Need some advice from you longer term reloaders. Have been reloading rifle cartridges for a few years. And, not sure my experience with factory loads is much different than some of you.... unhappy, inconsistent results, etc.,... So was breaking some .270 factory ammo down and all was going well til I got to what I had originally hoped was going to be prized ammo with a great bullet. Pulled the bullets; no problem. Then tried to dump the powder; big problem.... Caked powder. A few grains dropped out and then I had to use the wooden end of a long Qtip to stir the powder a couple times and dump it out. Help me out guys.... Compressed loads? Moisture seeped into the powder? Powder or brass too hot during manufacturing? Safe to shoot? Note that I have even older loads stored with this ammo and it is easy to break down. Thoughts? (And, BTW, I do have a bunch of it....)
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Reloading: Breaking Down Factory Loads
- Thread starter Skip02
- Start date
Compressed loads are not unheard of. The Hornady original light magnum loads had some kind of funny very elastic powder that they loaded under pressure somehow to force it into the case. Pull the bullet and let is sit, and gradually the powder would expand and overflow the case.
The well-known Federal Gold Medal Match .308 Winchester load of 43.5 grains of IMR 4064 under the 168 grain Sierra MatchKing is slightly compressed. That helps keep the powder from settling in transportation and changing its burn rate.
The well-known Federal Gold Medal Match .308 Winchester load of 43.5 grains of IMR 4064 under the 168 grain Sierra MatchKing is slightly compressed. That helps keep the powder from settling in transportation and changing its burn rate.
Skip
Why are you breaking down factory loads? Factory powder is blended to a specification in large batches. You can NOT replicate factory powder and there is no way to tell what those loads will do with less powder other then wasting time by dumping x amount and then reseating the bullets. That is just a wasted effort. Best thing for you to do is shoot them and reuse the cases.
Why are you breaking down factory loads? Factory powder is blended to a specification in large batches. You can NOT replicate factory powder and there is no way to tell what those loads will do with less powder other then wasting time by dumping x amount and then reseating the bullets. That is just a wasted effort. Best thing for you to do is shoot them and reuse the cases.
Interesting.... I do have a couple boxes of Hornady light magnum in 30-06 that I will be breaking down soon as well. Just to give you a little more info: I'm breaking down Federal Premium .270 Winchester with 140 gr. TBBC in nickel plated brass. Will reuse the brass and trying to carefully remove the bullet with RCBS Collet Bullet Puller. Dearly want to develop a load with these bullets. I'm open to any input you have on that.
Skip this is a factory load that you are breaking down. Have you tried other factory loads and found one that will work? If not I would do that first simply because if you can not get your .270 accurate enough by trying a few different brands the problem could well be you and or your rifle and no amount of reloading can correct that
emcon5: Already have 50 rounds broken down. Bullet pulling is rather quick with the RCBS tool. I admit to being a biggot for the Speer Trophy Bonded Bear Claw Bullet. And, as you may know, this particular bullet is as hard to find new these days as snipe are on a snipe hunt. Exterior wise, the RCBS collet does not appear to have damaged these bullets. Time will tell. Realizing of course, I may in the end have to drop back to a 130 gr bullet for accuracy sake in my .270.
hartcreek: Yes, have shot 3 other factory ammo's ... Same poor results.... But, with a 150 gr. bullet. Yep, two big elephants on the range; me and my rifle. And, I cannot discount either. But, will say that I can shoot both my 308 and 30-06 better than this particular rifle. Will try some reloads with the 140 grainers. If that doesn't work, I'm likely to back off to a 130 gr. bullet and try again. My rifle is a Browning with an adjustable BOSS. Adjustments don't seem to help either
I imagine they are hard to find, Pretty sure those are discontinued. Speer no longer lists them on their web site, and Federal doesn't list them as an option in any .270 ammo on theirs.I admit to being a biggot for the Speer Trophy Bonded Bear Claw Bullet.
Lots of good bullets out there.
I understand breaking down ammo that doesn't suit your needs, for whatever reason. If you don't like the results factory ammo gives, why shoot them when you can "rebuild" some better ammo? You wind up with some primed brass and some "pulls" that may (or may not) be used again. Remove the decapping stem and either F/L size or just neck size and you have good almost brand new brass to start with. I have "rebuilt" mebbe 100+ rounds of HXP ammo; pulled bullets, dumped powder, resized, reloaded with Hornady bullets and IMR 4064 and shot them in my Garand. Better accuracy and functioning than the originals. Fun.
For me, at least, there is no wasted time when reloading. I enjoy just about every step in the process and enjoy customizing my ammo. Wasted time? Never!
