Real combat sights for the Blackhawk, anyone?

Jim March

New member
Hi all,

As you're no doubt aware, I've been trying to sort out a sight solution for Ruger SAs, one that:

1) Is a GOOD sight setup (modern combat style, Tritium);

2) Doesn't interfere with fast hammer access the way a Blackhawk factory "rear overhang" sight does. Please don't suggest alternate thumbing methods, we're talking about what works in MY hands here.

This has been an ongoing discussion on the Ruger forum. I'm going to start with some posts by Bo Wallace of Ashley Outdoors (now called "Express Sight Systems"):

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Thanks to all for their suggestions.

When we began to build sights for the Ruger line of pistols, some of them (installation wise) were no brainers that simply required going through the motions to determine what height(s) would be required to regulate each caliber correctly.

The BlackHawk and Vaquero both have proved to be a bit more difficult to do mainly in the fact that they will require moderate amounts of gunsmithing.

Good gunsmiths are hard to find. I have way to many people sending me their Glock/Sig/Kimber slides to have sights pushed into the factory dovetails to believe otherwise. So coming up with a solution that requirers the services of a master gunsmith would mean that only a few would sell.

Anyway we are still looking for our solution for these pistols and your input is valuable.

Thanks
Bo Wallace
Gunsmith
Express Sight Systems Inc.
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Jim again. In another message:

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Jim,

What the BlackHawk needs in the way of front sight installation will depend upon which of several front sight installations that your particular pistol has.

There have been pistols with:

A 1pc ramp/front sight that is screwed in place.

or

A 1pc ramp/front sight that is silver soldiered to the barrel.

or

A front sight blade that is pinned into a ramp that is silver soldiered onto the barrel.

or

One of the specialized models that uses the spring plunger retained front sights similar to the RedHawk.(we already have this one)

Whew.

The first and last ones of course will be easiest, however they are the least in the overall BlackHawk population numbers.
The pinned front models would be next largest batch being mostly stainless.

The most common version of B'Hawk out there has the 1 pc ramp/front sight unit which is silver soldierd to the barrel. This will require the heating up of the original sight unit before anything new can be installed. The heat will destroy the bluing and requiring the barrel to be reblued somewhere in the process. The added cost of this is one of the big speed bumps in doing things for these pistols.

There has to be a better way and that isn't going to bump the cost of the pistol more than $200 (which is the far end of what we have found most people will spend for sights on most handguns)and that is what we are looking for.

Bo
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Jim again.

The Blackhawk is in my opinion the better starting point (versus Vaquero) for a "combat SA", mainly because they're cheaper, far more common and available in more calibers. Most have aluminum frames which reduce weight, which matters in this situation.

I think I now have a complete set of blueprints for a good set of combat sights - given the length, I'll post in an immediate follow-up.
 
First, the rear sight:

bh2.jpg


As you can see, it puts the rear very close to where rear sights are found on an adjustable-sight model Freedom Arms 83 or 97 frame...forward of the hammer!

The rearward end of the sight base is rounded and sculpted so that the rear edge of the topstrap feels smooth, but there's no actual frame mods. In other words, you're bolting on a set of topstrap mods that would cost $600 or more if you had Bowen or Alpha Precision weld and grind the frame.

Now for the front!

bhfront.gif


bhfront2.gif


bhfront3.gif


I prefer the "Widow's Peak" type where you lop the whole factory front sight and base completely off, by either sophisticate means or crude doesn't matter.

The same sight base could take any of four different AO catalog fronts for the AR-15, big or small dot tritium in round or square top.

The front sight base with comp could be in aluminum and wouldn't add much weight. Wouldn't add all that much in steel.

Comments?!

:D
 
Seems like trying to make a race car out of a pickup truck.
 
There's no particular reason an SA can't have good sights while keeping the handling properties that made the original SAA so great.

The other issue is that in any of the major Blackhawk calibers (357/44/45) people run such extremely wide ranges of power levels that adjustable elevation is NOT a luxury, it's critical.

Finally, these have the potential to BE racecars. Esp. in terms of big-bore accuracy, a New Model Ruger SA has tons of potential.
 
Kudos on a well-thought system.

My question is, what does the sight picture look like? Notch and post, or aperture rear? Can you post a representation of that?
 
IIRC the Blackhawk was named after a race car.

I think your rear sight idea would sell. It's hard to believe that someone hasn't already copied the FA rear sight for the Blackhawk.

Ruger already makes a decent front sight that readily accepts different height blades. It's the one on the SRH. It's probably to tall for a BH but shortening it up would be pretty simple. It's not adjustable but it only takes about 10 seconds to change a blade. -- Kernel
 
The AO "Pro Express" sight is a shallow express-V sight, but in the bottom of the "V" is a vertical Tritium bar surrounded by a vertical oval of white enamel. Go to www.ashleyoutdoors.com and download the .PDF catalog, check page one and two for close-ups.

That's Ashley's top of the line rear sight layout, and it's quite good.

As to the front: you're right, ONE of the Ruger fronts is good, and can be used with different replaceable blades. But it's not very common - the most common Blackhawk blades were soldered to the barrel and are not at all an easy swap. Just properly de-soldering them means you'll need to re-blue the barrel and now with that, and gunsmithing to swap sights, your total price is up over $250. Go to Gunbroker.com or similar and you'll realize just how many blue Blackhawks in .357 worth $200 - $300 there are floating around out there in good "working gun/potential project" shape.

What Bo at Ashley is looking for is a single solution usable across the whole Blackhawk/SuperBlackhawk product line, that doesn't require advanced gunsmithing.

This "barrel band" front mount fits the bill. It's still at the high end of where we want to go price-wise but the added value of a comp helps.

As a bonus, we can't do the adjustability at the rear without screwing up thumbing or doing something insanely complex :). That's why I'm proposing a fixed rear.

Unfortunately, since the Single Six uses a different barrel outside diameter, you'd need a different version for it. But I don't think the SingleSix market is right for this stuff regardless.
 
It occurs to me that there's a whole different advantage to the comp versions I didn't think about: they would allow a cheapo, homebrew barrel shortening without a gunsmith's intervension!

All the user would have to do is lop the barrel short and parallel, then use a Dremel tool with a ball grind bit to polish the muzzle edge of the rifling, then hand-polish with an emory cloth. And THEN just spray the white metal with any rust-inhibitor paint. Ugly? Yeppers again - but the barrel band/front mount/comp assembly will completely cover it, so a "pro job" isn't key.

And there's a lot of dirt-cheap 7.5" and 10" barrel critters nobody wants out there, that can be "recycled" cheap as hell this way!

You could also build an ejectorless 3" or whatever critter, again, dirt cheap.

OK, now we're getting sick :D.
 
Rear Sight

Hi Jim,
your posting forced me to register -I'm a SA thumber too and encountered the same "scars" on my thumb playing with my 'hawks. Your first picture with that plain filling of the rearsight... made me looking in Brownell's, maybe a sort of those Williams Rifle sights with double dovetails could be a step closer ...keeping the original frontsights, maybe less chunky than FA's rear sights?
Hopefully AO finds a "good" solution for aftermarket use!
 
How's this?
Use with the standard Vaquero rear. Height adjustments would be via different dovetailed standard fronts, windage via the dovetail.

Unbolt it all, you're back to SASS legal.

vaqalternate.jpg
 
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