Public Schools

J

jefnvk

New member
OK, I want to know what the problems with public schools are. I can't believe I am the only person to have gone to a decent public school. I don't remember any 'indoctrination'. Was there liberal views expressed? Sure. But there was also countering conservative views being displayed. Did I have some liberal teachers? Sure. Did I have as many, if not more conservative teachers? Absolutely.

I had a math teacher that had a CCW, and would talk guns with me. I had a biology teacher that was a big time hunter, and would talk about hunting and shooting with the whole class. And, as with society as a whole, I had some teachers that didn't like guns at all. But none of them failed kids for disagreeing with them, as I so often hear accused.

For all other rights issues, as in society, there were teachers that held all sorts of opinions. Some off the wall socialist ideals, some crazy conservatives ideals.

I had two friends that went to private, christian schools, before they had to come to a public school. Both of them were of the opinion that the education they recieved from the public school was vastly greater than anything they could have learned in the church school. I have a cousin who is homeschooled, and she is nowhere near what even a struggling student at her grade level would be in math or science, or pretty much anything but writing and art.

Being in college, at a conservative-leaning technical school, I have seen more 'indoctrinating' that I ever seen at a public school. Back in high school, I can think of only one teacher that could have been described as indoctrinating. At college, I have found that it is much more acceptable for teachers to teach views in classrooms.

In short, I think as with all things, we see one bad story about something, and throw everything of the same in with it and label it as bad. Just as one bad cop does not make all cops bad, one bad gun owner does not make all gun owners bad, one religious fanatic does not make all religious people bad, not all public schools are bad because some have done stupid things.

Do I doubt that bad public schools exist? Absolutely not. I have seen some pretty ratty schools. OTOH, I believe that these schools are in the minority.

Also, I think the argument 'you think that way because you were taught in a public school' gets you nowhere. Anytime anyone says that, I immediately think that they think they are superior to me, for some reason. Also, it sometimes seems to just be an excuse thrown around for incompetence. I have seen it today no less than 7 times, from various boards and threads. Things like a store requiring you to older to buy the ammo than the gun, and to describe students on both side of the flag burning issue.

I encourage comments from the other members that are in or have currently graduated school. I could be way wrong on this issue, and may have been to one of the few schools that aren't a 'gov't indoctrination center'. I could be wrong, and have it turn out to be a regional issue, or maybe even a urban/rural issue.

Opinions? Comments?
 
Other than the hoodlums and punks transported to my school from the inner city, my school was fine. The problems really flared once I left and the school became like something out of a movie. No problems with teachers and such other than which I created. I'm sure I was exposed to both conservative and liberal points of view, but at that age it didn't matter much.

Teachers are notoriously liberal. Most people who are part of a union share liberal points of view.

I know guys that work in factories who laugh at the attendance/payment policies the union forces the company to agree with. It's like getting paid to not work. Kind of like welfare. Their union leaders and such "indoctrinate" them with all this crap. They make the workers believe they're entitled to certain things that if you or I owned a business we'd fire our employees for doing/not doing the same things.

I'm sure I'll offend some union workers but so be it. Some unions are run as originally intended, to protect the welfare of the worker - which is a good thing. Now-a-days, the unions are just as much if not more of a problem, and the companies are being choked to death because of it. There needs to be a check'n'balance system but I'm not sure unions are efficient any longer in their current capacity.

Did you know the sheriffs department in Anne Arundel County Maryland is actually represented by the Teamsters Union! LMAO - talk about ironic!
 
No, there were only two of us that received excellent public educations. :rolleyes:

I went to a terrific high school with many programs, good teachers and almost zero off-topic discussion by teachers. The closest we had to that was an English teacher that tried to slip Christian interpretations into literature.


The funny thing is, I can't recall anyone on this board speaking from first hand experience about "liberal agendas" and the like. There seem to be some ticked-off parents, but none of the younger board members really articulate anything approaching the howling you hear from people who haven't been in school for 20 years.
 