Have no idea about powder caking, perhaps a few whacks with a inertia puller will get it out...
For me, at least, there is no wasted time when reloading. I enjoy just about every step in the process and enjoy customizing my ammo. Wasted time? Never!
Have no idea about powder caking, perhaps a few whacks with a inertia puller will get it out...
It is wasting time if you can not purchase more of that specific bullet. You will be working up a load that is a dead end. If you are bound and determined to pull these you should just jump down to 130 grain.
I have worked up loads for 30-06 and as long as I stay with the same basic profile of bullet and weight and powder charge the accuracy is the same.
I went to casting my own bullet for 7.62 x 39, 7.62x54R, .308 and 30-06 so that I have a steady supply of 160+ grain bullets for practice that give the same POI/POA as my hunting rounds which could be Herter, Sierra or Nozzler bullets depending on what I have to kill.
I use the same lead bullet but size it accordingly.
I have worked up loads for 30-06 and as long as I stay with the same basic profile of bullet and weight and powder charge the accuracy is the same.
I went to casting my own bullet for 7.62 x 39, 7.62x54R, .308 and 30-06 so that I have a steady supply of 160+ grain bullets for practice that give the same POI/POA as my hunting rounds which could be Herter, Sierra or Nozzler bullets depending on what I have to kill.
I use the same lead bullet but size it accordingly.
hartcreek: Yes, have shot 3 other factory ammo's ... Same poor results....
Sounds like a problem with the rifle rather than the load. Does any load shoot well in that rifle?
griz: Have to admit that I have not found a really great load yet. But, I'll keep trying.... I am more suspicious of the rifle than myself.
All: Beginning to wonder if the loads I have been breaking down are a proprietary/secret loading by Federal. Those of you who shoot a muzzleloader know that if you shoot black powder pellets like Pyrodex, that the powder needs some type of glue/amalgam to keep the powder in pellet form. As I said, this powder is not a simple dump.... There is something else in it. There is residue of something on the inside walls of the cartridge after I poke and loosen the powder.
All: Beginning to wonder if the loads I have been breaking down are a proprietary/secret loading by Federal. Those of you who shoot a muzzleloader know that if you shoot black powder pellets like Pyrodex, that the powder needs some type of glue/amalgam to keep the powder in pellet form. As I said, this powder is not a simple dump.... There is something else in it. There is residue of something on the inside walls of the cartridge after I poke and loosen the powder.
WOW lots of ways to go
What a project!
First, is the boss a CR, (conventional recoil), or the Muzzle Brake version? Why I ask is the MB version is very loud,LOUD,LOUD!!! It alone can cause flinches just by the noise. I bought my son,(@14 YO), a 7-08 in an A-bolt synthetic hunter, it came with the MB BOSS. It shot great at the factory setting. We got the CR BOSS later on, it kicks harder but now he's full grown and knows what to expect.
Look on the Browning website, there should be a place that gives a chart about where to set the BOSS for whatever caliber AND bullet weight for the best accuracy. Start there, then adjust in small increments to get the best groups. WARNING this will burn a bunch of ammo before reaching the best results.
You maybe should punch the primer out as well, no knowing what they used for the primer. You should also resize the entire case, that works out as using the FL die after the round is pulled down.
What a project!
First, is the boss a CR, (conventional recoil), or the Muzzle Brake version? Why I ask is the MB version is very loud,LOUD,LOUD!!! It alone can cause flinches just by the noise. I bought my son,(@14 YO), a 7-08 in an A-bolt synthetic hunter, it came with the MB BOSS. It shot great at the factory setting. We got the CR BOSS later on, it kicks harder but now he's full grown and knows what to expect.
Look on the Browning website, there should be a place that gives a chart about where to set the BOSS for whatever caliber AND bullet weight for the best accuracy. Start there, then adjust in small increments to get the best groups. WARNING this will burn a bunch of ammo before reaching the best results.
You maybe should punch the primer out as well, no knowing what they used for the primer. You should also resize the entire case, that works out as using the FL die after the round is pulled down.
"...wonder if the loads I have been breaking down are..." Nope. Just loaded with powder you cannot get and your rifle just does not like.
Factory ammo is like an off the rack suit. Sort of fits, but not quite. Reloading is tailoring the ammo your rifle. That includes the primer. If you insist on pulling factory for the bullets and brass(a very expensive way of obtaining that stuff. 50 pieces of Winchester brass runs $27.99 at Midway. One box of Federal ammo starts at $30ish.) pitch the powder too. You have no idea what it is and the manufacturers do not publish that data. Manufacturers load for a specific velocity with a given bullet weight. That ammo may or may not shoot well out of your rifle.
