reducing .45/70 loads by 35%

dgang

New member
I'm puzzled when people say not to reduce loads more than 10%, that it can be just as dangerous as over- pressure loads. Hodgdon lists max loads for .45/70 lever action rifles 60 gr. of powder under a 300 gr. SJHP, then lists 45 gr. for minimum black powder pressure loads. That is a reduction of 25%. Same case, bullet and powder from the same rifle. What gives?:confused:
 
Different cartridge, different powder = different pressure environment.

Did you find anyone talking 10% reduction max discussing black powder?
 
Did you find anyone talking 10% reduction max discussing black powder?
Ballard... when I looked up dgang's reference to "black powder pressure loads" he was referencing published smokeless Trapdoor loads.

Not to worry -- apple-to-apples there.
... the '10% warning just' isn't applicable to reducing 45-70 handloads w/ powders normal to the 45-70.
 
What “people” say and what people with ammunition factories and test equipment say is not always the same.
Hodgdon says H4895 is good down to 60%.
DuPont used to say IMR4895 was good down to 3/5.

Hodgdon used to say H110 was good not less than 97%.
Winchester used to say 296 should not be reduced at all.
Now Hodgdon starts both at 96%.
 
10% isn't universal. It is a common number to use to reduce maximum loads to get to a safe start pressure. If you look in enough databooks, you'll find starting loads in one that are substantially lower than 10% below the maximum load in another. But you also find some data with starting loads less than 10% below maximum.

There is a problem that occurs when powders can't develop enough start pressure, which is the powder can extinguish, leaving a bullet stuck in the barrel. If the next round fires into that stuck bullet and doesn't extinguish, that can cause catastrophic damage. The exact load level that causes this varies with powder and bullet weight (heavier bullets improve confinement for building adequate pressure).

Also, some powders have normal loads at low loading densities in some cartridges, and if you reduce them too much, pressures can get erratic from the low loading density. Dr. Lloyd Brownell documented pressure having random scatter that included a wide range of highs and lows below about 60% loading density in 30-06. And this was with very common single-base stick powders like IMR 3031. Some of that erratic behavior is credited to the fact you can get a lot of powder surface area exposed to the primer flash when the density gets low, giving it a bigger head start on burning up. A lot of load data, knowing the density of powders change from lot to lot, recommends never going below 70% loading density because of this. However, it does not cause a problem with fast powders used in reduced loads, because they light up fast whether the flash covers a large starting area or not.
 
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