Is Your School's Curriculum UN Approved?
by
Larry Pratt

Does it seem somewhat far out to ask such a question? Would that it were so.

The United States is working with the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) to federalize the curriculum of all schools in the United States. The new curriculum would be one that conforms to other countries as well as to UNESCO.

Actually, we do have federal curriculum standards for civics that encompass the teaching of history, geography, social studies and civics. Indeed, there are federal standards for other disciplines as well. The standards are referred to in Washington newspeak as guidelines.

The guidelines have resulted in a subsidized textbook ($10 a copy) entitled We, the People: The Citizen and the Constitution. If a school district does not use this textbook, whatever they teach from must teach to the national tests that reflect the federal "guidelines." The Department of Education is warning states that if they do not have enough students passing the federally approved tests, they will lose their federal subsidies.

The guidelines and We the People are so busy teaching multiculturalism and environmentalism that they have no time for teaching the 2nd Amendment (right to keep and bear arms), and the 10th Amendment (severely limiting legitimate activity of the federal government).

And now, it turns out, we are reporting on our progress at wiping out local and state control over curriculum to the UN! Here it is off the UNESCO web site on the USA country report page (http://www2.unesco.org/wef/countryreports/usa/rapport_2.html):

Most countries have national curricula.... In the United States, however, education is managed at the state and local levels.... Thus, the very concept of designing and agreeing on a set of learning outcomes across traditional jurisdictional lines is new, and in the minds of many, unsettling and undesirable.

The UN is saying that they are aware of the political sensitivity of a nationalized education system. This explains the following reference to not letting the American voter in on what "us elitists" are pulling off:

Officials of the U.S. Department of Education, as well as presidents Bush and Clinton, have applauded the emergence of [curriculum] standards at the state level and in the various subject areas, but they understand that any suggestion that these were being imposed by Washington would unleash a political backlash.

And for the pleasure of One World groupies is this gem from the same page: "Consciousness is thus growing among U.S. educators that... [e]ducational outcomes must now meet not only national but international standards."

I wonder what countries might be the model for setting UN educational standards? Perhaps some of the countries which have trained children to be compliant workers and citizens who do just what they are told. The mind thrills to consider the array of choice: from Cuba to Zimbabwe with Iran and Libya along the way.

Rep. Ron Paul is right. So are the other 73 Representatives who voted with Paul to get the UN out of the US and the US out of the UN.

Being run from Washington is bad enough, but being run by the UN is the end of the road to perdition.

http://www.gunowners.org/op0341.htm
 
curriculum

I teach US History and I have for many years. I know of no Federal standards that I must teach. If there are any I've never used them, nor have I felt pressure to. I have seen the We the People text but no one has ever mandated its use.
Under the No Child left Behind legislation each state is directed to write its own standards and they vary widely from state to state. Ours, in NM, are fairly decent as they are quite general and leave much up to the individual teacher.
No Child left behind however is an example of a Federal law that is poorly thought out and propably passed only because no one really read it but it had a clever name. This is clearly an intrusion into what iare the states' responsibilities.
I am neither a Conservative nor a Liberal but I want my students to see both perspectives.
 
You must have been lucky.

I was pulled out at 5th grade, they were doing earth day celebrations and then the gay thing. That was 7 years ago.

Also, my "social studies" teacher was a commie.
 
Handy, that is what I think mostly goes on. Just like how 5.56 is ineffective, the AK can't hit a barn if yo uwer inside it, and all the other internet commando stuff.

john - we had the earth day stuff. No big deal, we got a free tree to plant, I don't really see how that is bad. Same thing for teh Gay pride stuff, participation was voluntary, you didn't get anything special for doing it, you didn't get to leave class. As long as you aren't being forced, I don't think presenyting an opposing idea is really indoctrination.
 
So..

