Remington 700 5-R Help Needed

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DirtyHarold

New member
Sometimes you have a good day of shooting, sometimes not, this is the latter. Go easy on me as I haven't spent a ton of time trying to precision shoot rifles, I'm mainly a handgun shooter.

Lately I have been struggling to get good groupings with my model 700 5-R, today included. It is one of the first generation 5-R models with a Vortex 4-16x scope. I have tried several different kinds of ammo - Federal, Winchester, Aguilla (I even have had a light primer strike with this), Remington Core LOKT, M80 military surplus...

With the M80 surplus I actually can pull off sub 1" groups but I don't like using it because I really have to crank on the bolt to close it which just doesn't feel right. All the other ammo is like 6" groups and up, I mean its terrible. Happens no matter if it's 150 or 180 gr.

I have not yet tried the Hornady 168gr match ammo I have, which I intend to now, but I never would have thought what should be such a fine rifle would perform so poorly with so many different kinds of ammo.

-Is it common for rifles like this to be this picky with ammo?
-Could my Vortex scope be going out of whack every time I touch one off?
-Highly doubtful, but has anyone ever gotten a rifle that is just a lemon?
-If you have a 700 5-R, what factory ammo have you found yours likes?

I for sure don't claim to be an expert marksman, not even close, but I am 100% a better shooter than 6+ MOA. I mostly shoot handguns, mainly Glocks that eat basically whatever you feed them with no complaints so I am not used to this.

Thanks for your advice.
 
Don’t have a 5R, but my 700 Police has never shot tiny groups with factory ammo, including
GMM. It took a lot of experimenting with reloads to get it.
Is your cheek weld consistent?
Are you “still” when the trigger breaks? If your pushing in your hold in any direction, it will jump when the trigger breaks.
 
I don't have a 5R, but have several 308's made by various manufacturers. It should be shooting 2" groups at 100 yards with just about any ammo you put in it. And with good quality ammo somewhere between 1/2" to 1" groups. With someone who knows what they're doing and with good handloads, I've seen 1/2" groups at 200 yards with one of those.

It sounds like you've only shot cheaper ammo. But even with that 6" groups are not right. You have something wrong with your rifle, or the scope. And it isn't easy to diagnose over the internet. You need to have someone locally check things out.

You can try simple things like taking the rifle out of the stock, give the barrel a good cleaning, then carefully reassemble the rifle. It is possible that the magazine box is not in correctly and it could be binding. Also check to be sure all of the action screws are tight and properly torqued. Do the same with the scope mounts.

I'm not impressed with Vortex scopes. It is entirely possible the scope is bad. If none of the above makes any difference try another scope of known quality.

After that it is time to let a pro look at the rifle in person. And it might not be a bad idea to do that 1st.
 
Is the rifle new or used? If you got it used the bore could be copper fouled. Is the barrel free floated? How is the trigger pull...does it creep or does it break cleanly? Yes, some rifles are lemons. If you can't figure it out, you have two choices, in my opinion. Trade it or take it to a reputable gun smith. Good luck.
 
Colorado Redneck said:
Is the rifle new or used? If you got it used the bore could be copper fouled. Is the barrel free floated? How is the trigger pull...does it creep or does it break cleanly? Yes, some rifles are lemons. If you can't figure it out, you have two choices, in my opinion. Trade it or take it to a reputable gun smith. Good luck.
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Got it brand new and has a low round count. Barrel is free floating. Trigger has absolutely no creep, is very crisp but is maybe 5-6 lbs. I might have someone else who is better at rifle try it.


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Apparently few posters bothered to actually read the OP’s first post. His rifle shoots the surplus ammo into sub-moa groups. The rifle can’t be in terrible condition (trigger, bedding, fouling, etc.) if it will do this, nor is it the OP’s shooting position. One clue is the hard bolt closure on the military ammo, another is the light primer strike - could the rifle have an excess headspace issue? Problems like this are usually impossible to diagnose from afar.




.
 
Light primer strikes on only one brand of ammo generally isn't a rifle problem. It may be a very "hard" primer or it may be an ammo/rifle fit problem, but when only one brand does it, its not the rifle's firing mechanism that is the problem.

First, and usually easiest step is to remove YOU. Have some one else (or a few someones) shoot the gun and see what happens. If they get decent expected size results, then the problem is something you are doing or not doing. If their groups match yours, then the issue is some sort of mechanical.

Change only ONE variable at a time.

Good Luck, let us know your results.
 
I'd stop by the local gunsmith and have him check headspace with go/no-go gauges. Something seems to be amiss with the chamber based on your post.

