Reloading brass

A

ADIDAS69

New member
For ultra anal retentive reloading are lapua brass and vihtavuori powder really worth the coin to extract as much precision and accuracy possible?
 
Opinions will vary but I use Lapua Brass in my 308 and 7mm08 and it's really great right out of the case. That said, many people use other brass to good effect but cheaper brass will generally require more preparation than Lapua or Norma.

For "ultra anal retentive" applications you will want to weight sort and prep your brass no matter who makes it.

As for VihtaVuori powders, they are not magically better because they cost more. I use a lot of VihtaVuori powders for pistol as they have proven to me to be more accurate and definitely burn cleaner than the H powders I replaced with them. This is again a matter of opinion and different applications will tell the tale.

I use: vvN105, vvN110, vvN340 for pistol.

I have used vvN560 and vvN570 for magnum rifle loads and I am going back to Accurate and Ramshot. They are good powders but not twice as good and I have developed great loads with MAGPRO and HUNTER.
 
What type of shooting are you doing & with what rifle ? I use the brass from a friend that doesn't reload . I think its how well you prep your brass . Find what bullet & powder shoots best in your rifle. You can try what works best for others but my not work in your firearm. Hope I Helped in some way. Chris
 
Good brass is worth the investment. My first choice is Norma, thereafter Lapua and then Sako. It all depends what is more available.
 
Good brass, fireformed to chamber and annealed every few reloads is worth a lot in a precision bolt gun.....otherwise m much less value.
 
Thanks guys

To answer your question cw308 it’s a Rem 700 chambered in .223 Remington with a 26” threaded barrel 1:12 twist with a Harvester Big Bore. Thus far with just my standard 55 grain training reloads I can achieve 1.1 MOA at 600 yards. I’ve amassed a fair number of Sierra 53 grain hollow points and am ready to do a proper OCW test. now that my local retailer has Vihtavuori back in stock I thought I might splurge and figured to extend the spending frenzy to the brass as well. Thanks for the feedback.
 
I got Norma for my 284 Win casings.
Had to trim a fair bit. Wasn't much contact de-burring/uniforming flash holes though.

The PVRI brass i got for 7mm-08 wasn't much trimming but flash holes were rough.
Ditto the 7X57 Mauser brass that i use to form 257 Roberts.

Winchester brass for the 7mm Rem Mag was pretty good as far as trimming and flashhole.

Nosler brass for the 7mm-08 was spot on. Didn't have to do a thing. But i checked anyways.

Now ask me if i've noticed an accuracy difference between any on the casing manufactures. Not a bit...
 
ADIDAS69 said:
For ultra anal retentive reloading are lapua brass and vihtavuori powder really worth the coin to extract as much precision and accuracy possible?
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Kinda depends on your firearm, your type of shooting and your reloading techniques. Only you can answer your question since it is your coin and your expectations/results. The majority of folks in the country are perfectly happy and go their whole life, using standard factory ammo.
 
Nobody can answer the question definitively because they don't have your rifle. I would say to take advantage of the fact you can buy different brass in small quantities to make some assessments of what works best for you.

I'll point out that Federal, whose commercial match ammunition has a good reputation, still works with IMR 4064 in the .308 versions. I don't think Vihtavuori is necessarily magic in this regard. IIRC, it's nitrocellulose is made with 100% cotton cellulose rather than wood or other more resiny sources, and I think they make their own nitrocellulose and nitroglycerin and deterrents and stabilizers to get a higher grade than is most often used by other makers. This results in relatively clean burning, but at the end of the day you still need to clean your guns, so whether that is a significant factor for you or not depends on your shooting patterns. When it comes to powder, I would consider every source and go with whoever makes what the gun likes best, regardless of the source.

If a gun is not shooting well, there is usually some dominant error source that has to be dealt with, whether it has to do with the load or the mechanics of the gun, and until you find it, your load tuning steps can often appear futile or to do very little. Once you do find it, though, then things you tried before that didn't seem to affect group size, can start to make a visible difference, so you wind up having to check them all over again. The other approach, and one I use, is to make the loads as perfect as possible initially, with every kind of sorting for consistency and brass prep I can manage and load assembly I can manage, knowing some of it is a complete waste of time. If I can't find a tight grouping with a series of loads built that carefully, I know I have a gun problem and not to waste more time in the load search before I find it. But if I get a tight shooting load, I can then drop back and eliminate some of the careful load assembly until I see what matters to that load and what doesn't.
 
I have played with that.

First I was disappointed that Lapua came with about 5% dented cases (at the mouth) . I trim all my brass but some needed it (I don't generally measure, I just trim all to the same baseline)

I won't claim to be anything other than a shooter that's someplace between the average and the pro's (closer to the average shooter sadly)

I have worked up loads with my main stay RP brass, then switched to Lapua and tweaked the loads around to adjust of case variation (though they weight close to the same).