Presenting homosexuality to 4th graders who do not even understand it as being perfectly normal is not indocturnation?
 
Presenting homosexuality to 4th graders who do not even understand it as being perfectly normal is not indocturnation?
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And saying that it is wrong and disgraceful, is only indoctrination in the other direction.

I don't like it, but that doesn't mean that it is not acceptable.
 
They shouldn't even be teaching that at all... neither way. Sex and religion are the two things that the parents have the responsibility in teaching and passing on..

ESPECIALLY to 4th graders...
 
One of my High School Teachers gave me the best advice I ever had...

she told me.. "If I had your brain I would use it"

good advice..always engage brain when thinking.

Got brain? use it :D

as to public schools......who really controls them? parents or politicians?

I am as guilty as the next guy...I elect a school board official but have never gotten involved in seeing what actually goes on in schools.... or getting involved....
 
Jonathon,

You didn't understand about homosexuality, but you were able to recognize a communist party member? What a strange 5th grader you must have been. ;)


Obviously, I'm pretty brainwashed, though. I can't see the underlying evil of "Earth Day". Of course, my skin is in on the conspiracy - it keeps burning in the sun as if there was less ozone then when I was a kid. Stupid commies! :D
 
Yeah..

Odd story behind that..

Teacher wanted to "medicate" me. Said I was "uncontrollable" at times.. never mind I had outstanding grades..

I look back at it now instead of "dumb commie broad", femi-nazi sounds better.

Redneck earthday = tiring burning day :D

In all serriousness, I'm a conservation junkie. I pick up garbage when I see it, when I go shooting to a "common" place in the woods, I end up taking back as much as I have trash bags for.

When they present theories as facts though.. :barf:
 
To me, the whole Gays are people, too thing, is no different that the whole Blacks are people too, of the 60's, and Women are people, too of the 20's and Slaves are people, too of the 1800's. One day I'm gonna be telling my grandkids, yes, there was one time when gay bashing was appropriate, but thankfully it isn't now.

And, keeping that argument out of schools, is still nothing other than indoctrination in the other direction.
 
Jonathon said :
"Sex and religion are the two things that the parents have the responsibility in teaching and passing on.."

Amen, brother. People can shriek on and on about indoctrination in schools but that's what the parents demand. There's nothing that goes on in the public schools which parents can't change or haven't allowed/insisted should happen. Parents abdicate responsibility for raising their children and teaching them morals just like people abdicate responsibility for protecting themselves, investing in their own retirements, voting... it's just one more item on the list.
I've taught for 11 years in public schools. The kids know I shoot and have a CCW.
 
AIDS is still growing in the US. I think sex-ed is a public health matter, not a "moral" subject.

I know of no public school that teaches religion, but I've heard of several that try to bring religion into the classroom.
 
They shouldn't even be teaching that at all... neither way. Sex and religion are the two things that the parents have the responsibility in teaching and passing on..
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Public schools must attempt to educate kids who are the lowest common denominator. If you don't teach the lowest common denominator in our public schools about sex and how to avoid becoming pregnant, it won't be long before we're as overcrowded as Calcutta!! Many of their parents haven't yet figured it out, so it's a stretch to think they're going to get sound advice at home.
 
The question this seem to be boiling down to is "what is the purpose of the public school system?" Is it to teach students how to read and write, do math, etc, or is it to teach students how to live. If it is supposed to teach just academics, then subjects such as sex education, gay rights, and other controversial topics should stay out completely. If it is supposed to teach students how to live, then these should be included.

I think sex-ed is a public health matter, not a "moral" subject.
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It is most certainly a moral issue.

One day I'm gonna be telling my grandkids, yes, there was one time when gay bashing was appropriate, but thankfully it isn't now.
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Gay bashing is always wrong. That doesn't mean that I have to believe that there is nothing wrong with being gay, or that I cannot voice my views if they go against the current PC outlook on the matter.
 
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