Caked powder in factory ammo is the result of poor storage over a fair amount of time. Moisture got in somehow. Highly unlikely to be anything you did yourself.
Factory ammo is like an off the rack suit. Sort of fits, but not quite. Reloading is tailoring the ammo your rifle. That includes the primer. If you insist on pulling factory for the bullets and brass(a very expensive way of obtaining that stuff. 50 pieces of Winchester brass runs $27.99 at Midway. One box of Federal ammo starts at $30ish.) pitch the powder too. You have no idea what it is and the manufacturers do not publish that data. Manufacturers load for a specific velocity with a given bullet weight. That ammo may or may not shoot well out of your rifle.
Caked powder in factory ammo is the result of poor storage over a fair amount of time. Moisture got in somehow. Highly unlikely to be anything you did yourself.
I have pulled down factory ammo; I have been impressed with factory ammo I have pulled down. I have pulled down reloaded ammo that was loaded by much disciplined reloaders. The last batch I pulled down was loaded in 1971 and 1972. I could have fired most of it but about 10% had powder that had gone bad. In all appearance the powder smelt and looked like power in a can that lost its seal. I save the cases and bullets.
Most of the factory ammo I have pulled down was R-P. I have pulled down thousands of military surplus ammo for the cases, powder and bullets, I have also pulled the ammo down to get rid of the bullets like armor piercing and tracers. Because of the seal on surplus ammo the powder is not likely to be bad.
The R-P ammo I have pulled down started with failure to fire cases in a new rifle. The owner made 2 attempts at busting the primers and then he gave others shooters a chance. Every case that failed to had an opportunity to fire in at least 4 different rifles. The fail to fire and fired cases were brought to me. I suggested they call Remington. I pulled the 5 cases down and measured and weight everything: most impressive ammo. After pulling the cases down I removed the primers: with the exception of the big dent in the primer I found nothing wrong with them. AND THEN I seated the primers back into the cases they were removed from: I then chambered the cases in one of my M1917 rifles with the killer firing pins. The M1917 busted the primers one after the other, and then, when ejected the primers did not protrude.
F. Guffey
I have no reservation about shaking a case to check to see if the poser is loose. I am never so desperate for something to shoot that I would risk firing a case with powder caked behind the bullet.
Most of the factory ammo I have pulled down was R-P. I have pulled down thousands of military surplus ammo for the cases, powder and bullets, I have also pulled the ammo down to get rid of the bullets like armor piercing and tracers. Because of the seal on surplus ammo the powder is not likely to be bad.
The R-P ammo I have pulled down started with failure to fire cases in a new rifle. The owner made 2 attempts at busting the primers and then he gave others shooters a chance. Every case that failed to had an opportunity to fire in at least 4 different rifles. The fail to fire and fired cases were brought to me. I suggested they call Remington. I pulled the 5 cases down and measured and weight everything: most impressive ammo. After pulling the cases down I removed the primers: with the exception of the big dent in the primer I found nothing wrong with them. AND THEN I seated the primers back into the cases they were removed from: I then chambered the cases in one of my M1917 rifles with the killer firing pins. The M1917 busted the primers one after the other, and then, when ejected the primers did not protrude.
F. Guffey
I have no reservation about shaking a case to check to see if the poser is loose. I am never so desperate for something to shoot that I would risk firing a case with powder caked behind the bullet.
And then: there is the risk of powder caking in front of the primer. It is not a good ideal to open the bolt after pulling without first hearing that sound. I checked a rifle with ammo that was involved in an inheritance. Those that were involved Ohooed and awed about the man that did the reloading. Had I attended finishing school I could have come up with a better response.
Anyhow, I got to the range and attempted to fire the first case. Click then no bang, I waited and then bang. I pulled down 2 boxes of 20 rounds each. All the cases had caked powder. Most of the cases had caked powder in the rear of the case and a few with the cake in front. Had I pulled the trigger on a case with the powder caked in front the receiver would not have survived. It was a custom? 30/40 Crag. I then advise the new owner he could have the rifle but had to promise me he would not shoot it.
F. Guffey
Anyhow, I got to the range and attempted to fire the first case. Click then no bang, I waited and then bang. I pulled down 2 boxes of 20 rounds each. All the cases had caked powder. Most of the cases had caked powder in the rear of the case and a few with the cake in front. Had I pulled the trigger on a case with the powder caked in front the receiver would not have survived. It was a custom? 30/40 Crag. I then advise the new owner he could have the rifle but had to promise me he would not shoot it.
F. Guffey