I haven't got a sudden improvement with it.

Maybe the guys that shoot well at local F class and the pros can see the difference, I can't.

I saw a longevity chart with maybe 10 brass types. RP and Lapua were both about 2/3 of the way up the chart, Norma was the only one that really stood out at the top.

Not the only measure of quality, but certainly an important one.

As for powder, not a clue as the V is too rich for my blood and I can shoot in the range I want using other powders.
 
For ultra anal retentive reloading are lapua brass and vihtavuori powder really worth the coin to extract as much precision and accuracy possible?
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I took two new rifles to the firing range, both were 300 Win Mags, one was a Model 70 Winchester, the other was a Weatherby. After 120 rounds through the Model 70 Winchester it shot like a shot gun, it shot patterns.

The Weatherby shot one hole groups after 74 rounds, the last 6 rounds out of 80 when through the same hole.

I built a 270 Winchester, I loaded 6 boxes/120 rounds with 12 different cases, different bullets and different powders etc., I took the rifle to the range and shot all 120 rounds, I did not have a flyer, I did not have a group open up, all groups could be covered with a quarter. The groups moved and some groups shared the same hole. The rifle liked everything, all that was necessary was to fire one shot and then zero.

I purchased one of the ugliest rifles ever sporterized according to reloading forums, I loaded 12 different loads with 10 cases in each group with 12 different case heads, the ugly rifle was purchased for the parts, problem I could not believe anyone could build anything that ugly without knowing what they were doing, sure enough; there was nothing I could do to improve on the accuracy of the rifle so I applied the 'leaver policy'. I left-er the way I found-er. The scope, mount and rings cost more than the rifle.

F. Guffey
 
I paid/won the bid for $120.00, Before it was turned into a flower it was a M1917 Remington. The front stock was also the recoil lug and the stock covered the barrel on all 4 sides.

F. Guffey
 
Mr Guffey and I most certainly agree on the best way to have an accurate rifle, and that is to buy an accurate rifle. Expensive brass won’t turn a poor shooter into a great shooter. That said, you can help the accuracy with your reloading skills and good brass, bullets, etc.

I buy Norma and Lapua brass these days. I can get accuracy just as good with Remington and Winchester brass, but I have to prep it a bit first. I got tired of all that prep work and now just buy the good brass. And Nosler counts as good brass, but (to me) doesn’t seem to last for as many reloads.

I should mention that i’m just a hunter and paper puncher. Not a competitive shooter. My desire for accuracy exceeds my real needs. So, does it really really matter if I, as a hunter, just use plain old unprepped Remington or Winchester brass? No, not at all. I just want my rifles to shoot as well as possible, and I think i’m finally at the point that the limitation is me. :-)
 
Don't you fellows overlook Peterson brass. I bought some for my 6.5 Creedmoor and it's superb brass. I bought direct, the service was great plus the cost was a bit cheaper than Lapua.
 
ADIDAS69
1.1 at 600 yards with a .223 is great shooting . I had a Bruce McArthur custom brake installed on my Rem 700 308 20" barrel to cut down the bounce , I'm shooting off a bi - pod . In my neck of the woods the ranges are 200 yards max. My average is .5 at 200 , wish there was a place close to shoot long . I F/L size clean my brass in a wet tumbler , dish detergent ,stainless steel pins & water . Cleans brass inside an out , brass looks brand new every reload. Again ,hard to beat 1.1 @ 600. Chris
 
ADIDAS69, what in the world are you shooting at that 1.1 at 600 with a .223 isn't filling the bill??? That would be a dead prairie dog just about as often as you pull the trigger. Same for any other predator/varmint/nuisance animal. Even shooting at targets, that's darn good shooting. By the way, what is the rifle you are using? I may want to try one myself. :o
 
603 Country...Bravo, my friend. We both share the same desires; own a good gun, find a great load for it and know that, if you do your part, there will be a hole in the target precisely where you wanted it or the animal you were shooting at will be DRTSTW (dead right there, stayed that way). I myself am old enough that I don't want to track an animal after I've shot it to harvest it. I have also lost a deer earlier in my life and swore that it would NEVER happen again, and it hasn't! Take care and stay healthy. John
 
Don't you fellows overlook Peterson brass.
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I missed the info that the topic was 223 brass; Peterson doesn't offer 223, but the 308 and 6.5 CM I've loaded are really very good quality for a reasonable price. And BTW I don't work for them. :)
 
Blackwidowp61, it’s an off the shelf rem 700 from their varmint series. I had the barrel thread for the suppressor but that’s it. In terms of reasoning for obsessing over accuracy it’s basically; cause I can.
 
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