Remington Rand 1911 question

S

snowman748

New member
Today I was going through some Pawn Shops and saw a "Remington 1911" for $499.99...I had them pull it out and on the slide it said "Remington Rand" which I recognized BUT the frame was a Essex. It had a compensator, magwell, extended mag release, pacymer grips, but seemed pretty worn, the safety wouldn't engage and was missing the rear sight completely.

I passed the on the gun because I knew with the Essex frame it didn't have any collectors value and couldn't justify the $500 for a shooter grade 1911 that I know will require some more money and work.

I just can't stop thinking about it though, I didn't make a mistake passing the gun up right?



I later found a Springfield 1903 Sporter with original barrel and action, Sporter stock, Weaver scope rings and a Burris scope for $249.99 so I'm not to upset about passing up the 1911...
 
Sounds like a heavily modified 1911 that has been torn apart and pieced back together many times. The safety might be an easy fix or a large problem. The sights might just need a new one for cheap or it's possible someone decided to modify the rear sight and took a file to the slide to try and fit something "better". At $500 I'd definitely pass. $300 might be worthwhile but they probably won't go that low.
 
Reddog I felt the same way, if it was $250 or $300 I'd have felt a lot more comfortable.

It almost looked like someone took an old Remington Rand 1911 and put it on an Essex frame, then had the bright idea to replace the mag release, slide catch, barrel, safety, etc. they were definitely either stainless or clear anodized aluminum (my bet is aluminum). The plunger seemed to work for the safety but it wouldn't move enough to actually engage the safety. I think it just wasn't fitted very good but really hard to tell without tearing it down. I figure I'll let it sit a bit and check back in a few months and if it's still there (which I bet it will be) see if they'll come down on it.

The Springfield was a steal, it might need a new stock but not to worried about that. Even better I was able to put it on layaway for $2 more so my GF won't be upset about me dropping that much this close to Christmas.
 
Someone had an old R-R slide and decided to put it on a frame and add some other parts to make a complete gun. Those parts are probably polished steel; no one makes or sells barrels, slide stops or safeties made out of aluminum!

(Just FYI, I once had an old Colt slide on which someone had installed target sights. I put it on an Essex frame with pieces from all over. Darned POS outshot Gold Cups and a half dozen custom target pistols; just one of those flukes, but I rather wish I had kept it.)

Jim
 
The pass was correct. Unless you have money to waste.

Essentially that gun is only worth its parts (the ones that aren't Bubba'd into junk), and the mix of parts, including some that are missing and some that don't work most likely means a home gunsmith that tinkered extensively and not well. There is no telling WHAT ELSE is wrong with the gun.

Remington Rand made slides during WWII. They didn't make complete guns.

WWII slides are reported to not be heat treated the same way commercial and pre war 1911 slides were done. According to a friend of a friend, who talked to a guy who worked for Rem in the day, the entire slide was not heat treated (the way Colt did it) only the locking lug area was.

This was more than sufficient to hold up to the required service life of the gun (and there was a WAR on!) but they do not last like earlier and later slides. WWII contract production parts are a VERY poor choice for a gun intended for a high round count, like a competition gun.

The gun you saw is most likely a homebuild pin gun that saw extensive use (from the wear) and when it began to have issues, was sold/pawned.

Definitely a gun to pass by, unless you are flush, and want a project to tinker with.

Just my opinion, and worth what you paid for it. ;)
 
Remington Rand made slides during WWII. They didn't make complete guns.
Click to expand...

Uh, no.
Remington Rand made more 1911A1s than Colt during WWII, they made almost as many as Colt and Ithaca combined.
They also made replacement slides, everything but the receiver was considered a wear part and abundant spares procured.

A friend here had a gray market source for those spares during the 1970s and he assembled a number of guns on Essex frames. They shot ok but were not authentic anything.

A rough one is sure not worth $500 unless that compensator is a Wilson or Nowlin or other major big name. Probably one of those bushing things which is a negative in my book.
 
Quote:
Remington Rand made slides during WWII. They didn't make complete guns.

Quote:
Uh, no.
Remington Rand made more 1911A1s than Colt during WWII, they made almost as many as Colt and Ithaca combined.

I'm pretty sure Jim is right. Many years ago (early sixties), while still serving in the U.S. Air Force, I purchased a 1911 pistol made by Remington Rand for next to nothing, even for the times. Of course, I eventually let it get away from me for next to nothing...:(
 
This is what an all original 1944 Remington Rand looks like.

2013-06-28T21-58-57.jpg


2013-06-28T21-58-40.jpg


2013-06-28T22-01-38.jpg
 
Ill tell you my springfield stainless 1911a1 has been great and is now even better with the Harrison retro ignition kit. Had to fit a new trigger and thumb safety but that was a piece of cake.
 
I believe 44AMP may be thinking of A.J.Savage Munitions Co., which made some M1911 slides and small parts in the WWI era, but not complete pistols. AFAIK, A.J. Savage was not connected with the Savage Arms Corp. of
Massachusetts or its successors.

AFAIK, all the WWII M1911 contracts included spare parts and parts were also contracted from companies that never made complete pistols. Post-war parts contracts went either to Colt or to other companies since the WWII production lines had been closed.

Jim
 
I have a 1944 Remington Rand which an officer brought back from Italy in early 1945. Several of the small parts of it are stamped HS, which I understand means they were manufactored by High Standard.
 
Springfield Armory stamped an "s" on their small parts, but other than barrels, I'm not aware of other parts with maker's marks.

Remington Rand made more M1911A1s than any other maker.
There is still controversy surrounding AJ Savage's contribution.
 
Did Remington Rand frames have the FJA inspector stamp??

I'm sure you guys are right, but for some reason I had stuck in my head R-Rand only did slides.

I had a Remington Rand GI gun, sadly, loaned to a friend over a dozen years ago, and stolen from him...:o:mad::(

I clearly remember Remington Rand on the slide and the FJA stamp on the frame (along with the US property marking). I don't recall any Rem marking on the frame, was this usual, or could I have had a gun with JUST a REm slide??

Times like this, I really wish I still had that gun to look at...

I no longer have that friend, either, and between the two, I do miss the gun...
 
Lt. Col. (later Col.) Frank J. Atwood was the deputy director of the Rochester Ordnance District and Ordnance inspector, from June 1942 to the end of the war. As such, his "FJA" mark appears on all Ordnance materiel accepted by the Army from contractors in that district (Remington-Rand and Ithaca in the case of M1911A1 pistols), which was all of New York state outside the NYC area. His initials on a piece of Ordnance materiel, whether a pistol or a truck, does not mean he personally inspected every gun or vehicle made in that district, only that he was the person in command and responsible for seeing that the work was done properly. In most cases in WWII, the Ordnance inspector's initials were actually stamped on the gun by a civilian employee of the contractor.

It was the practice with the M1911 and M1911A1 pistols to put the manufacturer's name only on the slide. The serial number was normally only on the frame, although some early Colts also had the number on the slide under the firing pin stop.

Jim
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top