Yes, rifles can be a mess from the factory. In my 8 Remingtons, I had two that were off, one badly. 3 months at Warranty repair and they replaced the bolt and barrel.
 
I've owned several 700s since the 70s and all have printed 2" or better with factory ammo. I currently have a 788 and a VTR, which both shoot 1/2" with 165gr Grand Slam handloads. I have several Vortex scopes and they are outstanding. Do you have a Picatinny rail? Check your mounts to ensure 30 in/lbs on bases and 18 in/lbs on rings with blue loctite.
 
OK, not knowing what you know or don't know about rifles, here's my take from a gunsmith point of view:
* Remington 700 5R rifles typically shoot sub-MOA when everything else is lined up. Same with Remington 700 Police. If you have one that won't shoot, look it over good.
* What do the groups look like? Patterns tell a story.
* Are the action screws torqued to 55 in-lbs with a torque wrench or just cranked down to whatever feels good to you?
* Are all the scope base and mount screws tight?
* The heavy trigger has got to go if you want good groups.
* Have you had the barrel scoped by a gunsmith? A good smith with a borescope can save you a lot of frustration.
* Clean the barrel with a good copper remover and wipe clean, then try shooting for groups again.
* Ball ammo is generally NOT accurate. Military requirements and good accuracy can be two different things.
* That said, Federal GMM is usually pretty good stuff (but I have seen rifles that don't like it).
* Every rifle is an individual, so you may have to handload to get the most out of your barrel.
* Does the crown look clean and sharp or does it have little dents or chips in it? Lapping the crown can improve accuracy a lot.
* And, of course, shoot it off of a good solid rest with sandbags front and rear.
 
Allow me to assume you have a group, that is just 6 MOA. For example, its 6 MOA, but the group is centered 6” high at 100 yards.

Try “tracking” your scope or “shooting the square”. Fire a fouling shot or two. Then get your crosshairs on your desired point of impact. Touch one off. Adjust the windage for 1 inch (Most scopes have 1/4” per click, some are 1/8” per click), touch one off, then adjust elevation 1 inch. Touch one off, then adjust it back to your original windage spot, rinse and repeat.

Does the rifle shoot a 1” square?? I know I will probably catch flak for this one, but after each and every adjustment, use a plastic screwdriver handle or piece of wood to tap on the scope rings. If the scope’s adjustments are askew, the slight vibration of the tap tap tap will be an issue. If your scope is tip top, its just a wee tap.

Option two, I am also in the boat of trusting a different scope other than Vortex. Have heard bad things. I am die hard either Burris or Leupold.

Lastly, and this is one I am just asking for trouble…. Sell the Remington and get a Win70. =-p
 
UPDATE
It seems that the last time I went out I just happened to bring only ammo the gun doesn’t like. I recently went out with Hornady match, Hornady Black, and Federal 150gr and it likes all 3 at least better than before. It likes Black the most, managed several sub MOA groups. Managed one sub MOA group with the Federal, one just okay group, and one ~1.5 MOA with the Hornady match. It was pretty gusty too. I found some Nosler 168 at a LGS that I’ll try next.
 
BornFighting88 said:
Try “tracking” your scope or “shooting the square”. Fire a fouling shot or two. Then get your crosshairs on your desired point of impact. Touch one off. Adjust the windage for 1 inch (Most scopes have 1/4” per click, some are 1/8” per click), touch one off, then adjust elevation 1 inch. Touch one off, then adjust it back to your original windage spot, rinse and repeat.

Does the rifle shoot a 1” square??
Click to expand...
That'll happen only if worse accuracy is under about one twentyth inch.
 
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Bart B. said:
That'll happen only if worse accuracy is under about one twentyth inch.
Click to expand...

Yep.

A 1 foot box is more appropriate for a factory grade hunting rifle. Still, if it is a 2 MOA rifle, one side of the box could be 10" and another side 14". When I shoot a box to check a hunting rifle scope, it takes about at least half an hour. 5 shot groups at the four corners with sufficient cooling in between shots to make sure the barrel temp is about the same.
 
I test scope adjustment repeatability with a collimator in the muzzle or hard mounted aimed at a ruler at 50 or 100 yards. More precise than shooting.

And centering the scope's LOS on the scope's axis is never midpoint on its windage and elevation line of sight knob adjustments.
 
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This is my target from 100 yards. The two tightest groups are Hornady black. The second tightest and worst is Federal 150gr. The bottom left group is Hornady match 168. Don’t recall the two fliers but doesn’t matter.

d14f99617e2b568f85925d1b89e50f7b.jpg



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Always check your stock screws and scope mounts and rings. I highly recommend getting a torque tool like the wheeler fat wrench.

Some guns like some ammos better than others.
 
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