands and minds? I must have gotten left out!

[This message has been edited by JHill (edited June 15, 2000).]
 
JHill,
This person, instead of trying to figure out how reality operates, wants to twist reality to fit her lunacy.

In effect, she, and others like her, although they would not express it so, think they are God. They have delusions of grandeur and not a few are paranoid. They think that reality will rearrange itself to suit them.

It's the essence of magical thinking, occultism, the New Age movement, and euphoric, hysterical religion.

A few years ago they would have been called megalomaniacs, but that's very unPC.

Haven't you ever felt, while talking to babblers like this, that you're trying to anticipate their delusions and trying to figure out a way to drag them into the real world?

There's no way to do it. They routinely deny reality. Denying reality is what makes insanity insane. It's the defining feature of madness.
 
Take a big board. Smack yourself in the head with it a few times. That's it. Less painful and a whole lot less frustrating.
 
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