Recent shotgun quality issues

3

300magman

New member
I was into my dealer's buying a new pump the other day when he started telling me how he'd been having a lot of returns lately. He's a remington fan himself, but he's having a hard time recommending them after 3 of his last 8 model 870 sales have been returned to remington with chamber issues.

I'm wondering if he's having particularly bad luck, or if remington is having issues with this springs run of model 870s?
Though he also mentioned a bad chamber in a 597 and 2 model 700s he'd returned as well. Considering the low volume he does I'm very surprised.
 
The Express model is a poor substitite for the Wingmaster. Always has been, and continues to be. But, of course, due to price, the Express is where Remington's volume is now. Hence, more problems with their guns, especially in the realm of cosmetics...fit, finish, chamber polishing, etc. I have many Wingmasters and several Police guns. It's been a long time since I've had an Express that I felt was a keeper (the original Express guns were decent). I guess if you've never experienced a top-end 870, you'd probably be more accepting of the Express's relatively poor build quality.
 
Quality issues have been a problem for Remington over the last 5 years or more in my mind ......I don't think its anything new.
 
I used to shoot Remingtons back in the 80's for skeet and hunting. They were decent quality back then. Since then they are really going down hill. They started making cheaper guns and selling to big box sellers such as Wal Mart and started using cheaper components and the insides were poorly finished. They rust worse than any gun on the market (not from lack of cleaning, just from a day in the field. No corrosion resistance). Their Express 870 is the pinacle they reached in poor quality. Compare it to the old Wingmaster. They've also developed a line of big box rifles that are just as bad. I don't buy them anymore and probably never will again. Too bad, they used to be a pretty good company.
 
I used to shoot Remingtons back in the 80's for skeet and hunting. They were decent quality back then. Since then they are really going down hill. They started making cheaper guns and selling to big box sellers such as Wal Mart and started using cheaper components and the insides were poorly finished. They rust worse than any gun on the market (not from lack of cleaning, just from a day in the field. No corrosion resistance). Their Express 870 is the pinacle they reached in poor quality. Compare it to the old Wingmaster. They've also developed a line of big box rifles that are just as bad. I don't buy them anymore and probably never will again. Too bad, they used to be a pretty good company.
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Their actions weren't done by accident, but in response to the consumer's wish for cheap at any cost. Folks have been buying cheaply-made Chicom, Turkish, and other third-world guns that had price points below a quality Remington, so they cut as much as they could from the production costs to compete.

Remington did the same thing to Winchester and they eventually lost their market share to the "new" 870 WingMaster
 
My brother swears he won't buy another Remington after his last 700 purchase. Since then, he's purchased two Savages.
 
My brother swears he won't buy another Remington after his last 700 purchase. Since then, he's purchased two Savages.
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Sounds like my story... I bought two wingmasters that did not work... After sending stuff back to Remington and not getting the problems rectified, I worked with a gunsmith and did some homework and now they both run like a wingmaster should... About the only thing that wasn't wrong with them was the chambers... For what a new wingmaster costs, they damn well better work!!! I've complained about my last 700 enough already.... Lets just say it's sold a few savages... The only 700s I buy currently are older ones, or guns that I've had the chance to test drive...
 
I purchased an 870 Express last fall from Dicks and it has been a great gun. I have not had any performance issues and would/will buy another. I do not have the experience with many other models but have nothing but good action with my express. Granted, I am not shooting 100's of shells through my gun but with the shooting I have done it has been a great gun and I would recommend the 870 express to anybody looking for a entry level shotgun in that price range.
 
The only entry level pump shotguns I would recommend are the BPS and Ithaca 37. All others I looked at are junk. Yes, they cost more but they are quality guns. My interpretations of entry level are guns that work.
 
That really too bad....I've always liked remington's design and the set up of thier mechanisms. I get thrown completely off my game when I hold a BPS, everything is in the wrong place, even if my mind says "its a BPS" my fingers seems to think its a Wingmaster and I end up fumbling it around and finally finding the slide release, safety, etc a few seconds slower than I should.
 
Over the years i have had 4 12ga 3" express and 3 wingmasters. Every problem i have had with any of them was operator caused. Not all where in good operating condition when i recieved them, a used wingmaster with parts missing. 2 express had thousands of rounds through them, before i recieved them but had never been cleaned. On disassembly the issues found where basicly the same. Dirt in magazine, Gunked up magazine follower, Wore out magazine follower, Rusty magazine spring, Bent shell latches, sand and crud in trigger assembly, Bolt barrel recess plugged with crud. I have seen chambers very rough and in need of polishing, Last one was on a brand new wingmaster remchoke barrel. I understand a lot of recent remington guns have issues, poor chamber finish and assembly problems. In a poor economy like we have, Why would remington ship a poor product? Simple answer is the company is being run by non intelligent buisness managers. It is not the guns that are the problem at remington, It is the clowns shipping unfinished, untested, penny pinched assembled guns.
 
Quality - or lack of it -- goes deeper than company management.

As consumers - we own part of it / and have to tell these companies what we think - and that we want changes. If they continue to sell thousands of these guns - then how foolish are we as consumers. Remember there are thousands of guns bought every month / from people that never visit a shotgun forum or do any research on the gun before they buy.

Senior mgr's deserve some blame - taking mfging offshore, buying cheap parts, etc...

Stockholders - also get a lot of blame ...all they care about is the bottom line. Many, or most of them, don't care if Remington makes shotguns, cars or toys ...did they do it with a profit or not ...and nothing else matters ( and some of those people are consumers too ).
 
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